Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

Well, yet another story published yesterday about Blackwater being cleared in a shooting, which... guess what... NOBODY F'ING REPORTED.

link


/rant

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
NOBODY F'ING REPORTED.

[/ QUOTE ]

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link


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Does not compute.

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
NOBODY F'ING REPORTED.

[/ QUOTE ]

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link


[/ QUOTE ]

Does not compute.

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Just because I found one article doesn't mean it was widely reported. This story came out yesterday. If you were already aware of it, prior to me bringing it up, I'll be greatly impressed.

Edited to add:

Also, just for the record, I was actually searching to see if Blackwater had been cleared of any more of the accusations lately, and, after digging through about 30 articles related to Sept 16, and a few great pieces about FBI agents refusing to return to Iraq to investigate the incident on Sep 16th after the FBI changed their security detail from BW to US MP's, I found one.

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

The article you link to seems to be taken from the washington post article: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...702751_pf.html

Slightly different emphasis hmm.

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
The article you link to seems to be taken from the washington post article: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...702751_pf.html

Slightly different emphasis hmm.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
U.S. officials were "overwhelmingly convinced" that the Blackwater guards acted appropriately, based on information they had provided, according to the diplomatic security official. He spoke on condition of anonymity because a joint U.S.-Iraqi commission is investigating private security matters, including previous Blackwater shootings. Shortly after the Feb. 7 incident, the official said, the U.S. Embassy briefed an Iraqi government official and invited him to discuss the matter further, but the embassy never heard from him again.

[/ QUOTE ]

Change the dates, and this report is pretty much a standard form letter for these guys.

Its always the same "They were cleared, but they shouldn't have been."

It's like a speech my DI gave our cadet class on the first day of Academy: [ QUOTE ]
"This line of work is the only job in the world where everyone who has never stood in your shoes can make better judgements, conduct better investigations, write better reports, and stop threats with less force than you can. However, they'll still call you for assistance, rather than attempt to make judgement calls, conduct investigations, write reports, or neutralize threats. Then when you do it, you'll do it 'wrong' about 90% of the time. Welcome to my world, ladies and gentlemen."

[/ QUOTE ]

That's pretty much the mentality the public seems to have here with Blackwater, and with those put in a position to investigate Blackwater.

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
The article you link to seems to be taken from the washington post article: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...702751_pf.html

Slightly different emphasis hmm.

[/ QUOTE ]

Oddly enough, that Washington Post piece on Blackwater that is loose with the truth was authored by Steve Fainaru.

And if you know anything about him, factual reporting doesn't run in his family.

His brother is Mark Fainaru-Wada....the SF Chron reporter and author of the Game of Shadows book regarding Barry Bonds....the book that the Pulitzer prize committee shunned immediately and declared to be "not able to be viewed as credible, nor based on factual events."

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The article you link to seems to be taken from the washington post article: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...702751_pf.html

Slightly different emphasis hmm.

[/ QUOTE ]

Oddly enough, that Washington Post piece on Blackwater that is loose with the truth was authored by Steve Fainaru.

And if you know anything about him, factual reporting doesn't run in his family.

His brother is Mark Fainaru-Wada....the SF Chron reporter and author of the Game of Shadows book regarding Barry Bonds....the book that the Pulitzer prize committee shunned immediately and declared to be "not able to be viewed as credible, nor based on factual events."

[/ QUOTE ]

How the [censored] did you turn this into another thread about Barry Bonds? Isn't there a thread in SE for this?

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The article you link to seems to be taken from the washington post article: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...702751_pf.html

Slightly different emphasis hmm.

[/ QUOTE ]

Oddly enough, that Washington Post piece on Blackwater that is loose with the truth was authored by Steve Fainaru.

And if you know anything about him, factual reporting doesn't run in his family.

His brother is Mark Fainaru-Wada....the SF Chron reporter and author of the Game of Shadows book regarding Barry Bonds....the book that the Pulitzer prize committee shunned immediately and declared to be "not able to be viewed as credible, nor based on factual events."

