Squats and Deadlifts
 

1) Why do I hate squat days but love DL days, the difference in weight is negligible (somewhat) so I don't think its a lifting heavier thing.

2) What is the difference between a DL and a rack pull? Why do one and not the other? It seems like the rack pull is just a poor mans version of the DL.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

Squats are more taxing on your hips, I guess?

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

1) I'd guess you are acquiring more fatigue from the squat-- assuming that you aren't simply more confident in one movement than the other.

2) The RP provides assistance for the DL.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

With squats, a heavy ass weight is trying to crush you and this can be a bit scary I guess. I'm pretty sure squats are also more taxing on your CNS, which generally just makes you feel miserable.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

Good squats require a lot more flexibility. I dunno I'd way rather squat heavy, I love DL's but a good squat day makes me feel like a killer.

RP's are just a partial DL. For many people the end of the DL is the hardest part so you work the RP to bomb that portion. Also it's safer for people who don't have the hammie flexibility to keep good shape at the bottom of the DL.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

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For many people the end of the DL is the hardest part so you work the RP to bomb that portion.

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I think the principle at work is more like when overloading the eccentric part of an exercise, even thought the eccentric is stronger.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

doing heavy rack pulls will also allow you to lift a much larger load, overload your upper back and trips, train your grip etc...it takes a bit of the focus off the hams/hips/lower back and places it on the glutes/upperback/trap muscles...

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

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What is the difference between a DL and a rack pull?

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The idea is to eliminate the first stage of the DL which works the hamstrings the hardest, and focus on the second stage which works the muscles of the lower back the hardest.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

So, Should I alternate between DL adn RP?

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

[ QUOTE ]
So, Should I alternate between DL adn RP?

[/ QUOTE ]

There is no reason to alternate. You may want to throw in RPs instead of DLs every so often to keep things mixed up a bit.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

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So, Should I alternate between DL adn RP?

[/ QUOTE ]i sometimes do rack pulls on my deadlift days...begin the day w/ full deads and end with rack pulls...

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

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[ QUOTE ]
So, Should I alternate between DL adn RP?

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There is no reason to alternate. You may want to throw in RPs instead of DLs every so often to keep things mixed up a bit.

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That's what I meant.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

Don't think this is worth it's own thread so I'll just ask here. What's the best way to stop giant callouses from forming on my hands after DLs? After just a couple of reps, my skin starts peeling and all that fun stuff. It never has enough time to heal before my next workout at this point, so my skin is constantly rough and blistery in those parts. Given than my school gym apparently doesn't allow chalk, should I get gloves, adjust my grip, or just suck it up and deal with it?

This is a big part of the reason why I am the exact opposite as the OP in my preference.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

gloves will reduce the callouses, but have their own set of problems...difficulty w/ gripping and increasing bar cirumference...

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

grip it more in the fingers, cuz it will slide down there anyways. The sliding is mostly what is tearing your hands up, but they will probably still get messed up anyways. Also, get a callus file so you don't build up a bunch of dead skin and exacerbate the problem.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

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just suck it up and deal with it?


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Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

Ugh I hate doing deadlifts at my gym with no Olympic platform, what with having to load all the weights on the ground [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

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Given than my school gym apparently doesn't allow chalk, should I get gloves, adjust my grip, or just suck it up and deal with it?

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This is b.s. Buy your own and chalk your hands on the sly.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

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grip it more in the fingers, cuz it will slide down there anyways. The sliding is mostly what is tearing your hands up, but they will probably still get messed up anyways. Also, get a callus file so you don't build up a bunch of dead skin and exacerbate the problem.

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blackkeys, so I take it that lowering your grip on the bar helped you.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

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[ QUOTE ]
grip it more in the fingers, cuz it will slide down there anyways. The sliding is mostly what is tearing your hands up, but they will probably still get messed up anyways. Also, get a callus file so you don't build up a bunch of dead skin and exacerbate the problem.

[/ QUOTE ]

blackkeys, so I take it that lowering your grip on the bar helped you.

[/ QUOTE ]
somewhat

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

[ QUOTE ]
Don't think this is worth it's own thread so I'll just ask here. What's the best way to stop giant callouses from forming on my hands after DLs? After just a couple of reps, my skin starts peeling and all that fun stuff. It never has enough time to heal before my next workout at this point, so my skin is constantly rough and blistery in those parts. Given than my school gym apparently doesn't allow chalk, should I get gloves, adjust my grip, or just suck it up and deal with it?

This is a big part of the reason why I am the exact opposite as the OP in my preference.

[/ QUOTE ]

I have this problem big time and it's pretty much why I stopped doing dead lifts. After a while I felt like the limiting factor was more my grip than my muscles.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

Anybody else LOOOOOOOOVE doing them both, heavy, on the same day? Gets me excited about tomorrow just thinking about it.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Don't think this is worth it's own thread so I'll just ask here. What's the best way to stop giant callouses from forming on my hands after DLs? After just a couple of reps, my skin starts peeling and all that fun stuff. It never has enough time to heal before my next workout at this point, so my skin is constantly rough and blistery in those parts. Given than my school gym apparently doesn't allow chalk, should I get gloves, adjust my grip, or just suck it up and deal with it?

This is a big part of the reason why I am the exact opposite as the OP in my preference.

