Learning java with no programming language experience, where to start?
 

I thought EDF might be a good place to ask this question, it seems we have a lot of bright individuals here who could give me some good advice.

My day job would be greatly enhanced if I could learn java to code some apps to assist me. Trouble is, I suck at programming. I've never really programmed apart from some basic HTML stuff for some random sites, and some qbasic I did in school many eons ago. Is there any hope for me as a coder? What should I guy like me do to earn this new skill?

Re: Learning java with no programming language experience, where to st
 

Arturius,

What types of apps are you talking about?

If you really need java and don't have any programming experience, I think either taking a class or getting some books will be required. O'Reilly is my favorite tech publisher, looks like they have a number of good options. Here are a couple:

http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/hfjava2/ - Head First Java
http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/learnjava3/ - Learning Java

O'Reilly books are generally geared towards a more technical audience, though Head First Java looks more like a general interest publication.

I'm sure there's a Java for Dummies book out there that might also be helpful.

If what you really need is to build simple web apps, then you might not need a full programming language and only need to learn JavaScript or PHP or some other scripting language. These are much, much easier to learn and I'm sure you could find web resources that would be sufficient to help you learn those.

Re: Learning java with no programming language experience, where to st
 

Read some beginner stuff and look over tutorials. From there you should be able to get a grasp of what the language is about and start programming.

Once you get the basics down everything else you can pretty much learn on the fly.

Of course if you're aiming at making some complex programs you definitely want to plan everything out as much as you can. So, perhaps what I just said wouldn't apply to the apps you're trying to make.

Re: Learning java with no programming language experience, where to st
 

Yeah, like ED said, don't learn Java if you don't have to. PHP, for instance, is much easier in my experience. I also hear that Ruby on Rails is really easy, but I haven't used it for anything or even looked into it myself.

Maybe you could give us an idea what kind of apps you want to create and we could tell you what to learn?

Re: Learning java with no programming language experience, where to st
 

Don't worry, I'm not making complex programs. The software I use has the option to code using a java based language to create apps you can run within the program.

I don't need to be running projects, just know the rules, the lingo, and common pitfalls while coding.

Re: Learning java with no programming language experience, where to st
 

The most important thing to learn when learning Java is the general concepts of Object-Oriented programming. If you don't learn this type of stuff NOW, you will develop bad habits that will take a ton of work and years to overcome.

Two major things to keep in mind (in addition to the above stuff)

1) DON'T BE AFRAID TO MAKE A NEW CLASS IF YOU THINK IT MIGHT BE A GOOD IDEA. I cannot stress this enough. There's a general 'fear' of making new classes, making more files etc. and instead try to do everything in your main class. DON'T LET THIS BE YOU.

This will make more sense after you read:

2) http://java.sun.com/docs/books/tutorial/java/concepts/

Re: Learning java with no programming language experience, where to st
 

i took a class in college.. seems to me you could buy any decent looking beginners book and be fine just reading that and googling any problems you have

Re: Learning java with no programming language experience, where to st
 

[ QUOTE ]
Trouble is, I suck at programming. ... Is there any hope for me as a coder?

[/ QUOTE ]

Programming because you're taking a class and programming because it will make your life easier are two very different things. I also thought I sucked at programming (failed a bunch of courses in college in fact), but then at my job I got transferred into a unit where I had to write COBOL (beat [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]) programs, and I managed quite OK. You'll do fine. Just don't try to do way more than you must, if that makes sense.

Re: Learning java with no programming language experience, where to st
 

A non-java specific book I would really highly recommend to any programmer, particulary new programmers is Code Complete by Steve McConnell. This is really an excellent book about program design and how to write readable maintainable programs.

Re: Learning java with no programming language experience, where to st
 

[ QUOTE ]
My day job would be greatly enhanced if I could learn java to code some apps to assist me. Trouble is, I suck at programming. I've never really programmed apart from some basic HTML stuff for some random sites, and some qbasic I did in school many eons ago. Is there any hope for me as a coder? What should I guy like me do to earn this new skill?

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you set on Java?

I would recommend Python as a first language:

Python http://www.python.org/

or also another language similar to Python:

Ruby

Anytime I need to write a program to assist something I'm working on, I will generally use Python. Python and Ruby were designed with humans in mind rather than machine resources. I have programmed little in Ruby so can't make recommendations on resources. As for Python, there are extensive introductory materials / free online books at Python.org.

There you will find the following great and generally free resources:

BeginnersGuide/NonProgrammers Python Resources

I would also recommend considering Scheme (a dialect of Lisp). MIT uses Scheme in its introductory courses. Take a look at the MIT OpenCourseware for those with no or little programming experience. Scheme is not an object-oriented programming language. For that reason, learning Python would be more portable to other object-oriented languages.

As for Java, I don't believe I ever have had a book on Java. I previously knew how to program in C++. There are extensive free documentation and introductory materials on the web (on Sun's website). Also, programming in Java or any other language is much easier with a good development environment. For Java, I would recommend checking out the free open-source Eclipse Development Platform.

As for Python, I have use the Wing IDE.