KK 200 + BBs deep...AI 5 bet
 

so villain is a pretty standard 2,4 FT reg
his name is gollum63 and he runs at 23/16/2 over like 4k hands

i assume everyone 4bets this here...but who calls the shove?

fwiw he shoved almost instantly

Full Tilt Poker, $2/$4 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players
LeggoPoker Hand History Converter

BB: $443.30
UTG: $584.70
Hero (MP): $908.90
CO: $443
BTN: $1,028.50
SB: $429.30

Pre-Flop: K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (MP)
UTG folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $14</font>, CO folds, <font color="red">BTN raises to $52</font>, 2 folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $145</font>, <font color="red">BTN raises to $1,028.50 and is All-In</font>

Results: $296 Pot
BTN mucked and WON $296 (+$151 NET)

thoughts?

Re: KK 200 + BBs deep...AI 5 bet
 

do not 4bet w/ o intention of snapcalling a shove.

Re: KK 200 + BBs deep...AI 5 bet
 

4bet/folding the second nuts is pretty bad. Call.

Re: KK 200 + BBs deep...AI 5 bet
 

[ QUOTE ]
4bet/folding the second nuts is pretty bad. Call.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, how can you 4-bet this and then fold.

Re: KK 200 + BBs deep...AI 5 bet
 

call, suckout, profit?

Re: KK 200 + BBs deep...AI 5 bet
 

I like a call pre if you don't think you can 4-bet/call profitable.

Re: KK 200 + BBs deep...AI 5 bet
 

yeah seems like your options should be to call the 3bet or 4bet and call a shove, I hate 4betting and folding to the shove

Re: KK 200 + BBs deep...AI 5 bet
 

so who just calls the 3bet and who 4bet/calls?

Re: KK 200 + BBs deep...AI 5 bet
 

Fairly obvious fold. People advocating calls are those who usually figure ZOMG I HAVE KK, call, and then watch the chips ship across the table.

I do agree there is merit here to just calling the 3 bet if you don't plan to get it all in preflop.

Re: KK 200 + BBs deep...AI 5 bet
 

I like 4betting calling a shove esp with the instashove

Re: KK 200 + BBs deep...AI 5 bet
 

[ QUOTE ]
I like 4betting calling a shove esp with the instashove

[/ QUOTE ]

The instashove makes this much more likely to be AA, with AK or QQ he definately has to think before rifling 200+bb's into the pot.

Re: KK 200 + BBs deep...AI 5 bet
 

For those advocating calling, are we stacking on a 2-2-2 flop?

Re: KK 200 + BBs deep...AI 5 bet
 

[ QUOTE ]
For those advocating calling, are we stacking on a 2-2-2 flop?

[/ QUOTE ]

Of course. His range to get it all in is much wider than 200bb deep pf.

Mark

Re: KK 200 + BBs deep...AI 5 bet
 

[ QUOTE ]
For those advocating calling, are we stacking on a 2-2-2 flop?

[/ QUOTE ]

If we just call the 3 bet there's still an absurd amount of money behind, and we'll get a ton of info based on what he does postflop. I don't think we need to know 100% what we're going to do in every conceivable postflop scenario, as we'll have plenty of room to narrow down his range based on the postflop action.

To answer the question though I would only felt 200bb's on this flop if I expected him to regularly be felting QQ or worse, which for a lot of TAG's isn't the case.