Yes?
 

Villains first orbit at the table. I usually donk flop, but if I don't this is the line I should take?

Full Tilt Poker, $0.50/$1 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players
LegoPoker Hand History Converter

Hero (MP): $98.50
CO: $100
BTN: $361.40
SB: $147.40
BB: $289.25
UTG: $99

Pre-Flop: J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (MP)
UTG calls $1, <font color="red">Hero raises to $4.50</font>, <font color="red">CO raises to $14</font>, 4 folds, Hero calls $9.50

Flop: ($30.50) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
Hero checks, CO checks

Turn: ($30.50) A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players)
Hero checks, CO checks

River: ($30.50) 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 Players)
Hero checks, \

Re: Yes?
 

you should make like a 1/2 pot turn lead, even with the ace being a scare card you should still bet it and go for value on the riv

Re: Yes?
 

Donking the flop is terrible.

I'm bombing the turn and river.

Re: Yes?
 

No. Bet the flop. If you dont then bet the turn. You go for a check raise on that board it screams set. You bet the turn big and villain calls with AK/AQ and then you make a decent bet on the river.

Re: Yes?
 

[ QUOTE ]
No. Bet the flop. If you dont then bet the turn. You go for a check raise on that board it screams set. You bet the turn big and villain calls with AK/AQ and then you make a decent bet on the river.

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Losing value from CB/semibluffs on the flop because you think people will fold an overpair = lol.

Re: Yes?
 

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You go for a check raise on that board it screams set.

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WTF?

Re: Yes?
 

Yeah you need to check the flop since he'll fire the majority of his assumed/standard 3bet range (TT+, AQ+).

I like a turn lead of about $22 since I think an A is a large part of his range and you're likely to get called.

Re: Yes?
 

bet turn i think, id want some sort of read to go for a c/r even though i think what you did was ok, i just assume a random players calling range &gt; beting range

Re: Yes?
 

I think you should lead turn.

Hands like AK/AQ/KK/QQ will surely call a turn lead, but may go for "pot control" if you check.

I think river is good as played. I guess you figure he "has" to throw out a value bet now, huh? If he has a weak hand he's probably not calling, so river c/r may be best.

Re: Yes?
 

Am I the only one who thinks he'll definitely fold AQ, and sometimes even AK if i pot/pot?

Re: Yes?
 

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Hero (MP): $98.50


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you lost value here imo

Re: Yes?
 

If Villain is somewhat competent, he's not going to be firing this flop without a good hand considering how it smashes a lot of our range. I don't think you're going to be able to get him to bet with air as much as some of you are thinking.

I bet the turn for sure though.

Re: Yes?
 

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Am I the only one who thinks he'll definitely fold AQ, and sometimes even AK if i pot/pot?

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you and fgators26

Re: Yes?
 

bet the turn usually, if you check it check river though

Re: Yes?
 

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Am I the only one who thinks he'll definitely fold AQ, and sometimes even AK if i pot/pot?

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whereas a cr will scream weakness?

Re: Yes?
 

I wasn't check/raising turn...

Re: Yes?
 

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Am I the only one who thinks he'll definitely fold AQ, and sometimes even AK if i pot/pot?

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whereas a cr will scream weakness?

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DING DING DING

Re: Yes?
 

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Am I the only one who thinks he'll definitely fold AQ, and sometimes even AK if i pot/pot?

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you and fgators26

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DING DING DING

Re: Yes?
 

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I think you should lead turn.

Hands like AK/AQ/KK/QQ will surely call a turn lead, but may go for "pot control" if you check.

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DING DING DING

Re: Yes?
 

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I wasn't check/raising turn...

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oh, then i dont like it at all.

Re: Yes?
 

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I wasn't check/raising turn...

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oh, then i dont like it at all.

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Well actually I planned on checking turn+ river, cuz he should def bet AK which is what I figured he must have after checking flop.

