2/4 I\'m minraise/folding two pair on the river
 

Button: 31/22/3.8 Really aggro...with a hand.
BB: 28/12/2.1 Haven't tangled with him all that much...but the sample is over 300 hands. I don't have any real notes on him (so he's most likely been in line).

Party Poker, $2/$4 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players
LeggoPoker Hand History Converter

BTN: $404
SB: $223.50
BB: $412.40
UTG: $404
MP: $1,929.25
Hero (CO): $577.90

Pre-Flop: T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (CO)
2 folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $16</font>, BTN calls $16, SB folds, BB calls $12

Flop: ($50) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 Players)
BB checks, <font color="red">Hero bets $30</font>, BTN calls $30, BB calls $30

Turn: ($140) T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 Players)
BB checks, Hero checks, BTN checks

River: ($140) 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 Players)
<font color="red">BB bets $80</font>, <font color="red">Hero raises to $160</font>, BTN folds, <font color="red">BB raises to $366.40 and is All-In</font>, Hero folds

Results: $460 Pot
BB mucked and WON $662.90 (+$456.90 NET)

Re: 2/4 I\'m minraise/folding two pair on the river
 

Why didn't you bet the turn?

Re: 2/4 I\'m minraise/folding two pair on the river
 

Bet turn... as played call the river, I doubt even KQ calls that min raise.

And don't post results!

Re: 2/4 I\'m minraise/folding two pair on the river
 

Well, the question is about whether the fold is correct.
And you think KQs shoves there giving me justification to call?

Re: 2/4 I\'m minraise/folding two pair on the river
 

*Grunch* This f-ing sucks...we're getting 2.8-1 on a call and we showed weakness on the turn, but I just cant put villain on anything but Kx or AA that we actually beat here...i guess its gotta be a fold.

Re: 2/4 I\'m minraise/folding two pair on the river
 

On thinking this over, if villain played this straight up his only reasonable range that beats us is 55 and AQ (doubt he would call flop bet with 33, would have raised with 10s JJs or KKs pre probably, and q9 seems like an unlikely call in the big blind. I think its a call because of Kx pushing in response to your turn check and innocuous river gir...

Re: 2/4 I\'m minraise/folding two pair on the river
 

But yeah do you see how betting the turn might have made this easier to play gir?

Re: 2/4 I\'m minraise/folding two pair on the river
 

So...If I bet turn and he raises me, what do I do then? And it would make it an easier call perhaps because I could put him on a heart draw. In this instance, I rule that one out.

Re: 2/4 I\'m minraise/folding two pair on the river
 

[ QUOTE ]
So...If I bet turn and he raises me, what do I do then?

[/ QUOTE ]

fold and feel really good about it? seems like an easy bet for value and because you really rarely get raised by anything you beat

Re: 2/4 I\'m minraise/folding two pair on the river
 

I think fold is good as played.

Re: 2/4 I\'m minraise/folding two pair on the river
 

checking turn makes no sense at all here. like, really bad. giving a free card to two players on this board... why?

given the action there are only a few legit hands that make sense for bb because overcalling the flop with KJ or better seems bad/unlikely. when we get to the river he could easily have a busted flush draw and you are representing basically nothing other than pocket threes. So it's certainly conceivable that he could be bluffing. Maybe not often enough to justify a call (depending on reads) but this is hardly a spot where I'd feel like I can fold here and always be right.

Re: 2/4 I\'m minraise/folding two pair on the river
 

I can't figure out if calling or folding river is best, but I really don't like the turn check and river raise unless you have very good reads on the other players. I would have trouble putting you on a hand in this situation so basically it becomes a two pair in a vacuum situation for you. And those spots are gross. Bet the turn!

Re: 2/4 I\'m minraise/folding two pair on the river
 

[ QUOTE ]
Well, the question is about whether the fold is correct.

[/ QUOTE ]

and our question is obv, why aren't you betting the turn? its hard to come up with a real answer because we don't get here this way often.

Re: 2/4 I\'m minraise/folding two pair on the river
 

I kinda hate not betting this turn. As for river play I think it is really close but I would call his shove. But really I think I wouldnt minraise the river simply cause I have no clue how someeone else sees that making me unsure what to do when he raises.
Idk if that was coherent but basically fire turn and flat call the river imo

Re: 2/4 I\'m minraise/folding two pair on the river
 

actually no i would fold to his shove sorry for that brain fart

Re: 2/4 I\'m minraise/folding two pair on the river
 

I realized why I didn't bet the turn. It's because I have a leak. But I don't want to get into what that leak is exactly cause I just realized it. It will be fixed with practice. Thanks for pointing it out to me. [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

Re: 2/4 I\'m minraise/folding two pair on the river
 

[ QUOTE ]
So...If I bet turn and he raises me, what do I do then? And it would make it an easier call perhaps because I could put him on a heart draw. In this instance, I rule that one out.

[/ QUOTE ]

Bet turn and be happy to get it all in if you get the chance. the board is super draw heavy so he should have raised flop with any hand that beats you. I'd like my 2 pair here alot.

Re: 2/4 I\'m minraise/folding two pair on the river
 

Theres virtually no value in raising this river imo. He doesn't have a hand that can call you often enough. I would call and hope the button overcalls with a king or something.