$2/4 NL AQ on button
 

Id like some input on this play, especially the preflop reraise. is it standard or too loose?

I have AQoff on button, UTG+1 (24/15) raises to $16, CO 25/20) calls and i raise to $48. Do you guys routinely raise in that position, call? fold?

Raiser then folded but CO called. $120 in pot, flop 942rainbow. CO checks, i bet $85. Is this good, bad or indifferent?

He calls. Turn (8) check check. Do you double barrel here?

River whiffs, he bets 3/4 pot and i fold.

Id really appreciate your comments on my play. Thanks alot.

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

Shameless bump.

Im trying hard to increase my overall aggression, but when i put myself in these situations i arent comfortable and usually the end result is as above, ie me getting outflopped/outplayed post flop.

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

awful play...only kidding its me lee
read 1st page on medium stakes under pokerhat , i posted same question..thought it would get some responses on correct forum

interesting....i prefer it in writing please

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

Pretty standard. I might check the flop sometimes and definetly bet the turn too some of the time. It all depends on your images. Think about the hand, CO has almost always something like 88 TT. Now does he fold them? I don't know, not against me but quite likely against you maybe? Actually in this spot I like your line the least. Either check the flop or bet the turn too since his range is full of mediocre made hands which almost always call one street and sometimes more.

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

Your reraisesize sucks hard.

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

check/fold the flop.

if you assume he's not cold calling a 3bet w/ less than AK, he probably has a decent pair. that is like the least scary flop in the world for a pair so he's not gonna let it go and your betting basically to bluff him off AK. if you think you can get him to fold a pair then you have to make up your mind on the flop and commit to firing 2 or 3 barrels to make that happen which is usually a pretty bad idea w/out a decent read. so yeah, flop bet sucks unless ur planning on putting more pressure on him later in the hand

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

[ QUOTE ]
Pretty standard. I might check the flop sometimes and definetly bet the turn too some of the time. It all depends on your images. Think about the hand, CO has almost always something like 88 TT. Now does he fold them? I don't know, not against me but quite likely against you maybe? Actually in this spot I like your line the least. Either check the flop or bet the turn too since his range is full of mediocre made hands which almost always call one street and sometimes more.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks for your comments, this is what i expected to hear, ie that the 3bet is solid (other than bet size), but i suck post flop.

My trouble is, until recently i only really 3bet aces and kings, so i expect the mid pp's to fold to my flop bet once they miss their set. This may be true at lower stakes where i live, but im not adjusting to more aggresive games. Also i cant quite bring myself to check the flop after i 3bet and hate the thought of double barrelling the turn with air. My mindset is completely wrong but knowing your flaws is the first step in fixing em right.

My 3bet size sucking was a bit of an eye opener too, i thought it was ok. Where do i need to be, about $70 into that pot? What if i was reraising just one villain, is $50 ok then, or still needs to be higher?

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

your 3bet size preflop is fine.

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

[ QUOTE ]
your 3bet size preflop is fine.

[/ QUOTE ]

WTF? Give me arguments for that lol

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

i really dislike the reraise here preflop ... both these guys are lags so why not just calling since you know their raising range is large then if you hit an A on the flop play it hard

as played though i would most likely check flop because more often than not CO will be holding something along the lines of 99 TT JJ or so... and he isn't folding to your cont bet anyways ...

then you check turn and just give him the green light to fire the river ....


as played you need to fire a second barrel here and then if he checkraises you can easily fold and if he comes along again then you may have to give up on the river

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

nvrmind misread the hand, thought here was CO and villain was btn. (as in just reraising an opener)

yeah, should be like 16 more preflop

actually most of what I wrote doesnt make much sense in my earlier post but its pretty close as far as hand ranges. u

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

[ QUOTE ]
check/fold the flop.

if you assume he's not cold calling a 3bet w/ less than AK, he probably has a decent pair. that is like the least scary flop in the world for a pair so he's not gonna let it go and your betting basically to bluff him off AK. if you think you can get him to fold a pair then you have to make up your mind on the flop and commit to firing 2 or 3 barrels to make that happen which is usually a pretty bad idea w/out a decent read. so yeah, flop bet sucks unless ur planning on putting more pressure on him later in the hand

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Yea im getting there now. I had him on a pair, 77-TT was my guess. Even if i knew he had an unimproved mid pair im not mentally ready yet to risk my stack trying to move him off it, so check/fold is my only choice on that board. I see now that my flop bet alone was a waste of money, given the range i had him on.

