Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

I want to first note that over 25,000 hands at Party mid-stakes, I have seen exactly ONE 4bet-shove, and I didn't call it.

I'm playing a little on the tight side here. Villain is 23/20/2 over 600 and has been at the table for maybe 25 hands, and my numbers are probably like 12/8 for that period. The cold-caller is a 55/33 fish.

Villain took about two seconds to shove.



Party Poker, $3/$6 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 5 Players
LegoPoker Hand History Converter

BTN: $987.75
SB: $119.50
Hero (BB): $968.60
UTG: $669.25
CO: $600

Pre-Flop: K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (BB)
UTG folds, <font color="red">CO raises to $22</font>, BTN calls $22, SB folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $97</font>, <font color="red">CO raises to $600 and is All-In, BTN folds

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

easy call

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

last time this happened to me it was AA

also, this is a not a squeeze, I really think its close either way, 500 to win 700, giving him a generous range of JJ, AQs+ you have 45%..

meh id call most of the time, but against a tight player with no history I lean towards fold.

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

he has AK too or worse, insta call

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

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I really think its close either way

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It's really not

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

this is usually AA KK AK (QQ) i call depending on my mood but i think its often a fold without some history

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

But it's so pretty [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

And I fold this without too much thought. I mean, it's a super rare situation but he never ever has AQ here.

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

Call. Villain probably has you on a squeeze. If he has AA or KK, then bummer. Wouldn't be surprised to see a middle pair or Ax here.

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

[ QUOTE ]
But it's so pretty [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

And I fold this without too much thought. I mean, it's a super rare situation but he never ever has AQ here.

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unless you have played in the party 3/6 games (or equivalent games on ftp/stars etc) i don't think you should comment on this hand.

trust me, AK is a snaaaap call here, and i'd consider calling AQ too.

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

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trust me, AK is a snaaaap call here, and i'd consider calling AQ too.

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I'd never call with AQ if i was OP here since he seems pretty tight/conservative, but with a squeezy/aggro image like most regs i can see a call.

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

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I want to first note that over 25,000 hands at Party mid-stakes, I have seen exactly ONE 4bet-shove

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it's a super rare situation

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wtf are you guys playing party.net?

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

I think this is a fairly easy fold. People do this with AA/KK a lot more then you think, and if it isn't one of these, he probably has AK too. I doubt you see AQ or race hands often enough to make calling with these odds profitable.

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

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I think this is a fairly easy fold. People do this with AA/KK a lot more then you think, and if it isn't one of these, he probably has AK too. I doubt you see AQ or race hands often enough to make calling with these odds profitable.

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with all due respect, you really aren't qualified to comment on the ranges of regs unless you play in these games, i'm certain that anyone decent who does will say this is a very easy call.

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
But it's so pretty [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

And I fold this without too much thought. I mean, it's a super rare situation but he never ever has AQ here.

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unless you have played in the party 3/6 games (or equivalent games on ftp/stars etc) i don't think you should comment on this hand.

trust me, AK is a snaaaap call here, and i'd consider calling AQ too.

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I do and do (UKer [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]) You really think he 4-bet shoves cold worse than AK for a full stack??

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
But it's so pretty [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

And I fold this without too much thought. I mean, it's a super rare situation but he never ever has AQ here.

[/ QUOTE ]

unless you have played in the party 3/6 games (or equivalent games on ftp/stars etc) i don't think you should comment on this hand.

trust me, AK is a snaaaap call here, and i'd consider calling AQ too.

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I do and do (UKer [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]) You really think he 4-bet shoves cold worse than AK for a full stack??

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unless OP is a total nit (which may well be the case), yes.

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

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I think this is a fairly easy fold. People do this with AA/KK a lot more then you think, and if it isn't one of these, he probably has AK too. I doubt you see AQ or race hands often enough to make calling with these odds profitable.

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with all due respect, you really aren't qualified to comment on the ranges of regs unless you play in these games, i'm certain that anyone decent who does will say this is a very easy call.

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i do, and i disagree
if someone had called the 3bet i think i would call most of the time

Fion range villain then...i would argue that we are almost never dominating villain and more often than not (especially with insta shove) we are a big dog

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

wow, super easy fist pump call.

oh, wait. 12/8?? jesus, are you usually this tight? this might actually be a fold... if you're anything but the nittiest of nits this is a call though.

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

I meant I'd been running about 12/8 over the 25 hands since he joined the table &amp; I haven't done anything remotely out of line or anything like that. If he had a decent sample on me, I would come up something like 22/17.

