4/180 multiway multistreet mess
 

First hand of the tournament.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t20 (9 handed) pokerhand.org hand converter

Button (t1500)
SB (t1500)
BB (t1500)
UTG (t1500)
UTG+1 (t1500)
MP1 (t1500)
MP2 (t1500)
MP3 (t1500)
Hero (t1500)

Preflop: Hero is CO with 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls t20, UTG+1 calls t20, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, MP3 calls t20, Hero calls t20, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, BB checks.

Flop: (t110) 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets t100</font>, UTG+1 folds, MP3 calls t100, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to t555</font>, BB folds, UTG calls t455, MP3 calls t455.

Turn: (t1775) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">UTG bets t180</font>, MP3 calls t180, Hero calls t180.

River doesn't really matter.

What do you guys think about my flop and turn play? Both are questionable, of course, and I'm not sure at all what the right play is each time.

Re: 4/180 multiway multistreet mess
 

I'd probably just fold because I can pretty much guarantee I'm not gonna have the stomach for the craziness that will come on later streets. If I decided I just couldn't fold, calling and reassessing on the turn is the next option. If you just have to raise, then you have to shove, this raise isn't going to accomplish anything.

Re: 4/180 multiway multistreet mess
 

Just because the turn brought a weird card and a weird bet doesn't mean that'd always happen, though. I mean, I think I got good value on the flop, and folded out a lot of overcards.

I'm not saying it's def right, though.

Re: 4/180 multiway multistreet mess
 

raise pre...flop raise is a little hefty but okay...turn is fine...now spike your one outer and brag

Re: 4/180 multiway multistreet mess
 

I think you need to raise preflop or play this for set value (or at least more carefully than you did)

Also, Im not sure that UTG is leading out with an almost pot size bet into a large field with a hand that you want to tangle with at this point.

Re: 4/180 multiway multistreet mess
 

[ QUOTE ]
raise pre...flop raise is a little hefty but okay...turn is fine...now spike your one outer and brag

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't know about raising this pre, I mean this is a 4/180 the chances of us folding out too many hands especially the UTG limpers is very small. I would probably just call, and play for set value. As for the turn raise, I think its a little big as well, something like 3-3.5x is usually good enough. Turn call is fine, you are getting very good odds with a hand I think is still best but not good enough to raise. I am guessing you lost the hand, what did villian have?

Re: 4/180 multiway multistreet mess
 

For those advocating playing for set value, what is
your cutoff point for playing hand value? (e.g. 99, TT)?

Since we all know 14 or 15 people are calling, what should
your "raise more pf" be? Why are we raising any pairs
&gt;TT?

-ZEN

Re: 4/180 multiway multistreet mess
 

I am rasing JJ+ AQs+

Re: 4/180 multiway multistreet mess
 

Preflop is fine, I think I just fold flop because RIO are huge &amp; this hands going to be impossible to play well. There aren't many hands UTG can limp with &amp; lead this flop that you're ahead.
I'm guessing that because the river play doesn't matter it was the 7h, so nice line :-) Turn's fine, pot odds good enough &amp; not a huge amount of point in semibluff shove because noone folds a better hand

Re: 4/180 multiway multistreet mess
 

Results: http://www.pokerhand.org/?1620478

See? the river is boring.

A preflop raise is fine, imo, but you have to fire two more barrels sometimes to finally pick it up. I think playing for setvalue is both lower variance and more +EV.