Early in satellite vs chipleader
 

No reads, new to table. Trying to get my tourney legs back after playing ring games almost exclusively for the last year or so.


PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t50 (8 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

MP2 (t3355)
CO (t860)
Button (t2775)
SB (t5900)
Hero (t3430)
UTG (t2745)
UTG+1 (t1155)
MP1 (t4135)

Preflop: Hero is BB with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls t50, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (t150) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets t100</font>, Hero calls t100, UTG+1 folds.

Turn: (t350) 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets t150</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to t550</font>, SB calls t400.

River: (t1450) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets t850</font>


Fair enough?

Edit: FWIW, he used his timer before calling my turn raise.

Re: Early in satellite vs chipleader
 

I don't like the river bet at all. Its about 1/2 the pot and is essentially a bluff. You've fired at the turn when your draws improved and he's called, after using his timer.
Some villains use this to "show weakness" and disguise a monster.

You are ahead of a missed draw, so you wouldn't want to bet there - and if he has a strong hand he's likely to be checking to induce a bluff. I'd check this river. If the turn card hadn't paired you your river bet makes much more sense.

I like it up until then though.

EDIT: What was the buy-in?

Re: Early in satellite vs chipleader
 

I think the river bet is necessarily if he want's to finish this bluff.
He calls the first shot, the turn bet is weakish and he raises - we see a lot of calls in this spot from people who don't think.

I think the river-bet is fine - most of the time this should chase him off.

I like it - welcome back to tournament poker.

Re: Early in satellite vs chipleader
 

I like it too, as lev said, that turn bet is weak, we can't just give up this pot.

Re: Early in satellite vs chipleader
 

i see you mentioned no reads, but buyin amount and stage of the tournament can be a read in itself, you can also check stats

i use stats all the time, in this case i'd argue that against a good player, you could fire that river bluff

against a donkey that will call me with any J, i'd just check and hope to see a missed draw

Re: Early in satellite vs chipleader
 

[ QUOTE ]
If the turn card hadn't paired you your river bet makes much more sense.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is the main reason for posting this hand.

My plan when raising the turn was to moderately bluff the river if I didn't improve. My difficulty was in deciding if the 5 helped me enough that I could rely on showdown value enough to check, or if I had to follow through with my bluff. (Holy run-on sentanceaments!) At the time, I decided he was much more likely to be on a weak made hand than a missed draw.

As it turned out, he folded and it's driving me nuts. Because my play worked, it's impossible to judge if it was good or not [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img].

[ QUOTE ]

EDIT: What was the buy-in?

[/ QUOTE ]

$40 freezeout satellite.

Re: Early in satellite vs chipleader
 

Grunch

I don't like the river bet. There are no worse hands that will call and i don't think any better hands would fold.

Re: Early in satellite vs chipleader
 

[ QUOTE ]
Grunch

I don't like the river bet. There are no worse hands that will call and i don't think any better hands would fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

QT, T8... fold. Edit: possibly even get a fold out of a jack. You raised the 9, and theoretically bet the river for value with the 9. Unless he can see thru your soul, I see plenty of better hands that fold.

Re: Early in satellite vs chipleader
 

I'd call the turn pretty quickly. No sense in re-opening the action when he is giving your great odds + implied odds to hit your big draw.

Re: Early in satellite vs chipleader
 

[ QUOTE ]
There are no worse hands that will call and i don't think any better hands would fold.

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After "way ahead way behind", this is quickly becoming the most often mis-used maxim in this forum.

Jarid

Re: Early in satellite vs chipleader
 

as played I like the river bet...if we check behind I don't see our paired 5 holding up. It's our best chance to win the pot.

Re: Early in satellite vs chipleader
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
There are no worse hands that will call and i don't think any better hands would fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

After "way ahead way behind", this is quickly becoming the most often mis-used maxim in this forum.

Jarid

[/ QUOTE ]

qft

Re: Early in satellite vs chipleader
 

I personally love to raise flops like this in position for two reasons. 1) We have fold equity against a 9 or a T without a straight draw. 2) If we get called a large percentage of the time we get a free card on the turn to hit our draw on the river in case we miss turn. As played I like turn raise, because it narrows our range to a slowplayed J or a a 9 and if he has a weak J he maybe folding, plus we have quite a few outs to win on river. As played I like river bet because he is probably folding a T and maybe a weak J, because of how strongly we have played the hand.

Edit- I think a call on turn may not allow us to steal on river because our line will read like a draw. Thoughts?

Re: Early in satellite vs chipleader
 

[ QUOTE ]
I personally love to raise flops like this in position for two reasons. 1) We have fold equity against a 9 or a T without a straight draw. 2) If we get called a large percentage of the time we get a free card on the turn to hit our draw on the river in case we miss turn. As played I like turn raise, because it narrows our range to a slowplayed J or a a 9 and if he has a weak J he maybe folding, plus we have quite a few outs to win on river. As played I like river bet because he is probably folding a T and maybe a weak J, because of how strongly we have played the hand.

Edit- I think a call on turn may not allow us to steal on river because our line will read like a draw. Thoughts?

[/ QUOTE ]

Only against a retard would i call twice and bet on the river when checked to. But if you check behind on the turn after raising flop, your line looks like a draw as well, so betting if he checks the river is bad as well.