KQ EP shove
 

2.20 bounty on UB... blinds 1/200 hero with 2600

UTG with KsQs.... shove w/ 9 to act behind or fold and wait for better position??? i realize it's +EV to push but is it really a good play to???

effective stacks are relatively all the same

Re: KQ EP shove
 

UTG I fold. You aren't desperate enough to shove this hand in this position IMO.

Re: KQ EP shove
 

i fold it OOP

Re: KQ EP shove
 

yeah, that's what i was thinking... folding it OOP

i've been toying w/ the idea of playing it stronger OOP... which is why i decided to try the "goofy" push of 9M ... a range where i thought i wouldn't get instacalled.

when i get really short like M=4 or less... pushing it gets instacalled. and then u're pretty much done cuz the calling range is less.

reality, i got called by 7s6s (flush draw was totally murdered) by a MP2 who had me covered by 15.... everyone else folded
moral of story... the donktard flops 2 pr cuz he says he was "bored" and gets my bounty [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img] and i make fun of him for 2 hours afterward for a 64/36 gone awry... and for the fact that on pokerdb his money stats were 2 cashes in 43.... dead money. someone asked me if i really want him to play better...to which my speedy reply was YES! because who really calls all in's w/ 7 hi and 6 ppl to act behind HIM.... without reraising his last 15 chips all in.

LOL DONKAMENTS

Re: KQ EP shove
 

I would push with an M of 4 way before with 9. Less goofy there IMO.

Re: KQ EP shove
 

[ QUOTE ]
i realize it's +EV to push but is it really a good play to???



[/ QUOTE ]

I stopped reading your post here.

Re: KQ EP shove
 

[ QUOTE ]

I stopped reading your post here.

[/ QUOTE ]

a better thing to say is .... i stopped reading your post here because ....
1. yadda yadda yadda
2. yadda yadda yadda
3. yadda yadda yadda

please ruin me and tell me y i sock

Re: KQ EP shove
 

I think he means the definition of a good play is that it be +EV. How could a move be +EV yet not a good move?

Re: KQ EP shove
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

I stopped reading your post here.

[/ QUOTE ]

a better thing to say is .... i stopped reading your post here because ....
1. yadda yadda yadda
2. yadda yadda yadda
3. yadda yadda yadda

please ruin me and tell me y i sock

[/ QUOTE ]

Because if it is +EV to push then it's a good play! BTW I didn't take the time to figure out if it is +EV or not, but that wasn't the point.

Re: KQ EP shove
 

i question it as a valid play even tho it's got +EV.... i'm flipping against Ace Under... soooooted helps... and all i'm really scared of is AK, AQ, KK+... which is like 2% of hands i'm likely to see... but 2% times 10 people means someone has something callable like 20% of time... so yeah its' +EV

with such a low (2.20 buy in) and a bounty attached to my head it seems like people will come after me w/ worse which happened.

the reason i was saying it wasn't a "good play" is cuz there's 9 ppl to act behind me who are all relatively even except for the 10k monster stack.

and the fact that it's a donkament totally complicates things

Re: KQ EP shove
 

I do not think it was a good play OR +ev as far as that goes. If you were shorter stacked maybe but there will be a better spot than this, with position.

Re: KQ EP shove
 

[ QUOTE ]
but 2% times 10 people means someone has something callable like 20% of time... so yeah its' +EV


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lol that's not how it works. and you're not playing at an 11 handed table.

it's not a concrete push or fold. it's table dependent and really getting called by 76ss is the best case other than Kx

Re: KQ EP shove
 

The times when you do get called you're going to be behind to way behind. It's a -EV move because you have to multiply the chance of someone picking up a callable hand behind you (probably AJ+, 99+) by the number of players still to act. Since there are 8 players left to act, the risk/reward of pushing doesn't make it worth it. With your stack, you can afford to wait for a better spot. Experiment with pokerstove. There are calculations that you can do to find your equity (chance of winning) against the potential caller's ranges

Re: KQ EP shove
 

i like a limp. ill explain. if we lose 200 big deal if raised. we still have enough to shove and dbl up. we may get a multiway pot connect and win a nice pot. or against just blinds we can play aggro unless it comes all lo connected.

Re: KQ EP shove
 

i don't even like a limp that early.... it's either raise or fold. i don't like the limp putting 9% of my stack in weak to which i'd fold to a RR, i didn't like the idea of putting 500 in, that's 20%... i didn't like potting it, that's 25%.....

ugh... weak hands out of position (they win for everyone but me) lol

Re: KQ EP shove
 

[ QUOTE ]
i like a limp. ill explain. if we lose 200 big deal if raised. we still have enough to shove and dbl up. we may get a multiway pot connect and win a nice pot. or against just blinds we can play aggro unless it comes all lo connected.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're limp/folding with 13bbs? This has to be spewing.

Re: KQ EP shove
 

is this a turbo? if so im fine with your move if utg limps are causing the few unraised multiway pots that occur.
Lately Ive been folding AJo utg without much regret rather than throwing chips away or going broke. I like KQs much more but ive still pitched it plenty in ep especially in the nether regions of M.

Re: KQ EP shove
 

13BBs UTG is a spot where you just have to play super tight, because there's no decent line with non-great hands. I hate folding KQs in an unopened pot, but this is about the worst spot you can have with it & I think folding is best. You can shove with antes.

Re: KQ EP shove
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
i like a limp. ill explain. if we lose 200 big deal if raised. we still have enough to shove and dbl up. we may get a multiway pot connect and win a nice pot. or against just blinds we can play aggro unless it comes all lo connected.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're limp/folding with 13bbs? This has to be spewing.

[/ QUOTE ]

It is.

Re: KQ EP shove
 

Lol this thread has been around for 3 days now...it's still a fold.