20/40 foxwoods, do you guys fold this anywhere?
 

this hand is for nina also.

full table.

2 unknowns limp, sb completes, i check k[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]j[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] in the bb.

flop j[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
i lead, ep raises, 2 guys fold, i 3bet, he calls.

turn t[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
i bet, he raises, i call.

river 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
i checkcall.

is this an appropriate level of action? is our goose cooked? how do you guys play this?

Re: 20/40 foxwoods, do you guys fold this anywhere?
 

it depends

Re: 20/40 foxwoods, do you guys fold this anywhere?
 

You could fold that turn against normal opponents who aren't retards.

Re: 20/40 foxwoods, do you guys fold this anywhere?
 

I don't like river. If we're gonna payoff we may as well betfold

Re: 20/40 foxwoods, do you guys fold this anywhere?
 

in a 20 game i expect my opponents to be passive enough that a turn fold is correct.

Re: 20/40 foxwoods, do you guys fold this anywhere?
 

Define unknown - old, young, overall impression? Part of winning live poker is being able to size up strangers on the fly.

I think the flop is ok, but when you're raised on the turn I wouldn't automatically pay my opponent off. J10 is pretty plausible, as is a set of 4's or 6's. Unless you have reason to believe he's pretty loose aggro, you're likely tortured. A set makes a lot of sense and he doesn't expect you to fold after 3-betting the flop so what do you think he's trying to do exactly?

Then on the river, it's kind of gross - the only draw got there and he's still betting. That usually means he has a strong hand that he can't resist valuebetting and doesn't think you bet-3 bet with a flush draw. I agree w/ Snowball about betting being better if you MUST pay this off. But if I get to the river, particularly that river, I'm frequently check folding. I don't think I get there unless he's an action type though or he thinks I'm weak or something.

Jeff

Re: 20/40 foxwoods, do you guys fold this anywhere?
 

This is a simple fold on the turn unless your opponent is unusual for a 20/40 game.

Re: 20/40 foxwoods, do you guys fold this anywhere?
 

This hand perfectly delineates the difference between online and live.

This board is a call down online against your average villain and a fold against your average live one.

Paying off this specific river is probably not a good idea against your average villain anywhere, though.

Re: 20/40 foxwoods, do you guys fold this anywhere?
 

you beat absolutely nothing on the river. the turn is close.

Re: 20/40 foxwoods, do you guys fold this anywhere?
 

You are toast on the river so I fold. I might even fodl to the turn raise depending on the player. Why can't Nina post her own hands?

Re: 20/40 foxwoods, do you guys fold this anywhere?
 

imo you can't fold the turn because sets are discounted because they raised the flop, JT is the most likely hand by a fair bit, you have 9 outs and you're getting 8-1.

river call is atrocious. you are good here pretty damn close to never.

Re: 20/40 foxwoods, do you guys fold this anywhere?
 

[ QUOTE ]
imo you can't fold the turn because sets are discounted because they raised the flop, JT is the most likely hand by a fair bit, you have 9 outs and you're getting 8-1.

river call is atrocious. you are good here pretty damn close to never.

[/ QUOTE ]

this guy could EASILY have a set here.

we do not have 9 outs on the turn, we have 3, assuming we are not drawing stone dead.

Re: 20/40 foxwoods, do you guys fold this anywhere?
 

whoops I guess I misread? not sure how I got 9 outs there. turn call is very close and actually probably wrong. but sets are discounted pretty heavily because of the flop raise.

Re: 20/40 foxwoods, do you guys fold this anywhere?
 

[ QUOTE ]
whoops I guess I misread? not sure how I got 9 outs there. turn call is very close and actually probably wrong. but sets are discounted pretty heavily because of the flop raise.

[/ QUOTE ]

why on earth do you think they don't raise this flop with a set? [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

Re: 20/40 foxwoods, do you guys fold this anywhere?
 

I dunno why they don't, but they don't. it's like a disease in this game.

Re: 20/40 foxwoods, do you guys fold this anywhere?
 

I fold on the turn unless I have a read.

Re: 20/40 foxwoods, do you guys fold this anywhere?
 

[ QUOTE ]
This hand perfectly delineates the difference between online and live.

This board is a call down online against your average villain and a fold against your average live one.

Paying off this specific river is probably not a good idea against your average villain anywhere, though.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree, well said.

Re: 20/40 foxwoods, do you guys fold this anywhere?
 

i would lead toward folding turn a little more than half the time, but when that river card hits its a fold %100 of the time.

Re: 20/40 foxwoods, do you guys fold this anywhere?
 

[ QUOTE ]
You are toast on the river so I fold. I might even fodl to the turn raise depending on the player. Why can't Nina post her own hands?

[/ QUOTE ]

I was at foxwoods when I asked Babar to post these. Basically I want to read the replies when I get home and not have to make a post and wait. Also its easier. Also Babar [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]'s me.

Re: 20/40 foxwoods, do you guys fold this anywhere?
 

also, nina's just a girl and the internet is hard for girls!

Re: 20/40 foxwoods, do you guys fold this anywhere?
 

Reads are so key here, there are certain guys I fold this to and others I will call down. On the river the only thing you beat is a semibluffed turn w/Jx of diamonds. I don't mind calling down, I dont mind calling the turn to fold the river UI, I don't mind calling down, all depends on your opponents.