4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

just starting a table up. this is like our 8th hand, v has open completed a few times, called and folded to my raises. nothing big, no rivers seen at this point.

pre and flop is just how i played it this time, sometimes 3b pre sometimes call...flop sometimes lead sometimes c/r.. whatever

Full Tilt Poker, $1/$2 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 2 Players
LegoPoker Hand History Converter

Hero (BB): $219.50
SB: $179.80

Pre-Flop: A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (BB)
<font color="red">SB raises to $6</font>, Hero calls $4

Flop: ($12) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
Hero checks, <font color="red">SB bets $11</font>, Hero calls $11

Turn: ($34) 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 Players)
Hero checks, <font color="red">SB bets $22</font>, Hero calls $22

River: ($78) 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">Hero bets $64</font>, <font color="red">SB raises to $128</font>

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

just call, if he has QJ cooler

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

first 3 streets are whatever, can go either way assuming you dont fold.

river, I like betting but I think you gotta go more like 45-50 to get calls from sets/2pr, maybe a frustrated ace. as played just call the raise, obv.

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

[ QUOTE ]
just call, if he has QJ cooler

[/ QUOTE ]

i had zero intention of 3 bagging. was wondering if i should call these always (minus a sick read) and bet size.

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

you're getting 4:1 and you have the second nuts. Never fold

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

idk, looks like the hand played itself if you didn't fold on the end. I think river bet sizing is actually ok. What's the question again?

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

[ QUOTE ]
idk, looks like the hand played itself if you didn't fold on the end. I think river bet sizing is actually ok. What's the question again?

[/ QUOTE ]


mostly bet sizing, however i have played a lot of hands like this and never questioned my calls here....figured i might as well ask just to be sure. dont worry i wont ask if i should ever fold AA preflop [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

PS. River is a push, not a call. Villain has only $12 left behind and calls with all of his range which includes more hands that Hero beats then the one hand that beats Hero.

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

yeah i did push in the last 12.

vill had obj QJ...obvious that it drove me to ask a standard question.

aj, why DO you like the bet size? someone stated the case for smaller.

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

[ QUOTE ]
PS. River is a push, not a call. Villain has only $12 left behind and calls with all of his range which includes more hands that Hero beats then the one hand that beats Hero.

[/ QUOTE ]

...??? so what if hes only got 12 left on the river. who bluff min raises a psb on the river this shallow? hero's chopping/beat

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

no, river is not a push. Even if you have 1c left, don't put it in.

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

yeah thinking about it for 10 seconds makes me realize shoving on for the last 12 is silly.

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
PS. River is a push, not a call. Villain has only $12 left behind and calls with all of his range which includes more hands that Hero beats then the one hand that beats Hero.

[/ QUOTE ]

...??? so what if hes only got 12 left on the river. who bluff min raises a psb on the river this shallow? hero's chopping/beat

[/ QUOTE ]

id say his minraise instead of a push hugely favors a lone jack, ur getting 4:1, easy call, he might even have something really dumb like aces (not saying u should call hoping for that though)

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

[ QUOTE ]
yeah thinking about it for 10 seconds makes me realize shoving on for the last 12 is silly.

[/ QUOTE ]

No it's not.

Villain beats you with one hand. You are going to split alot. And an unknown who has open completed a couple times in 8 hands is maybe not the best player ever...and he can easily turn his hand into a bluff hoping you can't call without a Jack. He might have a 7, he might have 2pr or a set or w/e. IMO he has those hands more than he does have QJ and so you should push because he can't fold anything for $12.

Basically, we just eliminate the single jacks from his range. If we think he has QJ 51% of time compared to his other hands, we just call. I happen to think it's a push because he has the other hands more and it's certainly not silly.

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

meh i mean i shoved at the time with the same thought process as you just laid out so i didnt think it was THAT silly [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] still, thinking on it i think that that last $12 is -EV and only did it because its 'only' $12 which is a silly was to operate.

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

ok. [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

and tbh, it's probably 1bb in EV either way.

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

[ QUOTE ]
Basically, we just eliminate the single jacks from his range. If we think he has QJ 51% of time compared to his other hands, we just call. I happen to think it's a push because he has the other hands more and it's certainly not silly.

[/ QUOTE ]

if that's your thought process then fair enough. It wasn't clear from your last post.

However, I think we're definitely behind his range here.

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

wow, stick it in and stop being pussies, its [censored] HU on the 8th hand, hes likely a donk, you are only losing to 1 hand, and he isnt folding if he has anything on the river for 12$

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

lol i don't think being a pussy has anything to do with anything. it's a poker decision that can likely go either way.

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

[ QUOTE ]
wow, stick it in and stop being pussies, its [censored] HU on the 8th hand, hes likely a donk, you are only losing to 1 hand, and he isnt folding if he has anything on the river for 12$

[/ QUOTE ]

this is the thinking (that i used) i thought was silly fwiw

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

are u kids on crack. river is a snap shove for the extra $12

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

[ QUOTE ]
are u kids on crack. river is a snap shove for the extra $12

[/ QUOTE ]

cmon man its not snap if you think about it

Re: 4 straight on board, vill raising my donk
 

im pretty sure the only reason i wouldnt HU here, is to slowroll