[/ QUOTE ]

Wow RB, I'm glad you brought that up. I'll be honest, I just gave the Post article a cursory glance, then went back and delved into it deeper after reading your post.

That article truly is complete and utter propaganda. I love the whole "Yea, they're cleared, but they're cleared because the State Department is incompetent, here's why." mentality.

Who is this guy? I don't read the Washington Post, I'm starting to look more into him now. I know you said his brother had been involved in some controversy, but has the writer?

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

Dbl,

[ QUOTE ]

Change the dates, and this report is pretty much a standard form letter for these guys.

Its always the same "They were cleared, but they shouldn't have been."

[/ QUOTE ]

An apparently closed door investigation by the US suffers from a lack of credibility. I have no idea what happened but I wouldn't count this as a major piece of evidence if I were to try to find out.

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

There was nothing closed door about it. You misread my point. The point is, these guys are constantly accused of crimes, and always cleared.

Why does this happen?

#1. Perception - These guys are labeled as terrorists by a few nutjobs in the media, and the treatment is given to them so often that the average person buys into it.

#2. Credibility - I've become convinced any journalist who happens to be in Iraq will take down any and every story any Iraqi civilian tells them as they walk down the streets concerning the US Military, or Blackwater, publish it verbatim, without even going through the basic journalistic process of finding three sources which agree before publishing, then call the street story "fact." Then the same journalist will become incredulous when the State Dept actually investigates and says "uhhh No."

Also, another point I'd like to make about articles such as the post article is that they're always filled with these mystical "anonymous sources".

I'll accept an anonymous source on rare occasion, but one thing I've learned from police work is that most "anonymous" sources want to remain anonymous for one of three reasons. Either they:

A) Are lying
B) Don't Exist
C) Fear for their lives

more often than not, in my experience, A and B are the popular choices.

While I whole heartedly support, and am a strong defender of the 1st amendment, that also comes with a price. You are absolutely free to print and say anything you so desire, but, when you lose credibility for doing so, it's not my problem.

Unfortunately, we live in a world where the media has become responsible for its own credibility, as the story I've linked in the OP will never be given headline coverage. Think about it. I'm not just talking Blackwater here, I'm talking news in general, when is the last time you've actually seen a news organization say "We were wrong, this is the truth" in an easily accessable fashion, rather than on the back of the "Living" section, right in between the Obituaries and the Personal Ads?

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

Shame on you, blackwater!

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

where does it say they were cleared?

[ QUOTE ]
The U.S. government said employees with the security contractor Blackwater USA acted “within approved rules governing the use of force” after responding to alleged small arms fire associated with the Iraqi Media Network headquarters,

[/ QUOTE ]

kell supry. The government said it so it must be true.

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
Shame on you, blackwater!

[/ QUOTE ]

Thank you, Taso.

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

Did anyone hear this? There is no need to post for each of the 53 times a day a winger mistakes confirmation bias for a correct opinion.

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
where does it say they were cleared?

[ QUOTE ]
The U.S. government said employees with the security contractor Blackwater USA acted “within approved rules governing the use of force” after responding to alleged small arms fire associated with the Iraqi Media Network headquarters,

[/ QUOTE ]

kell supry. The government said it so it must be true.

[/ QUOTE ]

LMAO. Who would have to say it for you to believe it? The Iraqi Government?

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
where does it say they were cleared?

[ QUOTE ]
The U.S. government said employees with the security contractor Blackwater USA acted “within approved rules governing the use of force” after responding to alleged small arms fire associated with the Iraqi Media Network headquarters,

[/ QUOTE ]

kell supry. The government said it so it must be true.

[/ QUOTE ]

LMAO. Who would have to say it for you to believe it? The Iraqi Government?

[/ QUOTE ]

Wait, so you believe what politicians tell you?

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

Dbl,

I'm not sure how I misunderstood your point. Yes the media are interested in sensational stories and are biased by that. However the US government has a clear bias here as well. There's no way anyone outside Iraq can claim to know what happened in these incidents.

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

It's either Iran or Pakistan's fault. Maybe North Korea or Syria.

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
where does it say they were cleared?