[/ QUOTE ]

I have this problem big time and it's pretty much why I stopped doing dead lifts. After a while I felt like the limiting factor was more my grip than my muscles.

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It probably is for most people. That's why lots use straps, gloves, etc. A little work on a gripper will toughen your hands a lot and make holding deadlifts pretty easy.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

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should I get gloves

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*grunch*

It is a personal decision. The biggest drawback is you sacrifice a lot as far developing grip strength by using gloves. The main benefit is protecting your hands. I've heard that people in certain jobs should use gloves during weightlifting so that they can do their jobs better/longer.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

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Anybody else LOOOOOOOOVE doing them both, heavy, on the same day? Gets me excited about tomorrow just thinking about it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not a big fan of the nausea, especially if I know I have to go to work for 8 hours after.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

Ok thanks guys. I've tried lowering my grip a couple of times before, but it felt really unnatural and hurt my fingers so I went back. I guess I'll try to stick with it this time. I've heard mixed things about gloves similar to the concerns in this thread, so I'll probably hold off on those unless I feel I really need them. How useful are the grippers, and how valuable is having a strong grip anyway aside from DLs?

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

[ QUOTE ]
Anybody else LOOOOOOOOVE doing them both, heavy, on the same day? Gets me excited about tomorrow just thinking about it.

[/ QUOTE ]

[censored] yeah.

The feeling of accomplishment after a heavy leg day is the best. I walk home feeling like I'm John Wayne or something.

Alex - how useful is having a strong grip?
To answer a question with more questions:
Do you ever get introduced to people? Open jars? Does everything you want to pick up off the ground in the real world have nice little handles and straps on it? Do you ever wear t-shirts?(grip strength = big forearms).

[censored], I sound like I've drunk the captain crush koolaid :S

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Anybody else LOOOOOOOOVE doing them both, heavy, on the same day? Gets me excited about tomorrow just thinking about it.

[/ QUOTE ]

[censored] yeah.

The feeling of accomplishment after a heavy leg day is the best. I walk home feeling like I'm John Wayne or something.

Alex - how useful is having a strong grip?
To answer a question with more questions:
Do you ever get introduced to people? Open jars? Does everything you want to pick up off the ground in the real world have nice little handles and straps on it? Do you ever wear t-shirts?(grip strength = big forearms).

[censored], I sound like I've drunk the captain crush koolaid :S

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ok, im all for haivng a strong grip, but its kind of ridiculous to say that you shouldn't use straps or try gloves because they hurt your grip strength. i highly doubt you will come across a situation during normal life where the limiting factor is grip i fyou can deadlift over 225 (random number than would take a bit of training to achieve)...but preventing yourself from pulling 405 or whatever cuz you don't want to use straps will cause more problems than having the grip strength to lift 305, but not 405...hopefully this makes some sense...

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

If you've never used straps, you should never have a problem imo. Your grip should progress at about the same speed as your deadlift.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

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If you've never used straps, you should never have a problem imo. Your grip should progress at about the same speed as your deadlift.

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this might be true for pulling singles...but when i increae the reps then my grip will almost always fail/slip befor my hams/back...

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

When you're doing reps, reset after each rep. This will solve your problem with grip. I hope you're not one of those guys who bounces the bar and keeps repping out...ugh.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

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i highly doubt you will come across a situation during normal life where the limiting factor is grip i fyou can deadlift over 225 (random number than would take a bit of training to achieve)..

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I think the exact opposite is true, I find that in real-world strength scenarios my grip and finger strength usually fails before anything else. Any time I try to lift something heavy and awkward it's always hand/grip that fails way before my ability to just lift the weight.

In fact I would say one of the biggest differences between the average powerlifter and a World's Strongest Man type of guy is grip strength.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

Grip strength is good in everything from lifting up unbalanced loads to shooting to martial arts to golf and tennis. Since you use your hands for everything, it's pretty versatile. You can also train it extremely quickly, as in, a month or two of serious training will provide an absolutely drastic increase in strength. For the tiny investment in working grip strength, you get a big enough pay-off that you really might as well.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

I assume most of you already use a reverse grip (one hand supinated, one hand pronated) while deadlifting. For any that do not, this hand position will greatly increase grip while deadlifting.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

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I assume most of you already use a reverse grip (one hand supinated, one hand pronated) while deadlifting. For any that do not, this hand position will greatly increase grip while deadlifting.

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Could you say some more about this? I've always done dual-overhand grips. When you use the reverse grip, what's the best way to do it?

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

not much to say about it...you can do either hand either way..I usually alternate. also, ur dual overhand is very hard on grip..i think people train for grip strength by doing that type of deadlift

-Mike

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

yeah, i do double overhand as heavy as i can then i switch to an over/under...just remember to keep your arms straight and dont allow yourself to bend your elbow when starting the lift...

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

I always over/under unless doing a DL variant that I can use overhand for the whole thing.

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

he's back!

Re: Squats and Deadlifts
 

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not much to say about it...you can do either hand either way..I usually alternate. also, ur dual overhand is very hard on grip..i think people train for grip strength by doing that type of deadlift

-Mike

[/ QUOTE ]
just to be clear, you shouldn't ever have both palms facing away from you. One or the other, or neither. Not sure that the above was clear to someone who doesn't know and I didn't want anyone to pull a muscle doing that.