2 nl50 hands Is there value in river shoves here?
 

In the Oct. chat thread I lamented that people don't just hand me stacks like they do for some of the regulars here. The response was "Maybe you're not aggressive enough." Well, I got to thinking...maybe I'm not. The final bet is the big bet, and maybe I should be betting more at the end -- or betting at all!

What do you think of these three situations? What should I do on the river here?


PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (8 handed) Poker Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Hero ($60.45)
SB ($45)
BB ($46.25)
UTG ($19.75)
UTG+1 ($112.30)
MP1 ($9.25)
MP2 ($124.15)
CO ($50.50)

Preflop: Hero is Button with T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls $0.50, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP2 calls $0.50, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, Hero calls $0.50, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, BB checks.

Flop: ($2.25) 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
BB checks, UTG+1 checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP2 bets $1</font>, Hero calls $1, <font color="#CC3333">BB raises to $4</font>, UTG+1 folds, MP2 calls $3, Hero calls $3.

Turn: ($14.25) A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets $8</font>, MP2 calls $8, Hero calls $8.

River: ($38.25) 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets $15</font>, MP2 calls $15, Hero?


PokerStars Pot-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (9 handed) Poker Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

BB ($18.50)
Hero ($40.05)
UTG+1 ($32.70)
MP1 ($36.95)
MP2 ($30.70)
MP3 ($6.95)
CO ($22.40)
Button ($47.25)
SB ($11.40)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
<font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $1.5</font>, UTG+1 calls $1.50, MP1 calls $1.50, <font color="#666666">6 folds</font>.

Flop: ($5.25) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $3.5</font>, UTG+1 calls $3.50, MP1 folds.

Turn: ($12.25) T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $11.65</font>, UTG+1 calls $11.65.

River: ($35.55) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero?

PokerStars Pot-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (9 handed) Poker Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

SB ($9)
BB ($49.65)
UTG ($94.65)
UTG+1 ($51.20)
MP1 ($63.20)
MP2 ($30.30)
MP3 ($50.70)
CO ($51.85)
Hero ($55.80)

Preflop: Hero is Button with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, MP3 calls $0.50, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $2</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, BB calls $1.50, MP3 folds.

Flop: ($4.75) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $3</font>, BB calls $3.

Turn: ($10.75) K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $7</font>, BB calls $7.

River: ($24.75) A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets $8</font>, Hero ?

Re: 2 nl50 hands Is there value in river shoves here?
 

In hand 1 I raise the flop and try to get arrrrr in. You have 2 overs and a gutshot/flushdraw. After getting c/r'ed I just call. Turn is fine. Push the river to his &lt;1/2 pot bet. I also raise this hand to $3 preflop about 99.9% of the time.

In the second hand this guy has $16 left in a $35 pot in which you have no reason to think he has you beat. Just push push push.

In hand 3 I just call the river. He's making a blocking bet and I doubt he's giving you any action unless he has the Q or has you beat.

In hands 2 and 3 I think your c-bets are too small.

Re: 2 nl50 hands Is there value in river shoves here?
 

I shove in hands 1 and 2.

Hand 3, minraise river!

Re: 2 nl50 hands Is there value in river shoves here?
 

Hand 2 the 8 is a good card for us and I would say good spot to shove.

Hand 3 I don't see much of a point in shoving, but with flush I'm shoving for sure.

Hand 1 is the trickiest. I'm not sure how often anyone who doesn't have you beat is calling. I guess lower flushes are out there. Plus the pot is inflated and donks love to convince themselves they have "pot odds." I could see a case for shoving, but its pretty thin IMO. I doubt i'd do it, but vbetting is something I need to improve too.

Re: 2 nl50 hands Is there value in river shoves here?
 

Hand 1 is an easy shove, BB has about 20 bucks left and I doubt MP2 is flatting a river bet with anything you lose to.

Hand 2 is another shove. Any 2 pair he had was counterfeited and unless he hit a gutshot or set with 99, TT you are good.

Hand 3 I just call maybe its too weak but a shove is useless.