400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

Villain is UMD Tennis, running 19/16/3 over 10.6k hands. This is quite literally my first hand at the table, and we have no recent history. I'm sure he has notes/stats on me though.

Full Tilt Poker, $2/$4 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players
LeggoPoker Hand History Converter

BTN: $707.90
SB: $59.10
Hero (BB): $400
UTG: $405.70
MP: $470.40
CO: $408

Pre-Flop: X X dealt to Hero (BB)
2 folds, <font color="red">CO raises to $14</font>, 2 folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $50</font>, CO calls $36

Flop: ($102) 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">Hero bets $76</font>, CO calls $76

Turn: ($254) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players)
Hero checks, <font color="red">CO bets $282 and is All-In</font>

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

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I'm sure he has notes/stats on me though.

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Which would be?

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

This is an interesting spot.

What does anyone check the turn with there that they will call a push with? Am I wrong, or is this a good spot for us if we are villain with 88-TT/67s/34s/45s and push the turn if checked to?

Like what hand checks the turn there that will call a push - ever?

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

Here I call this turn with:
-any set (obviously)
-KK, AA (obviously)
-AQ, KQ
-any pocket pair 88-JJ (so this is the worst hand I'd call with). Note--I wouldnt call with these pairs if the flop hadn't been 2-flush. Also, the only reason most of this range is callable other than the sets is that we checked the turn.

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

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Here I call this turn with:
-any set (obviously)
-KK, AA (obviously)
-AQ, KQ
-any pocket pair 88-JJ (so this is the worst hand I'd call with). Note--I wouldnt call with these pairs if the flop hadn't been 2-flush. Also, the only reason most of this range is callable other than the sets is that we checked the turn.

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Which of those hands do you check the turn with?
I think the overall checking range is an important part of this.

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

eh.. 1010+

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

Does any pair below Q's float this flop and then shove the turn as opposed to raising the flop? Does he play 87s any differently than TT?

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

isn't 22 close to JJ here? I guess he could have some pair+gut shot hand.

BTW I check this turn with most of my range. Or should I instead be shoving most of my range?

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

I think A8/99 are close, although he really shouldn't be doing this with TT/JJ but i don't play on FTP so who knows.

some9, if he's shoving a draw he has better equity vs. 22 than JJ.

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

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isn't 22 close to JJ here?

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Na, he's probably shoving a lot of pairs.

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

i agree something like a pair of 8s is the worst i'd call with.

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

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I'm sure he has notes/stats on me though.

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Which would be?

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Probably something like I run 22/18/~4, I'm the best player in the world, etc etc

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

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isn't 22 close to JJ here?

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Na, he's probably shoving a lot of pairs.

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which pairs? and would he be doing it as a bluff or to protect his hand? I guess I'm asking how u would play 99 if you were in villain's shoes.

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

i think KQ is the cutoff here. definitely AQ+

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

I don't think UMD is shoving 99 here.....and calling here lightly without some read that he floats in RRd pots is bad vs him.

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

What's the worst hand he takes this line with for value?

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

stack off with JJ+

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

I'd really like to know people's ranges for checking the turn here. I can't think of a single hand that I check with that will call here. That does feel like a pretty big hole in my game that is easy to read. Maybe I should be checking my whole range here oop?

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

prob AQ+ unless he has been getting out of line in which case any Q, JJ, maybe TT. but stats over 10k hands are pretty tight.

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

I check turns like this occasionally, in todays aggro games alot of villains will stab the turn with their flushdraw and I can CRAI here with AQ, KQ. It also protects my future hands when I check turn with AK and similar.

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

I wouldn't check the turn with many hands I'm willing to felt but I guess my worst hand would be AQ but I wouldn't like it, I would call with KK and better w/o thinking too much about it

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

KQ is the worst id stack off with here.

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I check turns like this occasionally, in todays aggro games alot of villains will stab the turn with their flushdraw and I can CRAI here with AQ, KQ. It also protects my future hands when I check turn with AK and similar.

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It is a RE-raised pot pf, and there is one pot size bet left. There is really no need to check against flush draws imo.

It makes no sense to me fundamentally to check there with anything that we will call with when we could just have shoved for value if we thought out hand is good.

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

I think he wants you to call light and I think he has a Q.

The way the games are playing, I think you would bet the turn with top top or better (because of the draws and how people stack off pretty light), so I don't think he's affraid of that.

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

Very good discussion so far. I actually c/c the turn with KK, and he showed KQ and mhig.

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

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I think he wants you to call light and I think he has a Q.

The way the games are playing, I think you would bet the turn with top top or better (because of the draws and how people stack off pretty light), so I don't think he's affraid of that.

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This is very true. Can someone explain to me how this is not exploitable?

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

if i'm checking the turn with a made hand its to get this result.

Re: 400NL - What\'s the worse hand you stack off with?
 

KQ is the worst hand I get it in with here.