Ciaffones books
 

I'm mainly playing cash games these days. Which one of his books should I go for first, 'Improve your poker' or 'Pot Limit and No Limit poker'?

Re: Ciaffones books
 

[ QUOTE ]
I'm mainly playing cash games these days. Which one of his books should I go for first, 'Improve your poker' or 'Pot Limit and No Limit poker'?

[/ QUOTE ]

For limit HE you only need the former for no limit you need both.

Re: Ciaffones books
 

I only play No Limit (should've put that in the original post).

Re: Ciaffones books
 

Improve Your Poker is probably one of my favorite poker books ever. Well worth your time.

Pot Limit and No Limit is good, but these days other poker books are better.

Bob was suppose to be coming out with a new NL hold'em cash game book, but I doubt that will ever happen.

Re: Ciaffones books
 

Read some articles whe wrote a while back and just remember thinking his advice and the way he explained things was excellent.

Re: Ciaffones books
 

Hes supposed to be comiong out with a new book, um, maybe like by 2010

Re: Ciaffones books
 

[ QUOTE ]
I only play No Limit (should've put that in the original post).

[/ QUOTE ]

I really like PL&NLP and I think it's still relevant even if only a small part of the book covers NLHE.

Re: Ciaffones books
 

I think IYP is great. I have too many poker books, and it's one of my favorites. I'd get that one.

Re: Ciaffones books
 

One thing to know re: IYP is that Ciaffone is far tighter early in hands than some believe is strategically optimal.

Re: Ciaffones books
 

Improve your poker is great. All Ciaffones books are very good though and well read-worthy, best poker authour imo.

Re: Ciaffones books
 

and he has a nl cash game book that has been promised for a few yrs, what a shame

Re: Ciaffones books
 

u serious NL&PL is the most overrated book IMO, worst i've ever read (of 5-7 books), he just talks how he played big games... lol

folding middle set, wtf? or was it bottom?

Re: Ciaffones books
 

[ QUOTE ]
u serious NL&PL is the most overrated book IMO, worst i've ever read (of 5-7 books), he just talks how he played big games... lol

folding middle set, wtf? or was it bottom?

[/ QUOTE ]


I don't think the "big games" criticism is accurate, but I do think the book is overrated because it feels thin somehow. It also contains a lot of info on bizarre PL/NL games that I don't think is terribly useful. It's still good, but I don't think it's great.

On the hand in question, Ciaffone laid down bottom set on the flop, and it was because he was putting everyone on hand ranges and couldn't figure out how he had good equity against this one specific player. It's actually pretty instructive analysis even if you think his assessment is overly tight/pessimistic.

Re: Ciaffones books
 

[ QUOTE ]
folding middle set, wtf? or was it bottom?


[/ QUOTE ]

Bottom set plays a lot better in games capped at 100bb buyin than it does when effective stacks are 500bb. You're almost always thrilled to get it all in with 100bb and bottom set, not true when you're a lot deeper, IMO.

(I can't recall the specific hand you reference, but iirc many of the hand examples are much deeper than 100bb, which of course a lot of today's games are capped at.)

Re: Ciaffones books
 

[ QUOTE ]
(I can't recall the specific hand you reference, but iirc many of the hand examples are much deeper than 100bb, which of course a lot of today's games are capped at.)

[/ QUOTE ]

IIRC it's the one where he has 22 in an unraised pot, he pots it on an 852 (maybe 952 or something similar) board and gets checkraised quite small by someone who'd obviously have raised AA-QQ pre and led other overpairs post

Re: Ciaffones books
 

lol back in the day i payed ciaffone $50 for lessons over the phone, even back then when i was playing 1/2 nlhe or whatever it was his advice wasnt good enough to help. wouldnt recommend him

Re: Ciaffones books
 

fatgirl, when is the book coming out?!?!?

Re: Ciaffones books
 

SOON ROBERTJOHN, i am working on it full time now until done

Re: Ciaffones books
 

Both books are great and his new book should be finished by the end of the year and published next year is my current guestimate. He made a comment in one of his latest articles.

Re: Ciaffones books
 

[ QUOTE ]
Both books are great and his new book should be finished by the end of the year and published next year is my current guestimate. He made a comment in one of his latest articles.

[/ QUOTE ]

In an interview I read he indicated the book would consist of his comments/instructions on hands his students submitted to him. There's a few of these types of analysis of his kicking around in cyberspace and some of them are pretty useful.

His books and articles can certainly reward serious study. He advocates a TAG style and all his books and (numerous) articles taken together give a comprehensive system for a TAG player. For me, studying his material almost exclusively makes more sense then jumping from author to author and system to system.

Re: Ciaffones books
 

[ QUOTE ]
Both books are great and his new book should be finished by the end of the year and published next year is my current guestimate. He made a comment in one of his latest articles.

[/ QUOTE ]

I assume that you are talking about his no limit book. This is the same no limit book that he told me would be finished by the end of 2004. In early 2005 he told me he got caught up in other projects but it would be out no later then the end of 2005. In 2006 he claimed that it was in the final editing stage and I would see a copy no later then the end of 2006. I will believe it only when I see an actual finished copy.

Re: Ciaffones books
 

Reid neither, and read the Flynn/Mehta book here instead.

Re: Ciaffones books
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
(I can't recall the specific hand you reference, but iirc many of the hand examples are much deeper than 100bb, which of course a lot of today's games are capped at.)

[/ QUOTE ]

IIRC it's the one where he has 22 in an unraised pot, he pots it on an 852 (maybe 952 or something similar) board and gets checkraised quite small by someone who'd obviously have raised AA-QQ pre and led other overpairs post

[/ QUOTE ]


Ok - I found that hand and the effective stacks are only like 100bb. I have to admit, taken in the contect of today's games, that fold would be pretty bad.

Re: Ciaffones books
 

Edit time expired - "Reid" is "read", obviously (before someone tells me that me no spelly good).

Re: Ciaffones books
 

[ QUOTE ]
Ok - I found that hand and the effective stacks are only like 100bb. I have to admit, taken in the contect of today's games, that fold would be pretty bad.

[/ QUOTE ]

If the dynamics of the table were completely different, a fold would be pretty bad? If people can't figure that out, then they probably shouldn't read any poker book.

Re: Ciaffones books
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Ok - I found that hand and the effective stacks are only like 100bb. I have to admit, taken in the contect of today's games, that fold would be pretty bad.

[/ QUOTE ]

If the dynamics of the table were completely different, a fold would be pretty bad? If people can't figure that out, then they probably shouldn't read any poker book.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm taking Ciaffones word for it that this guy was such a rock and so predictable it made the fold correct.

I've never seen such a player myself so when I flop bottom set with 100bb stacks the rock is just going to have to show me a higher set because I'm not folding.

And clearly, yes. Some people can't figure that out. See post above from a few days ago to see example.