QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

No HH but I just went all in on th first hand UTG with QQ. I figure I get called enough by idiots with bad hands to make it +EV so early on. Besides, I don't want to make a standard raise and get called by half the table. Even if it's 5-6x the BB, it tends to get a lot of callers early. I also think people will lower their calling requirements because they don't know how I play. Is this a bad play?

This was the first time I tried it, I got called by 22 - exactly what I wanted. He won though.

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

you give up a lot of equity by open shoving.

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

You will usually get 1-2 callers, and 0 callers more often than 4 callers, if you raise to 3 times the bb.

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

This is bad, just make a standard raise and get paid off by the idiots.

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

If I raise to 60-80 with 1500 stacks, I can get called by anything (especially in a $16). I won't have much of an idea if a flop is good or bad. An A or K on flop is dangerous. I just don't think I can get a lot of money in ahead with this hand. Winning a small pot doesn't really help me at this point.

I would only consider this UTG and I don't think it's a bad of a play, but I guess I'm wrong

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

Dude, you accomplish two things by making a good (60-80) sized raise, rather than a retarded one (1500):

a) You are much more likely to stack hands that will make weak overpairs or top pairs, such as A9/88/QJ etc

b) You won't have to go broke against KK+

It's really really really clear-cut.

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

[ QUOTE ]
Dude, you accomplish two things by making a good (60-80) sized raise, rather than a retarded one (1500):

a) You are much more likely to stack hands that will make weak overpairs or top pairs, such as A9/88/QJ etc

b) You won't have to go broke against KK+

It's really really really clear-cut.

[/ QUOTE ]

The chances of me losing to KK or AA are pretty low. The chances of me getting called by JJ/TT/99/AQ/AJ off set that. There's a possibility I get called by a lower pp as I did in this case. The chances of me getting my whole stack in ahead of the types of hands you listed are low and winning a small pot just doesn't help me that much. But I see your point too, I won't argue anymore, don't need to be an ass about it though

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

Just because someone was even worse than you this hand, and called with deuces, doesn't mean you were right.
You are more likely to stack these players by playing well.
Also, winning small pots does help.

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

[ QUOTE ]
Just because someone was even worse than you this hand, and called with deuces, doesn't mean you were right.
You are more likely to stack these players by playing well.
Also, winning small pots does help.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok

Poker Stars, $15 + $1 NL Hold'em Tournament, 25/50 Blinds, 9 Players
LeggoPoker.com - Hand History Converter

MP1: 1,610
MP2: 1,870
CO: 1,785
BTN: 485
SB: 1,305
BB: 1,640
Hero (UTG): 1,465
UTG+1: 1,890
UTG+2: 1,450

Pre-Flop: (75) Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (UTG)
<font color="red">Hero raises to 200</font>, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 calls 200, 5 folds, <font color="red">BB raises to 350</font>, Hero calls 150, UTG+2 calls 150

Flop: (1,075) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 Players)
<font color="red">BB bets 450</font>, Hero folds, <font color="red">UTG+2 raises to 1,100 and is All-In</font>, BB calls 650

Turn: (3,275) A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players - 1 is All-In)

River: (3,275) 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players - 1 is All-In)

Results: 3,275 Pot
BB showed J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (a full house, Jacks full of Deuces) and WON 3,275 (+1,825 NET)
UTG+2 showed Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (a pair of Deuces) and LOST (-1,450 NET)

Better?

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Just because someone was even worse than you this hand, and called with deuces, doesn't mean you were right.
You are more likely to stack these players by playing well.
Also, winning small pots does help.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok

Poker Stars, $15 + $1 NL Hold'em Tournament, 25/50 Blinds, 9 Players
LeggoPoker.com - Hand History Converter

MP1: 1,610
MP2: 1,870
CO: 1,785
BTN: 485
SB: 1,305
BB: 1,640
Hero (UTG): 1,465
UTG+1: 1,890
UTG+2: 1,450

Pre-Flop: (75) Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (UTG)
<font color="red">Hero raises to 200</font>, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 calls 200, 5 folds, <font color="red">BB raises to 350</font>, Hero calls 150, UTG+2 calls 150

Flop: (1,075) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 Players)
<font color="red">BB bets 450</font>, Hero folds, <font color="red">UTG+2 raises to 1,100 and is All-In</font>, BB calls 650

Turn: (3,275) A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players - 1 is All-In)

River: (3,275) 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players - 1 is All-In)

Results: 3,275 Pot
BB showed J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (a full house, Jacks full of Deuces) and WON 3,275 (+1,825 NET)
UTG+2 showed Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (a pair of Deuces) and LOST (-1,450 NET)

Better?