I love this forum btw, dunno how i managed without it for so long!

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

i really dislike the re-raise too , no need for it....

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

[ QUOTE ]
i really dislike the re-raise too , no need for it....

[/ QUOTE ]

I wondered when youd pipe up, fool [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

[ QUOTE ]
i really dislike the reraise here preflop ... both these guys are lags so why not just calling since you know their raising range is large then if you hit an A on the flop play it hard

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I raised to pick up the ~$40 already out there, or play a big pot, in position with what i expect to be the best hand most of the time. My image is tight (maybe 16/12) and most of the time i expect the raiser to fold to me. If he calls im often infront with position, if he raises i can bow out gracefully. The CO i really wasnt worried about. I figured he was calling in position with a mediocre hand. (An assumption that later bit me right in the ass)

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

on a more serious note ..i think we were both kinda correct.
what we are both gonna have to agree on is this play is only advanced if you are gonna carry on the agrresion all the way ...which whilst i dont disagree this is advanced and used by top players...we are not there and this is far too risky without maintaing the bullets or having the bankroll, never mind the ba!!!

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

bet flop only if you're going to bet turn like 70%

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

[ QUOTE ]
on a more serious note ..i think we were both kinda correct.
what we are both gonna have to agree on is this play is only advanced if you are gonna carry on the agrresion all the way ...which whilst i dont disagree this is advanced and used by top players...we are not there and this is far too risky without maintaing the bullets or having the bankroll, never mind the ba!!!

[/ QUOTE ]

We were both more wrong that right i think. You preflop by dismissing the raise as a mugs play and me post flop by playing it like a lemon.

Your post assumes that im always going to miss the flop high wide and handsome. The truth is, that flop was about as bad as it gets vs a likely mid pp.

If you are acknowledging that 3betting a wider variety of hands is strong, why still the reluctance to embrace it? How will you ever get to that next level if you know what you need to do to improve, but make excuses and dont do anything about it. If bankroll is a problem suck it up and move down a level. If balls are the problem, grow a pair [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

ok i was trying to be diplomatic but you make it personal..no need

My opinion is still the same as one of the guys on here that there is no need to raise..if and when i do ..i do and will have the bankroll and the balls
I was actually referring to you who lack both...therfore your play made no sense whatsoever , which evweryone has concurred with , so until such time , please take the advise....

Cheers

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

[ QUOTE ]
ok i was trying to be diplomatic but you make it personal..no need

My opinion is still the same as one of the guys on here that there is no need to raise..if and when i do ..i do and will have the bankroll and the balls
I was actually referring to you who lack both...therfore your play made no sense whatsoever , which evweryone has concurred with , so until such time , please take the advise....

Cheers

[/ QUOTE ]

Shame you missed the tongue in cheek way my reply was meant to read. Youve gone and hurt my feelings now [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

your just trying to get the sympathy vote now...

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

Stacks????

Preflop raise is way too small make something between 64-70.

Villain calls a raise, and then a reraise: his range is mostly pairs and AK,AA-66 with 99-88 being the most likely of his holdings as he'd usually 3bet AA-TT,AK and usually fold 77-66 to the reraise. So now that you've got him on a range do you really think double barreling this turn is a sound idea? He either has a set or an overpair and no one folds overpairs in a 3bet pot. I dislike a turn bet, and barring a read i'd say your flop cbet is -EV.

Re: $2/4 NL AQ on button
 

this is an excellent structured answer , both stacks were $400 btw
Id be interested to know if you would have 3 bet pf and do you routinely in these circumstances