another set in 100K...ugly board line check
 

never easy...flopped another set but board looks scarey with potential to get worse! Hate my flop raise (too small) but came to my senses on turn...river a standard check or value bet?

Poker Stars
No Limit Holdem Tournament
Blinds: t25/t50
9 players


UTG: t4600
UTG+1: t2905
MP1: t1255
MP2: t5700
MP3: t1815
Hero: t6625
Button: t3210
SB: t3505
BB: t2875

Pre-flop: (9 players) Hero is CO with 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
5 folds
Hero calls t50
Button calls t50
SB raises to t100
BB calls t50
Hero calls t50
Button calls t50

Flop: (t400) 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks
BB bets t50
Hero raises to t250
Button calls t250
SB folds
BB calls t200

Turn: (t1150) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB bets t50
Hero raises to t1000
Button calls t1000
BB calls t950

River: (t4150) J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB checks, Hero checks, Button checks

Final pot: t4150

Re: another set in 100K...ugly board line check
 

It's not really that scary. Your flop action hopefully scares away any naked spade draws, and you're really only worried about club draws or in the rare case 56 (in which case you'll know about it).

I'd bet again on the river, make A4 KQ, QTcc pay.

Re: another set in 100K...ugly board line check
 

The way this hand way played, I don't see him holding a hand that has you beat on the river unless he already had you on the flop, reason being, I don't think he would be calling you flop raise with two spade overcards, clubs yes, but spades isn't very likely. I think I would be putting him on a mid pp here, or a missed club draw which is possibly mixed with a straight draw, that would have also missed. By checking the river, I think he wants to show the hand down and not trap you. I think he bets the river here with a flush or a straight, and would have raised you somewhere if he had made a set. I think you can value bet here, but since it's still early in the tourney, checking isn't that bad an option, just to keep you out of trouble.

Re: another set in 100K...ugly board line check
 

With this turn and river, considering we raised the flop, I don't see anything beating us, I like a value bet here, you might get paid off here...

Re: another set in 100K...ugly board line check
 

Just shove river for value and hope to get called... Im betting it folds all around though... str8 is forced to bet the turn because the hand is getting very drawy... unless button has top set which would be very unfortunate I dont see how that river could have helped your opponents in this hand...

Re: another set in 100K...ugly board line check
 

You have the best hand on the river soooo much of the time you have to value bet it, even if you don't get looked up that often.

Re: another set in 100K...ugly board line check
 

[ QUOTE ]
Just shove river for value and hope to get called...

[/ QUOTE ]

ok, put yourself in villains shoes.. he shoves, you call your hand is xx? Very few/no hands are paying us off. I like even a 1/3-<1/2 pot bet, it'll get paid the odd time, and I like to show that bet down, it'll help set up cheap bluffs on later hands.

Re: another set in 100K...ugly board line check
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Just shove river for value and hope to get called...

[/ QUOTE ]

ok, put yourself in villains shoes.. he shoves, you call your hand is xx? Very few/no hands are paying us off. I like even a 1/3-<1/2 pot bet, it'll get paid the odd time, and I like to show that bet down, it'll help set up cheap bluffs on later hands.

[/ QUOTE ]

Look at the stack sizes... if you put in a 1/3 to 1/2 pot bet on this river I guarantee it looks scarier then an overshove to your opponents... with the overshove they may just think you are trying to take the pot... and this isnt going to hurt you If someone did make something they shouldnt have here because any reasonable bet you make on this river is going to lead to you calling a shove that will likely be FAR less then twice your bet...

Re: another set in 100K...ugly board line check
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Just shove river for value and hope to get called...

[/ QUOTE ]

ok, put yourself in villains shoes.. he shoves, you call your hand is xx? Very few/no hands are paying us off. I like even a 1/3-<1/2 pot bet, it'll get paid the odd time, and I like to show that bet down, it'll help set up cheap bluffs on later hands.

[/ QUOTE ]

Look at the stack sizes... if you put in a 1/3 to 1/2 pot bet on this river I guarantee it looks scarier then an overshove to your opponents... with the overshove they may just think you are trying to take the pot... and this isnt going to hurt you If someone did make something they shouldnt have here because any reasonable bet you make on this river is going to lead to you calling a shove that will likely be FAR less then twice your bet...

[/ QUOTE ]

Hero (5300) bets 1300.. 4k behind... and I pray I show this down.. I want it to look scary, offer odds and set me up later..

Re: another set in 100K...ugly board line check
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Just shove river for value and hope to get called...

[/ QUOTE ]

ok, put yourself in villains shoes.. he shoves, you call your hand is xx? Very few/no hands are paying us off. I like even a 1/3-<1/2 pot bet, it'll get paid the odd time, and I like to show that bet down, it'll help set up cheap bluffs on later hands.

[/ QUOTE ]

Look at the stack sizes... if you put in a 1/3 to 1/2 pot bet on this river I guarantee it looks scarier then an overshove to your opponents... with the overshove they may just think you are trying to take the pot... and this isnt going to hurt you If someone did make something they shouldnt have here because any reasonable bet you make on this river is going to lead to you calling a shove that will likely be FAR less then twice your bet...

[/ QUOTE ]

Hero (5300) bets 1300.. 4k behind... and I pray I show this down.. I want it to look scary, offer odds and set me up later..

[/ QUOTE ]

The button... who is the big stack of your 2 remaining opponents in this hand... has less then 2K behind him... you cant just look at your stack and determine what the proper play is... you must be aware of the effective stacks when both your opponents are much shorter then you like they are in this hand... W/E though we arent disagreeing enough here to continue this argument any further...

Re: another set in 100K...ugly board line check
 

[ QUOTE ]
The button... who is the big stack of your 2 remaining opponents in this hand... has less then 2K behind him... you cant just look at your stack and determine what the proper play is... you must be aware of the effective stacks when both your opponents are much shorter then you like they are in this hand... W/E though we arent disagreeing enough here to continue this argument any further...

[/ QUOTE ]

I wrote my replies thinking we we're up against one of the big stacks for some reason... (4 hrs sleep, 12 hour shift, 5 coffee's maybe?) Sorry for waisting your time, I agree.. shove
Ohh and check your PM... in about 2...

Re: another set in 100K...ugly board line check
 

Very unlikely they hit a runner flush. I put them all-in on the river.

Re: another set in 100K...ugly board line check
 

Raise more on the flop, at least 450-500...You can then get them to commit on the turn. As played why not bet this river? They never have a str8 or backdoor flush here, and they may have hit TP with their FD's.

Re: another set in 100K...ugly board line check
 

[ QUOTE ]
Raise more on the flop, at least 450-500...
[ QUOTE ]

Good point.

Re: another set in 100K...ugly board line check
 

Agreed. Didn't read all, and thought someone already mentioned re-raise more; thought it was obv, this is a draw heavy board. Everything else looks good but the river.