Also of note, I have 4-shoved a fair amount into 3bets and 3bet squeezes, and I have been looked up a LOT by AK, as well as a couple of QQ's and even a JJ, so this guy would probably expect calls from a similar range if he 4bet-shoves with any regularity.

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

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I meant I'd been running about 12/8 over the 25 hands since he joined the table

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That means nothing, he's probably multi-tabling, sees you are ~22/17 over a decent sample and assumes you are squeezing.

Who is villain btw?

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

Yeah if u are a reg just assume all other regs got +3k hands on you, he's prolly just gonna look at ur stats, see 22/17 and then hes gonna felt anything decent.

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

I hope it doesn't mean 'nothing' that I've folded almost every hand for 25 hands, for his sake. I'm not sure if it's smart to assume all $3/6 regulars are adjusting me 100% based on three PT stats, because I certainly don't. His SN is Ottopigen.

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

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he has AK too or worse, insta call

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Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

This thread makes my head hurt. Call FFS.

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

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If he had a decent sample on me, I would come up something like 22/17.


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callcalclalalacalxall!!!!!

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

I definately call. I had a situation today where someone 4bet shoved 77 over my 3-bet for 100bb. So its definately possible people are doing this with a wide range.

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

anyone who folds here makes me sad

instacall

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
But it's so pretty [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

And I fold this without too much thought. I mean, it's a super rare situation but he never ever has AQ here.

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unless you have played in the party 3/6 games (or equivalent games on ftp/stars etc) i don't think you should comment on this hand.

trust me, AK is a snaaaap call here, and i'd consider calling AQ too.

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I do and do (UKer [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]) You really think he 4-bet shoves cold worse than AK for a full stack??

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its not a cold 4-bet and this is such a snapler

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

Pretty sure you have to KNOW he's only doing this w/ AA or KK to make this a fold.

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

even if it's very slightly -ev I prefer to gamble. Can't let people push you around. Give them all the variance they want

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

Put your cursor over the Call button and get ready to yell HEARTS HEARTS HEARTS HEARTS

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

Kind of silly to comment that I have to be specifically a PartyPoker 600 NL regular to have an idea on how to comment on a hand. Also particularly interesting that most of 2p2 is instacalling here with AKs, seems rather exploitable if you ask me.

Can anyone here really have a range that includes mostly AK or worse? Honestly unless I'm insane there can't be that many players, Party or otherwise, in a rush to send in a full buy in here with AT, AJ, AQ, etc. I will repeat that IMO there are more people then you think who play AA/KK in this fashion.

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

dude this is such a common spot for the CO to re-squeeze

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

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easy call

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who snap shoves KK/AA, honestly. he probably has like AQc here, goooooo

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

wtf about u seeing ONE 4bet shove in 25 THOUSAND hands?

i play lower stakes and 4bet shove preflop over a 3bet like once every few hundred hands at least.

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

Move down?

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

uhhh.. AKs is the nuts here. Now if you had AQ or JJ that makes things interesting

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

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This thread makes my head hurt. Call FFS.

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Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

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Kind of silly to comment that I have to be specifically a PartyPoker 600 NL regular to have an idea on how to comment on a hand. Also particularly interesting that most of 2p2 is instacalling here with AKs, seems rather exploitable if you ask me.

Can anyone here really have a range that includes mostly AK or worse? Honestly unless I'm insane there can't be that many players, Party or otherwise, in a rush to send in a full buy in here with AT, AJ, AQ, etc. I will repeat that IMO there are more people then you think who play AA/KK in this fashion.


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In other games (especially live) calling here might be -EV, but it is definitely not in these games, and it is NOT silly to suggest what i did, the reason being that you have 0 experience of the players thus can not predict an accurate hand range. You may think it's ridiculous for villain to shove A5s here, but it in fact is not and DOES happen, so folding AK here is nothing short of horrendous

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

The whole issue about asking 600nl party regs to comment on the hand is because that game plays super aggro almost spastic preflop at times. If you havent or dont play in that game your hand range estimations are going to wayyyy off, as demonstrated by ppl thinking hes only shoving AA KK AK and maybe AK. His range in this spot is super wide imo.

edit: Didnt see the post above, pretty close to what i wanted to say. Folding = BAD

Re: Party 600 - I squeeze AKs, and he insta-shoves
 

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wtf about u seeing ONE 4bet shove in 25 THOUSAND hands?

i play lower stakes and 4bet shove preflop over a 3bet like once every few hundred hands at least.

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I do too, I mentioned it. I get looked up by AK a lot and JJ/QQ from time to time. This means this guy probably does too.

Again, this guy probably expects to be called by AK and QQ and maybe JJ.