limit take more skill
 

I've been told by a well known friend that limit holdem takes more skill because hand selection is more fundamentally at the forefront. What are your thoughtsw on this and how would you use it to your advantage if you were playing a no limt type game? I believe fundamentally the two are quite different if not for the abovementioned reason alone.

Jake

Re: limit take more skill
 

I am wondering what you mean by 'hand selection'. I don't really think limit would be more difficult for this reason. I think hand selection might be more complex and difficult in the NL version of the game.

I agree that limit hold 'em would be a more difficult game to play and succeed at for those people who understand poker. I think this would mainly be because a player is unable to control the size of his bets. I think that, in LHE, a player must use a tremendous amout of skill to decide the correct course of action throughout each hand.

I think it would be considerably more difficult to play LHE correctly than it would be to play NLHE correctly.

Re: limit take more skill
 

In NL it's alright to miss a bet, as you can just bet it the next round. With limit you must decide on the optimal line (when ahead, or when behind) basically starting from the flop.

For example, on he flop I'm already deciding what I'm going to do against this specific player. Am I going to just call his flop bet, call his turn bet and raise the river? Or am I going to simply raise his flop bet and go from there? If I'm going to bet the turn and river myself anyway, I have to raise the flop or I'm missing a SB, etc.

Altough some of these concepts apply to NL as well. For example, when OOP it's pointless to c/c the flop if you know you're going to lead the turn. Either bet, or c/r, there's no point in the call when you know you'll bet the next round.

Re: limit take more skill
 

In the simplest possible terms, they are two different games which share the same basic format. Not unlike the differences between American English and the Queen's English--an American can get around alright in London and (eventually) get his point across to a local, but the Londoner has a distinct advantage linguistically.

I think the point you're trying to get at with "hand selection" lies in preflop play vs. implied odds. In limit you can't coldcall raises with as many hands because your implied odds, should you hit, are so much lower. The flip side is that in no limit you can't raise (or reraise) as freely, because you always have to worry about someone coming back over the top for all your (or their) chips.

When I do play NL (which is rarely, and mostly just in tournaments), I honestly don't think I get any advantage at all from my limit play. In the games I'm playing I often have an edge against my opponents simply because I understand the general principles of poker and pot odds, but my lack of NL experience hurts me, and I sometimes have to struggle to break free of my LHE mindset. On the other hand, what NL experience I do have has probably helped my limit game, in making me more comfortable with playing crappy starting hands in blind steal/short-handed situations.

Re: limit take more skill
 

I think a great NL player has a massive edge over a good NL player while a great limit player only has a small edge over most solid limit players. There are more variables in NL so I think it requires more skill (psychology, heart etc).

Re: limit take more skill
 

Theoretically NL should be more difficult because there are more options, choices, and difficult decisions.

However, if you are playing in a limit game with mostly sound players, you will have a harder time winning money than in a NL game with crappy players.

Since NL is much hardly to master, I would suspect many low limit NL games seem "softer" than limit games because of the lineups.

-J

Re: limit take more skill
 

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I think a great NL player has a massive edge over a good NL player while a great limit player only has a small edge over most solid limit players. There are more variables in NL so I think it requires more skill (psychology, heart etc).

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Limit is tactics. NL is strategy. Limit is lots of little decisions pushing small edges. NL is big decisions for stacks. Different games, but both are difficult to master.

I think the difference in skill level between the average players and the expert is greater in NL, too.

Re: limit take more skill
 

Contrary to what fans of their favorite game often say...
NL isn't all about pushing it all-in and getting people off hands.
Limit isn't about chasing and praying with crap cards.

Both require different skills. NL, I believe, requires more skill because of the ability to manipulate the pot and offer odds. Your ability to do that in limit is much less.

Deep-stacked pot-limit would be the most-skillful game.

Re: limit take more skill
 

[ QUOTE ]
Deep-stacked pot-limit would be the most-skillful game.

[/ QUOTE ]
QFT

Re: limit take more skill
 

Why deep stack pot limit and not deep stack no limit ?