[ QUOTE ]
The U.S. government said employees with the security contractor Blackwater USA acted “within approved rules governing the use of force” after responding to alleged small arms fire associated with the Iraqi Media Network headquarters,

[/ QUOTE ]

kell supry. The government said it so it must be true.

[/ QUOTE ]

LMAO. Who would have to say it for you to believe it? The Iraqi Government?

[/ QUOTE ]

Wait, so you believe what politicians tell you?

[/ QUOTE ]

You call Federal law enforcement agents "Politicians"?

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]

How the [censored] did you turn this into another thread about Barry Bonds? Isn't there a thread in SE for this?

[/ QUOTE ]

I didn't turn it into a Bonds thread. I pointed out that the Fainura brothers have a known penchant for salicious and misleading propoganda in their articles, as their interest is not in reporting facts....but in selling newspapers and paving the way for book deals.

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
Who is this guy? I don't read the Washington Post, I'm starting to look more into him now. I know you said his brother had been involved in some controversy, but has the writer?

[/ QUOTE ]

Read some of his work. Then do your own independent research on whatever topic he writes on. The majority of the time, you'll see his version of events is exaggerated, misleading, and sometimes outright fabricated in order to make the most tantalizing pieces possible.

Years ago, newspapers had two different positions filled with two different people.....sales and writers.

Some of them have combined those jobs, and this guy's main goal is to sell newspapers, and most often it is at the expense of factual, objective reporting.

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Who is this guy? I don't read the Washington Post, I'm starting to look more into him now. I know you said his brother had been involved in some controversy, but has the writer?

[/ QUOTE ]

Read some of his work. Then do your own independent research on whatever topic he writes on. The majority of the time, you'll see his version of events is exaggerated, misleading, and sometimes outright fabricated in order to make the most tantalizing pieces possible.

Years ago, newspapers had two different positions filled with two different people.....sales and writers.

Some of them have combined those jobs, and this guy's main goal is to sell newspapers, and most often it is at the expense of factual, objective reporting.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yea, I've researched him since making that post. That guy is full of bull [censored] and propaganda.

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]

You call Federal law enforcement agents "Politicians"?

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
The U.S. government reached a different conclusion. Based on information from the Blackwater guards, who said they were fired upon, the State Department determined that the security team's actions "fell within approved rules governing the use of force,"

[/ QUOTE ]

So based on the testimony of blackwater, THE STATE DEPARTMENT cleared them. LMAO.

The Speech your DI gave you should have said : "When they say jump, you say how high?"

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Who is this guy? I don't read the Washington Post, I'm starting to look more into him now. I know you said his brother had been involved in some controversy, but has the writer?

[/ QUOTE ]

Read some of his work. Then do your own independent research on whatever topic he writes on. The majority of the time, you'll see his version of events is exaggerated, misleading, and sometimes outright fabricated in order to make the most tantalizing pieces possible.

Years ago, newspapers had two different positions filled with two different people.....sales and writers.

Some of them have combined those jobs, and this guy's main goal is to sell newspapers, and most often it is at the expense of factual, objective reporting.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yea, I've researched him since making that post. That guy is full of bull [censored] and propaganda.

[/ QUOTE ]

You mean that guy has different opinions from yours? LOL


PS what type of research have you done?

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
BAGHDAD, Nov. 8 (UPI) -- The U.S. government countered Iraqi claims that employees with Blackwater USA fired “without any provocation” on Iraqi guards, killing three.

The U.S. government said employees with the security contractor Blackwater USA acted “within approved rules governing the use of force”.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thankfully this development won't anger any Iraqis into joining the ranks of the insurgency. Including any Iraqis who are in the military or the police. I mean, I'm sure this ain't gonna cost American lives down the road. Surely it won't. Right?

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
So based on the testimony of blackwater, THE STATE DEPARTMENT cleared them. LMAO.

[/ QUOTE ]

Just purely for laughs, who, in your opinion, took the statements from Blackwater? Just take a wild shot in the dark at what agency does that kind of thing.


[ QUOTE ]

The Speech your DI gave you should have said : "When they say jump, you say how high?"