People don't checkback QQ,KK, AA on the flop imo.

Re: Yes?
 

not often, but it happens. Also, he might check back river with AK after betting the turn. Random 100nl players suck sooo bad.

Re: Yes?
 

didn't read OP or any replies...

no

Re: Yes?
 

Ok now i read it...

no

Re: Yes?
 

yes.

Re: Yes?
 

Ok now i read some replies...

[x] Nielsio better than Fonkey?

Re: Yes?
 

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Am I the only one who thinks he'll definitely fold AQ, and sometimes even AK if i pot/pot?

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3/4 pot turn
3/5 pot river

Re: Yes?
 

ok i have changed my stance to a firm maybe.

seriously tho, ur playing an idiot at nl100 who hit top pair with AK in a RR pot. teh money is going in no matter what ur line may look like imo, so maybe turn is fine , but itd probbably be better to bet it, since it would really blow if a Q or K rolls off on the river.

Re: Yes?
 

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No. Bet the flop. If you dont then bet the turn. You go for a check raise on that board it screams set. You bet the turn big and villain calls with AK/AQ and then you make a decent bet on the river.

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Losing value from CB/semibluffs on the flop because you think people will fold an overpair = lol.

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I was talking about going for a turn check raise. I never said anything about folding an overpair on the flop.

Re: Yes?
 

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No. Bet the flop. If you dont then bet the turn. You go for a check raise on that board it screams set. You bet the turn big and villain calls with AK/AQ and then you make a decent bet on the river.

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Losing value from CB/semibluffs on the flop because you think people will fold an overpair = lol.

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I was talking about going for a turn check raise. I never said anything about folding an overpair on the flop.

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Ok, I agree turn bet &gt; turn c/r.

However, you still said bet the flop, which is bad.

Re: Yes?
 

My thinking was bet flop over pair + AKd will 3bet

Re: Yes?
 

I prefer betting turn, betting river. He won't fold AK and probably won't fold AQ either. If you check turn, definitely check river though.

What were you planning to do on the river after you check/call turn, if you weren't check/raising?

Re: Yes?
 

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My thinking was bet flop over pair + AKd will 3bet

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There's no logic to what you're saying.

Re: Yes?
 

No one is ever donk folding anymore in 3-bet pots. So if villain has half a brain you won't get bluffraised by AK or anything. Which is why betting flop sucks. Villain will bet/call KK+ on the flop and maybe QQ anyway. Betting only gives him a free way out with his AK/AQ hands.

Re: Yes?
 

Was gonna check/call turn then donk river.

Re: Yes?
 

how do we not bet turn here??

if ur gonna check turn, i guess check river, but i just don't like the play in general

Re: Yes?
 

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My thinking was bet flop over pair + AKd will 3bet

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There's no logic to what you're saying.

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Serious question: Do you never donk a set into a pf raiser?

Re: Yes?
 

1.)Not going for a c/r here is dumb. Villain here continues with a wide part of his range and is callig with a wide part of his range.
2.)Not leading the turn/river is dumb.

Srsly

Re: Yes?
 

[ QUOTE ]
1.)Not going for a c/r here is dumb. Villain here continues with a wide part of his range and is callig with a wide part of his range.
2.)Not leading the turn/river is dumb.

Srsly

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I was going to check/raise flop but my plan was foiled.

Re: Yes?
 

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My thinking was bet flop over pair + AKd will 3bet

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There's no logic to what you're saying.

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I believe leading the flop is best. I am not a big fan of trying to get value from hands I can't get much value from anyway, unless I get lucky.

If he decides to c.bet with AK anyway after you lead (which I do sometimes against aggro people, since I certainly see it coming from pp's from time to time) you can just call and hope for an A or K, where you will stack him.

Not leading here may be otherwise nice, but if it is only to get value from AK/AQ, then imo it is wrong. However, if you think your chances to stack AA/QQ is best when you do this, it is certainly possible.