Someone talk me out of...LIMCASH
 

Someone please talk me out of playing head's up limit hold'em.

I started playing limit hold'em, mostly because at that time that was what all the literature was about. But after playing FR limit for a while, I found I enjoyed FR NL a lot more. I made the transition to NL and have had a lot of fun, as well as made a decent amount of money.

But back in the day I read The Professor, the Banker and the Suicide King. That story of the epic head's up limit matches between Andy Beal and the Corporation have really stuck with me, and I find myself wanting to play HU limit.

Byron Jacobs has a HU limit DVD set, and I'm thinking of putting my NL cash game on hold to play HU limit. I also have a copy of Poker Academy, and Phil Laak said once in an interview that PA plays a dead hard game of HU limit. I'm thinking I could use the DVDs to learn the basics, polish my game with PA, then put my roll at risk only after my skill & confidence were where I felt they needed to be.

The thing is, I don't want to give up on NL cash games. If I made the switch to HU limit, that's what I feel I'd be doing. I can play FR NL hold'em in casinos, at least as long as it stays popular, and I'll probably always be able to play NL hold'em on the internet. But baring any special events, I'll probably only be able to play HU limit on the internet.

I wouldn't mind learning HU NL, but that's way more complex than HU limit. Plus, the only resources for NH NL is Cardrunners and I'm not a member yet.

With Harrington on Cash & PNL II coming so soon, I feel like this would be a bad time to give up NL cash games. Or perhaps it's exactly the right time, since the fish will suddenly have all kinds of resourced to improve.

I'd love to read some comments from some of you long timers.

Re: Someone talk me out of...
 

If you don't want to play limcash, then play limcash. I guarantee you'll never want to play limcash again.

Re: Someone talk me out of...
 

PM dboy23 imo

Re: Someone talk me out of...
 

Seriously, if I could afford to play HUlim, I would, and it's not a close decision.

Don't listen to those forum monkeys insulting Limit players. A very large portion of the high stakes limit players have gone very deep into NL tourneys. Those people that insult other forms of poker are idiots, losing players, and don't have a lick of appreciation for the game. To sit there behind your computer and look at a -15bb/100 graph and insult those who spend years mastering one form of a game you won't play because you suck or you don't think it's cool is childish. People who write that crap get no response from me. I am building a roll, and I know that Limit is in no way easier or more boring than NL, and they are donating. Do what makes you happy. You are the one who has to wake up in the morning, turn on the computer, and click the mouse.

Re: Someone talk me out of...LIMCASH
 

[ QUOTE ]
I find myself wanting to play HU limit

[/ QUOTE ]

Me too! There's an odd fascination there [img]/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img] And since you've opened the floor for wannabe LIMCASH players, I have two questions to the more experienced forum dwellers:

1) Won't the rake rape you?
2) Isn't it bot country?

Cheers,

Smurf

Re: Someone talk me out of...LIMCASH
 

I can't. I've been thinking of it too. Is the rake ridiculous at low limits? I've been playing limit tourney's at the $5 level trying to get acclimated.

+EV

Re: Someone talk me out of...LIMCASH
 

You will be paying a large rake, but 2/4 and above is certainly beatable. Don't play w/o rb.

Re: Someone talk me out of...LIMCASH
 

OK guys, thanks. You've successfully talked me out of it.

I'm not rolled for 2/4, HU or otherwise.

Mayber after I grow my roll some more grinding low limit NL cash games.

Re: Someone talk me out of...LIMCASH
 

I still need to be talked out of it after seeing Bryce's graph:

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...twomilblog.jpg

Re: Someone talk me out of...LIMCASH
 

Really depends on what your goals are, I think LHE is probably the least +EV game to learn at the moment unless you live near Commerce. As long as you have a passion for the game your playing you will make money, I think you can basically become rich in any poker game you enjoy that you can find consistent action at.

Re: Someone talk me out of...LIMCASH
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think LHE is probably the least +EV game to learn at the moment

[/ QUOTE ]

All LHE, or just UP limit vs HU NL?

Re: Someone talk me out of...LIMCASH
 

In general, I think learning something like PLO, Omaha8, Razz, Stud8 would all be more profitable, Stud might be less profitable to learn the LHE. Not to mention LHE has the most bots to worry about.

Re: Someone talk me out of...LIMCASH
 

forgive me if i'm wrong, but can't you play rake-free microlimits hu at wpx? id on't play there, but that's what i had assumed.

Re: Someone talk me out of...LIMCASH
 

Hey cwar

[ QUOTE ]
Not to mention LHE has the most bots to worry about

[/ QUOTE ]

In what games (HU,SH,FR), limits ($1-$2 etc.) and sites do you think bots are found?

Cheers,

Smurf

Re: Someone talk me out of...LIMCASH
 

I believe that Limit poker will last longer than No Limit. Even when I started out two years ago, there was not that many NL games going. If you ever expect to make good money, you must learn how to play all the forms of poker proficiently, as higher stake games tend to be mixed, with Limit blinds of 200/400, etc. It does not kill a person to learn Limit. I always say it because I believe it: A Limit player with no experience in a NL game will do far better than a NL player with no experience in a Limit game.

I think people are over-reacting to bots. The AI is not proficient enough to beat a 10/20 limit game. If there are bots at these levels, they are slightly losing and are multi-tabling for rb purposes. The bot that supposedly beat Phil Laak only played 1k hands.

Re: Someone talk me out of...LIMCASH
 

NL will last longer than LHE.

Re: Someone talk me out of...LIMCASH
 

It's only a matter of time before people can get their hands on game theory algorithms for limit hold em . When this happens , the games will dry up quickly .

Re: Someone talk me out of...LIMCASH
 

[ QUOTE ]
It's only a matter of time before people can get their hands on game theory algorithms for limit hold em . When this happens , the games will dry up quickly .

[/ QUOTE ]

disagree. fish will be fish, and they always will be.

Re: Someone talk me out of...LIMCASH
 

the biggest deterrent for me is the BR reqs. My hourly/BR ratio is higher at NLHUSNGs. That said I still enjoy HUlim alot. And that (limcash) is what I am playing for the most part now.

Re: Someone talk me out of...LIMCASH
 

[ QUOTE ]
I believe that Limit poker will last longer than No Limit. Even when I started out two years ago, there was not that many NL games going. If you ever expect to make good money, you must learn how to play all the forms of poker proficiently, as higher stake games tend to be mixed, with Limit blinds of 200/400, etc. It does not kill a person to learn Limit. I always say it because I believe it: A Limit player with no experience in a NL game will do far better than a NL player with no experience in a Limit game.

I think people are over-reacting to bots. The AI is not proficient enough to beat a 10/20 limit game. If there are bots at these levels, they are slightly losing and are multi-tabling for rb purposes. The bot that supposedly beat Phil Laak only played 1k hands.

[/ QUOTE ]
The AI is most certainly proficient enough and if not, very close.

Re: Someone talk me out of...LIMCASH
 

[ QUOTE ]
The bot that supposedly beat Phil Laak only played 1k hands.

[/ QUOTE ]
A bot that can beat *any* pro over any number of hands will certainly be capable of taking the average online player to the cleaner's.

They were able to beat the bot in round 2 buy recognizing specific tendencies and exploiting them, but what are the chances the average player is going to be capable of the same?