[/ QUOTE ]

Exactly, especially since you're proving his point with this post.

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
PS what type of research have you done?

[/ QUOTE ]

Read every article I could find. What type of research have you done?

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
BAGHDAD, Nov. 8 (UPI) -- The U.S. government countered Iraqi claims that employees with Blackwater USA fired “without any provocation” on Iraqi guards, killing three.

The U.S. government said employees with the security contractor Blackwater USA acted “within approved rules governing the use of force”.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thankfully this development won't anger any Iraqis into joining the ranks of the insurgency. Including any Iraqis who are in the military or the police. I mean, I'm sure this ain't gonna cost American lives down the road. Surely it won't. Right?

[/ QUOTE ]

Perhaps Iraq should stop lying about events in the best interests of the American GI, huh?

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
Perhaps Iraq should stop lying about events in the best interests of the American GI, huh?

[/ QUOTE ]


What??? Above their national interests??? They should do as the USA say, not as it does?

You have a very one sided view. I am supporting the majority of US citizens!

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Perhaps Iraq should stop lying about events in the best interests of the American GI, huh?

[/ QUOTE ]


What??? Above their national interests??? They should do as the USA say, not as it does?

You have a very one sided view. I am supporting the majority of US citizens!

[/ QUOTE ]

source?

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

DblBarrelJ,

Please do not post "news" on this forum that the main stream media has not deemed to be worthy of high volume coverage.

Thank you.

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
DblBarrelJ,

Please do not post "news" on this forum that the main stream media has not deemed to be worthy of high volume coverage.

Thank you.

[/ QUOTE ]

LOL, you wish. Every time they're cleared again, I'll blast it from the rooftops.

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

Just out of interest, is USA Today you main source of printed news? If not what is it? LOL

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
Just out of interest, is USA Today you main source of printed news? If not what is it? LOL

[/ QUOTE ]

The internet. USA today sucks. I read different stories from about 35-40 papers a day, ranging from papers printed by the US Military to underground communist publications.

Edited to Add:

Have you ever thought that maybe the reason many posters here hold the opinions we do could be because we take the time to research topics from a perspective of multiple sources and POVs, where as you seem to accept everything your nightly news feeds you without ever questioning any of it?

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
Have you ever thought that maybe the reason many posters here hold the opinions we do could be because we take the time to research topics from a perspective of multiple sources and POVs, where as you seem to accept everything your nightly news feeds you without ever questioning any of it?

[/ QUOTE ]

Could you mention, give the URL of, the sites you tend to see as credible?

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Have you ever thought that maybe the reason many posters here hold the opinions we do could be because we take the time to research topics from a perspective of multiple sources and POVs, where as you seem to accept everything your nightly news feeds you without ever questioning any of it?

[/ QUOTE ]

Could you mention, give the URL of, the sites you tend to see as credible?

[/ QUOTE ]

That's precisely the problem. Nothing is credible 100% of the time. When I see a story which interests me, I search it, find as many articles about the story as possible, from different angles and perspectives, then I form my own conclusion.

No site or paper is accurate 100% of the time, no site or paper is inaccurate 100% of the time. Try them out!

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
no site or paper is inaccurate 100% of the time

[/ QUOTE ]

So much for Blackwater, I guess!

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
no site or paper is inaccurate 100% of the time

[/ QUOTE ]

So much for Blackwater, I guess!

[/ QUOTE ]

Blackwater Investigation Unjust

Media Intentionally Paints Negative Portrait Of Security Firm

Trigger-Happy Cowboys save Polish ambassador

Indeed MidGe. The media is critical of Blackwater 100% of the time.

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

As Paul has said, we are building an empire in Iraq. The Prez has ordered the U.S. to remove Blackwater from their country, yet Blackwater remains.

And we wonder why many muslims hate us.

Re: Blackwater: Did anyone hear this???
 

[ QUOTE ]
The Prez has ordered the U.S. to remove Blackwater from their country, yet Blackwater remains.

And we wonder why many muslims hate us.

[/ QUOTE ]

Source?