thin
 

10/20 playing 8 handed.

a loose passive player open limps in the hijack. i raise to isolate with A5s OTB. the blinds fold and he calls.

flop is Ks5d4d. He checks, I bet, he calls quickly.

Turn Th. he c/c

River Kc. He checks I bet for value...

Re: thin
 

If it's thin I think it may be because we're not getting called very often. I thin we're almost always ahead here, no?

Re: thin
 

nh

Re: thin
 

no, you get called by a better hand more than you get called by a worse hand.

Re: thin
 

[ QUOTE ]
no, you get called by a better hand more than you get called by a worse hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree with the big green elephant here. Do you have any read on the guy? Any idea of his open limp range? I think you're going to see the middling pocket pairs a lot here, as the 4s and 5s have to be discounted in his opening range, right? I check this behind.

Re: thin
 

does he pay off with Ahigh?

would he ever fold A5?

how does he play 88 and 99 pf?

Re: thin
 

[ QUOTE ]
does he pay off with Ahigh?

would he ever fold A5?

how does he play 88 and 99 pf?

[/ QUOTE ]

The answers I was assuming for these questions are:

No Never.
No Never.
Limps them cause he's loose passive.

With those answers, I think a bet makes no sense. If the answers were different, then we'd have to talk a bit more about it.

Re: thin
 

[ QUOTE ]
He checks, I bet for value...

[/ QUOTE ]

I think that there is no value to this bet.

Re: thin
 

i guess the point here is that i need a very specific read to make this bet.

wasnt this a pretty clear VB in SSHE? i dont have it with me so i forget the page...anyone have a copy on hand?

Re: thin
 

[ QUOTE ]
i guess the point here is that i need a very specific read to make this bet.

wasnt this a pretty clear VB in SSHE? i dont have it with me so i forget the page...anyone have a copy on hand?

[/ QUOTE ]

the crux of the decision is whether or not he'll call with Ahigh and what % of the time(busted diamond draw, etc.)?

also, what weaker 5s might be in his range? would he play J5 or something?

this is a question about his payoff tendencies, how he might view you(LOTS of opponents make it a habit to pay me off with Ahigh because of my bluff/semibluff frequency) and what his LP openlimp range consists of.

i don't think anyone can accurately comment on the short term value of this play without having a pretty good handle on these factors. i will say this, a bet like this can be a slight loser immediately but pay dividends(and thus def. be worth it) in the future. people see you valuebetting bottom pair/middle pair and they start paying off more often with hands that beat bottom pair and middle pair. this adds value to your toppair hands and assuming you adjust for the shift in their tendencies you might come out ahead in the grand scheme of things.