bluffing with no reads or history
 

villain is 26/22, 22wtsd, 54wwsf, 3.62/6.88/17/3 AF over 1.2k hands. only read i have are those stats. he is running at 26ptbb over this sample.


Full Tilt Poker, $10/$20 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 6 Players
LegoPoker Hand History Converter

UTG: $3,072
MP: $2,048
CO: $4,112.50
Hero (BTN): $1,970
SB: $2,058
BB: $2,000

Pre-Flop: A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (BTN)
3 folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $60</font>, SB folds, BB calls $40

Flop: ($130) 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
BB checks, <font color="red">Hero bets $100</font>, <font color="red">BB raises to $300</font>, <font color="red">Hero raises to $600</font>

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

54wwsf, this looks super high to me, are some of the stats from HU? Otherwise he must be trying to take down pots at all costs.

Is this why you poped him?

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

Looks good.

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

When I continue with air in these spots I usually float the checkraise, planning on taking it away if he checks or bet smallish on turn, since a small flop 3bet seems to represent a pretty narrow range and looks kinda bluffy.

Maybe I am wrong though, maybe your small raise actually looks like a really strong reverse Yeti? How would you play jj+ here?

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

it seems like a good spot to get rebluffed.

I guess your raise really depends on the dynamic of the match, but I would prefer actually having a hand if I take this line.

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

does he know yeti theorum? floating and shoving turn/betting when checked to looks better than this, no?

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

the flush is out so yeti does not fully apply (it's still a dry board so it's not completely out)

if you would do the same with JJ+ often then I don't mind this; floating him to steal on turn may be OK too

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

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the flush is out so yeti does not fully apply (it's still a dry board so it's not completely out)

if you would do the same with JJ+ often then I don't mind this; floating him to steal on turn may be OK too

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they have no hands together so how does balance matter here?

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

call when he shoves

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

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call when he shoves

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I was gonna say something along these lines, because otherwise you are just giving diamonds a pass at free money here (by getting alot of your stack with the worst hand without racing). That said I dont like to get it in here, so I guess I dont like the play very much

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

it's so much better with aJ

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

do you ever make this play with AA, AT, or a 3?

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

id rather 3bet with KT here

anyone like calling the flop c/r ?

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

ye, if also prefer calling and shoving the turn.

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

You have no read that his donk is a weak/ probe bet. He is killing it over a small sample. There is a diamond draw out which if he has he is probably moving in on you and yet the only options I am hearing are float and bluff turn or bluff flop which looks more like a bluff than anything else. I like a fold here on the flop until I know what a donk from him means.

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

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id rather 3bet with KT here

anyone like calling the flop c/r ?

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Only if he isn't that likely to fire the turn again and we can pick up the pot there.

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

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do you ever make this play with AA, AT, or a 3?

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not really an issue at this point since there is no history. the issue is whether he thinks you would.

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

also probably a good flop to check with this particular hand.

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

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id rather 3bet with KT here

anyone like calling the flop c/r ?

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Only if he isn't that likely to fire the turn again and we can pick up the pot there.

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well duhhhhh, but all we know is that hes unknown

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

i think a flop check may be kinda standard
but w/e that doesnt really matter...

if my read was that he can let this go i think i would float the CR-but either way this gets kinda gross-which is why i think i ilke a flop check

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

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id rather 3bet with KT here

anyone like calling the flop c/r ?

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Only if he isn't that likely to fire the turn again and we can pick up the pot there.

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well duhhhhh, but all we know is that hes unknown

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Then I don't understand why you would ask that, being that there is no good answer since duhhhhhhh he is unknown.

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

sure there can be a good answer, you can still make assumptions based on unknowns

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

ok fair nuff. Against a complete unknown I wouldn't call the flop c/r because I think it's too high variance without knowing anything about villain. I'm curious about your thoughts.

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

always be the first to bluff

i sincerely doubt you are getting rebluffed here, though your line is super bluffy

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

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call when he shoves

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Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

I think calling and shoving over his turn bet (on a blank) is better than 3bet bluffing this particular flop, imo.

You'll get more money out of him when he is bluffing by taking this line although you do risk a little more. With a W$SF that high though he is probably super aggressive and is bluffing the flop very often.

Just to be clear, are you calling or folding if he shoves over your flop 3bet?

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

I like it and probably call a shove, but agree calling a shove would be way better with AJ

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

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call when he shoves

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are you guys being serious?

i folded to a shove.

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

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I think calling and shoving over his turn bet (on a blank) is better than 3bet bluffing this particular flop, imo.

You'll get more money out of him when he is bluffing by taking this line although you do risk a little more. With a W$SF that high though he is probably super aggressive and is bluffing the flop very often.

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Yeah.. it sucks making bluffs when you can be re-bluffed and taken off of the "best hand"..

I'd much rather call and shove turn if I'm getting frisky... which is something I rarely do against unknowns..

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

Terrible advice in this this thread. WTF at calling a shove. And we shouldn't care too much if he rebluffs us here, and I don't think he has a FD too often either.

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

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I think calling and shoving over his turn bet (on a blank) is better than 3bet bluffing this particular flop, imo.

You'll get more money out of him when he is bluffing by taking this line although you do risk a little more. With a W$SF that high though he is probably super aggressive and is bluffing the flop very often.

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Yeah.. it sucks making bluffs when you can be re-bluffed and taken off of the "best hand"..

I'd much rather call and shove turn if I'm getting frisky... which is something I rarely do against unknowns..

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I think this is best

Re: bluffing with no reads or history
 

i like checking flop more i think