I make every hand hard on myself
 

UTG is a pretty tight opener in EP and folds to most 3-bets (90% overall, forget how many in EP), so I figured I could kinda disguise my hand and play position. BB is shpanko, and I know he likes to make loose-ish calls from the blinds.

I've never seen shpanko take this line like ever.. so what's our play? Call, raise (to what amount), fold (lol?)? I couldn't decide what to do.. which I guess is why I should've considered 3-betting preflop.


Full Tilt Poker, $1/$2 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players
LeggoPoker.com - Hand History Converter

BB: $353.80
UTG: $197
MP: $194.95
CO: $56.80
Hero (BTN): $236.20
SB: $330.05

Pre-Flop: K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (BTN)
<font color="red">UTG raises to $7</font>, 2 folds, Hero calls $7, SB folds, BB calls $5

Flop: ($22) 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 Players)
BB checks, UTG checks, <font color="red">Hero bets $16</font>, BB calls $16, UTG folds

Turn: ($54) A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">BB bets $41</font>

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

i think this is always a call. if you raise, you lose the hands that you beat and have plenty of outs in position with more betting to be done on the river.

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

raising seems counterproductive

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

i like just calling and reevaluating river.

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

callll

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

Okay, we're all in agreement there.. what's our bet size here? (We have $170ish left)

Full Tilt Poker, $1/$2 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players
LeggoPoker.com - Hand History Converter

BB: $353.80
UTG: $197
MP: $194.95
CO: $56.80
Hero (BTN): $236.20
SB: $330.05

Pre-Flop: K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (BTN)
<font color="red">UTG raises to $7</font>, 2 folds, Hero calls $7, SB folds, BB calls $5

Flop: ($22) 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 Players)
BB checks, UTG checks, <font color="red">Hero bets $16</font>, BB calls $16, UTG folds

Turn: ($54) A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">BB bets $41</font>, Hero calls $41

River: ($136) K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
BB checks, Hero..

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

minimum of 100, maximum of all of it IMO

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

I think 85 gets looked up by any ace, which is nice since Ax cc is a decent chunk of his range. Don't see what else you're really gonna get value from. Call a shove ldo.

Edit: LOL, we have the Ac. 100 sounds good.

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

120, make it look like a busted draw, overbet if its believable as a bluff, ur line looks so much like a draw and it seems very unlikely u have a good hand given turn action or that the k improved ur hand given pf.

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

Take him to value town, 90-100 sound good?

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

99 or 111

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

bet the river, i like how you played it up to then.

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

bet 110. villain almost never has an ace here unless its two pair right? shove looks too strong though without history of these type of plays.

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

Depends on history/reads, but I like either all in or a pot sized bet. Have you seen him bluff, especially whiffed draws? How much does he bet when he is bluffing? If you know, bet that amount. Otherwise, all-in or pot sized bet. All-in if he won't reraise AJ or another aces up, pot sized bet if he will.

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

101

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

[ QUOTE ]
bet the river, i like how you played it up to then.

[/ QUOTE ]

and 102 seems like a good size.

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

[ QUOTE ]
101

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
101.42

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

I shove this. I don't think villain calls with a weak aces unless you have some decent history with him. A weak ace is just a bluff catcher - and I don't think he expects you to bluff here very often. Since his calling range is already going to be rather strong, I like just shoving.

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

[ QUOTE ]
bet 110. villain almost never has an ace here unless its two pair right? shove looks too strong though without history of these type of plays.

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

Call turn, bet 110ish on the river. I think shoving is fine as well.

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

bet 100

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

i bet 35 on the river vs shpanko here, u guys saying bet 100 dont know how to extract vs thinking players

also im drunk

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

I always bet around 85 here, but I dont think I shove this enough. But I almost never shove with a bluff either so just a normal valuebet/bluff line should do it.

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

[ QUOTE ]
i bet 35 on the river vs shpanko here, u guys saying bet 100 dont know how to extract vs thinking players

also im drunk

[/ QUOTE ]

def agree, can one of you mention one hand he's c/c 100ish here? Also, you can't rep a bluff (plz dont say missed draw)

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

I like the turn, and bet $94 on the river.

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

He has weaker 2 pair so 95 - 110 sounds good

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

Are you putting him on AJ exactly? What other 2 pair will he have?

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

This hand is seksi.

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

[ QUOTE ]
This hand is seksi.

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

I you call this turn then the river is 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], what do you do when the opponent bets ~100?

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

Yeah, that's where I think I lucked out. I'd be really lost if he led into me on a blank river.

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah, that's where I think I lucked out. I'd be really lost if he led into me on a blank river.

[/ QUOTE ]

If the answer is fold, then does that mean the turn has to be push or fold?

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Yeah, that's where I think I lucked out. I'd be really lost if he led into me on a blank river.

[/ QUOTE ]

If the answer is fold, then does that mean the turn has to be push or fold?

[/ QUOTE ]
no, i dont think so.

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

[ QUOTE ]
i bet 35 on the river vs shpanko here, u guys saying bet 100 dont know how to extract vs thinking players



[/ QUOTE ]

totally agree, how does villain check two pair here on the river when hero's hand looks like a flush draw that may or may not have hit the ace or king? Villains most likely hand is something like QJ which he will pay off a tiny bet but will no way pay off $100. I might even bet less, like $20.

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

lol @ $35 being a good bet vs a 'thinking player'

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

[ QUOTE ]
lol @ $35 being a good bet vs a 'thinking player'

[/ QUOTE ]

explain why plz

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

when would a good tag ever make that bet for anything other than value?

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

i dont think he'd bluff shove over that bet too much. given he knows who thac is, wouldnt he be more likely to think "omg he's trying to bluff me by making it look like a VB" than "he bet 35, i can totally shove him off his hand" etc?

Re: I make every hand hard on myself
 

[ QUOTE ]
when would a good tag ever make that bet for anything other than value?

[/ QUOTE ]

well we cant rep a bluff can we