Two Plus Two Newer Archives

Two Plus Two Newer Archives (http://archives1.twoplustwo.com/index.php)

- Small Stakes Shorthanded (http://archives1.twoplustwo.com/forumdisplay.php?f=24)

- - Move up??? (http://archives1.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=507568)

[ QUOTE ]
You´re good enough to move up Xerxes.At ongame there is no big difference between 3/6 and 10/20 IMO.
Against me you have shown a leak though.You fold too easily to raises.I don´t know if it´s my tight stats that has fooled you.But I rarely bluff so much as I have done against you.But otherwise you are very solid.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not sure about this since my screenname on Ongame has no xerxes in it. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

You probably just need to ratio it out to see which one is more profitable over time. You compare your BB/100 in 6 max to FR adjusting for the amount of hand plays and see which one shows to be more profitable.

This is really frustrating because most of the players I played against on different sites say I'm solid and should move up but the results aren't there. I have had a 600BB downswing recently and am down to 1/2 to avoid tilt and gain back confidence. I sure have leaks in my game and I'm working on them but I seem to go on big swings very often even though I don't play that LAG (28/20).

[ QUOTE ]
This is really frustrating because most of the players I played against on different sites say I'm solid and should move up but the results aren't there. I have had a 600BB downswing recently and am down to 1/2 to avoid tilt and gain back confidence. I sure have leaks in my game and I'm working on them but I seem to go on big swings very often even though I don't play that LAG (28/20).

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not saying you didn't have leaks back then, most of us do. All I'm saying is that if you beat a level for 1BB/100 for as many hands as you have and you have a 1500 BB bankroll for the next level there's no question about it, you should move up. As Oink said your goal here should be to get out of the rake hell at small stakes as quickly as possible. When you first move up be sure to exercise very good table/seat selection, you'll be put in way way fewer tough spots this way and will help your confidence as well as your winrate. Also have someone go over your hands to see if they can find obvious leaks, either a coach or someone in the hand swaps.

600bb downswing.lol.i got 250bb this month and i can say,i hate loosing

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I recently read (in this forum I think) that you can expect win rates at shorthanded games to be higher than win rates at fr games, is this true?
thanks.

[/ QUOTE ]
The theory goes that short handed = you need to play more hands = more decisions = more room for mistakes for the bad players.

Also, when you're short you get to play more hands vs donks (easier to isolate).

[/ QUOTE ]

Much of that is offset by the fact that you have to pay blinds more frequently correct? So in the end, with all other things being equal, is the winrate at sh games higher than or equal to that of a fr game?
thanks.

[/ QUOTE ]

The other players pay the blinds more often too. A stronger player has more of an edge SH and I dont its close.

[ QUOTE ]
The other players pay the blinds more often too. A stronger player has more of an edge SH and I dont its close.

[/ QUOTE ]
I agree. SH has a lot more difficult decisions and you can't just nut peddle for a decent win-rate like in FR.

[ QUOTE ]

I'm not sure about this since my screenname on Ongame has no xerxes in it. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

No but if I´m right your screename is starting with a D.
Mine is starting with Fe.
It is nothing wrong with your game.You should bet/fold a little less though.You´re a bit too aggressive sometimes.
But we all have some leaks.I have tons of them but I am still able to beat the games easilyy and that despite having huge downswings.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

I'm not sure about this since my screenname on Ongame has no xerxes in it. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

No but if I´m right your screename is starting with a D.
Mine is starting with Fe.
It is nothing wrong with your game.You should bet/fold a little less though.You´re a bit too aggressive sometimes.
But we all have some leaks.I have tons of them but I am still able to beat the games easilyy and that despite having huge downswings.

[/ QUOTE ]

Haha I see I think we talekd about this awhile back but I wasn't sure about your 2+2 screen name. Yeah I see what you are talking about my agression factor is high I probably raise too much especially on the flop. How come you haven't moved up yet??? If I rememebr correctly you were beating 3/6 for around 2/100 last time we talked.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

I'm not sure about this since my screenname on Ongame has no xerxes in it. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

No but if I´m right your screename is starting with a D.
Mine is starting with Fe.
It is nothing wrong with your game.You should bet/fold a little less though.You´re a bit too aggressive sometimes.
But we all have some leaks.I have tons of them but I am still able to beat the games easilyy and that despite having huge downswings.

[/ QUOTE ]

Haha I see I think we talekd about this awhile back but I wasn't sure about your 2+2 screen name. Yeah I see what you are talking about my agression factor is high I probably raise too much especially on the flop. How come you haven't moved up yet??? If I rememebr correctly you were beating 3/6 for around 2/100 last time we talked.

[/ QUOTE ]

I´ve been playing some 5/10 since the beginning of 2007.But I usually play more 3/6 tables.Since I´m 3 or 4-tabling I almost never play more than one or two 5/10 tables at a time. I also devote half of my time for playing NL 0.5/1 and 1/2 which is much more profitable and without the downswings.

The downswings have been the major reason for not playing higher. I have a personal goal of making 150 000 dollars before 2010 (including rakeback)and I would hate having a 500 BB downswing at higher stakes (without being sure that I can beat that level) since it would make me have to fight longer for my goal.Once I have earned those 150 000 dollars I will apply normal bankroll management and play whatever level I have 600BB for.I really long for that day.But discipline is my middle name.
But for anyone who does not have any special goals I would recommend moving up as quickly as possible because of the rake.But one must not forget that one can earn more than enough money by multitabling 3/6.

The 2BB/100 you´re talking about turned out to not be my true winrate sadly enough.If I recall right that was after my first 100K 3/6.Now my winrate has stabilized around 1.5 BB/100 after 250K.
At 5/10 I don´t have more than 30K hands and it is around 0.7 BB/100. But for what I can see the player standard is only marginally better at 5/10. I think my lower winrate at 5/10 is due to variance and the fact that I´m playing a little bit scared.
But despite my winrate I have had huge downswings. I had one of +600 BB in the beginning of this year and a couple of 300:s also.It doesn´t matter because you always bounce back and the upswings are even more wild.You can´t let the downswings get to you.If you´re 1BB/100 during 80K just keep reminding you that it is almost statistically proved that you´re a winner and that is all you have to know.

I see that you have played a few 5/10 hands too (I had 15 of them in my database).I hope you don´t mind that I show a hand.Because I think it shows that your aggression costed you some bets.
Most 2+2:ers probably thinks that I played it poorly also but my reputation is down at the bottom anyway after my "play passively preflop OOP posts".So I don´t mind.

But doing a couple of these highly aggressive plays must add a lot of variance to your game and can be a reason to why you´re suffering some times.

Results in white

Poker Room skin
Limit Holdem Ring game
Limit: $5/$10
5 players
Converter
Pre-flop: (5 players) Hero is BB with A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
2 folds, Button raises, SB folds, Hero calls.
Flop: 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (4.5SB, 2 players)
Hero checks, Button bets, Hero raises, Button calls.
Turn: J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (4.25BB, 2 players)
Hero bets, Button raises, Hero calls.
River: 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (8.25BB, 2 players)
Hero checks, Button bets, Hero calls.
Results:
Final pot: 10.25BB
Button shows KC 6C 
Hero shows AH JD