[/ QUOTE ]

Not really, you should be shoving over his 3bet preflop and you should be all in on this flop. By saving yourself this hand you have probably missed out on a lot of money doing this in other hands.

BTW I currently am at the $16s and I can assure you that a standard raise to 80 is the best play with QQ. It works.

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

Are you saying JJ wouldn't flop a set if you had open pushed before the flop?
Also, please push when the action gets back to you.
Also, how would you get value from Q9s if you had open pushed?

Also, are we actually discussing this?

You are playing unbelievably bad and there really isn't two ways to look at this.

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

Oh wtf, didn't even look at the flop play.
You folded? lol.

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

[ QUOTE ]
Are you saying JJ wouldn't flop a set if you had open pushed before the flop?
Also, please push when the action gets back to you.
Also, how would you get value from Q9s if you had open pushed?

Also, are we actually discussing this?

You are playing unbelievably bad and there really isn't two ways to look at this.

[/ QUOTE ]

- no...
- noted
- I said I would only consider that play (with that logic) on the first hand with such insignificant blinds
- I guess
- Ok so should I continue playing badly then or should ask someone like you who I can learn something from?

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

[ QUOTE ]
Oh wtf, didn't even look at the flop play.
You folded? lol.

[/ QUOTE ]

What hand does he re raise with there (other than AK) that doesn't have me beat?

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

Seriously, the way you played QQ pre/post flop...just open shove JJ+ UTG every time. [img]/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

lol

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

[ QUOTE ]
Seriously, the way you played QQ pre/post flop...just open shove JJ+ UTG every time. [img]/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

I kinda like OPs first play with QQ....it looks totally insane, and at THIS level, will get called by lots and lots of hands besides AA, KK, and AK.

People are totally retarded at this limit and a standard raise will not drive anybody out holding AXs or KXs. Even if you standard raise and a guy does have AA or KK, I'm very hard pressed to throw my hand away unless it's a raise-reraise-reraise situation.

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

[ QUOTE ]

People are totally retarded at this limit and a standard raise will not drive anybody out holding AXs or KXs. Even i

[/ QUOTE ]

This is so false scholars are working on a new word for it.

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

[ QUOTE ]
People are totally retarded at this limit and a standard raise will not drive anybody out holding AXs or KXs. Even if you standard raise and a guy does have AA or KK, I'm very hard pressed to throw my hand away unless it's a raise-reraise-reraise situation.


[/ QUOTE ]


Exactly...so make a standard raise not all in.

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

Some of you seem to not realize that when you have a good hand you want to see calls not folds. If you shove then they pretty much always fold, calling with a very tight range of hands that sucks for us. Do yourself a favor and let these idiots pay you off.

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

[ QUOTE ]
lol

[/ QUOTE ]

qfmft

Re: QQ UTG First Hand (16 Turbo)
 

Bingo, you post for opinions but then keep trying to justify your play. I see all ins 1st hand and it just amazes me. Any of the following will happen:

1. Everybody folds and a premium hand like QQ wins just the blinds
2. You get called by AA or KK and are dominated. AK may call and you are now a coinflip.
3. You get called by Ax (retarded call) and will still lose a good percentage of time when an A falls on the board.
4. You get called by a smaller pair (retarded call again) and have them dominated but even they will beat you say 20% of the time.

Even if you double up you are by no means certain of getting in the money whilst you are dead if called and beaten.

You should play premium hands strongly but not like a maniac. I think players that play as you have suggested just prefer an all in because they never want their QQ beaten by Ax if they put in a “normal” raise. Don’t be afraid to play it right and also be prepared to lay it down if you think you are beat – a flop with A or K is a danger but good players can get away from losing all their chips with QQ.