Basic General Question Re # of outs after flop
 

Im a fairly aggressive post-flop player (50/100 nl ring games), and I seem to have a hang-up w/ post flop play where I'm all or nothing, ie: I'm committed to seeing it down to the river or I'm giving up w/ the slightest sign of strength from my opponents, I dont know if thats a common struggle for others but it is for me. ANYWAY one of my hang-ups is to count outs twice over and forget the pot odds and just say "If I commit to this hand I'll definately see it twice over so I'm getting the right odds to call this 4-outer since I'm really getting 8 outs", but thats retarded right?? I mean one has to look at pot vs implied odds and the turn and river should affect your decisions and you should adjust your play after each card right? But I think there's some advantage to being aggressive after the flop even when it's not the correct mathmatical play, but what do I know? Thanks for any insight.

Re: Basic General Question Re # of outs after flop
 

i'm not completely sure on what you're trying to say

yes, aggression is a key part of our arsenal as tags, and can win us some pots that wouldn't be won otherwise. however, against certain opponents aggression won't get us anywhere (calling stations, really passive guys, lags, etc)

if you're ignoring odds, both pot, implied, etc, after the flop, then yes that could be a big leak.

maybe post some hands where you had a tough decision?

Re: Basic General Question Re # of outs after flop
 

Basicaly I think I'm asking if its ok to call a bet or to lead out and bluff after the flop, based on the odds that you'll see the turn AND river, even if you should fold on the turn if the other player bets an amount that gives you incorrect odds to call, but in my case I'm usually betting so aggressive or overbetting that any other option for me is all-in on the turn or if a re-raise on the flop. Sorry if i'm not getting directly to the point i'm new at this. What does "tags" mean anyway? Thanks

Re: Basic General Question Re # of outs after flop
 

[ QUOTE ]
Basicaly I think I'm asking if its ok to call a bet or to lead out and bluff after the flop, based on the odds that you'll see the turn AND river, even if you should fold on the turn if the other player bets an amount that gives you incorrect odds to call...

What does "tags" mean anyway?

[/ QUOTE ]

No, it's not correct. Odds versus pot odds should be calculated, and decisions made, street by street. The commonest exception is if the action is ended (e.g. an all in in a head-up pot): then you can consider your odds against hitting your hand by the river. So your gutshot really is only 10.8 to 1 against. But you should be adding in implied pot odds, the average additional amount you expect to win from your opponent if you hit the turn. Matthew Hilger's Internet Texas Hold'em has the best explanation of outs, odds, pot odds, and implied pot odds that I've seen.

TAG means a tight aggressive player. Most winning players are TAGs.