NL$100, KK on button facing limp reraise
 

Ok so my buddy and I had different opinions on the way this hand was played. Does the A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] on the flop discount the chance of him having AA enough to continue with the hand?


Do you continue with the hand or give it up?

What do you all think?

villain is 17/14/4 after 50 hands.
Hero is 17/7/3

Bodog No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (8 handed) Hand History converter Courtesy of PokerZion.com

saw flop|<font color="#C00000">saw showdown</font>

MP1 ($13.00)
MP2 ($103.75)
CO ($100.50)
<font color="#C00000">BJJIII ($98.50)</font>
SB ($59.80)
BB ($90.50)
<font color="#C00000">UTG ($100.00)</font>
UTG+1 ($166.50)

Preflop: BJJIII is Button with K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls $1, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">BJJIII raises to $5</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">UTG raises to $16</font>, BJJIII calls $11.

Flop: ($33.50) A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">UTG bets $19</font>, BJJIII ?

Re: NL$100, KK on button facing limp reraise
 

I think Im putting in the third raise preflop against a player with those stats.

As played I think you have to fold the flop. If hes aggressive enough to fire at the flop he may fire again, you gonna call another barrel? Lets say he does check the turn, are you gonna bet it? For value?

Re: NL$100, KK on button facing limp reraise
 

I would fold. He doesn't need to have AA to have you beat, people will sometimes do this with AKs as well as AA and KK, and if you are limp reraising a lot I think pulling this with AK is a very good idea.

Re: NL$100, KK on button facing limp reraise
 

He could be reraising light but the statistical sample size is tiny, so when the ace flops you have to fold. The only hands you beat that he might have are QQ or JJ, and I seriously doubt he has either. At 100NL, the limp-reraise means what you think it does.

Re: NL$100, KK on button facing limp reraise
 

I love how you played this if you folded.

Re: NL$100, KK on button facing limp reraise
 

[ QUOTE ]
He could be reraising light but the statistical sample size is tiny, so when the ace flops you have to fold. The only hands you beat that he might have are QQ or JJ, and I seriously doubt he has either.

[/ QUOTE ]

My thoughts exactly.

Re: NL$100, KK on button facing limp reraise
 

If it smells like a pile of dog doo, but looks like chocolate, chances are, it's going to be dog doo when you stick it in your mouth.

Re: NL$100, KK on button facing limp reraise
 

reraise PF

Re: NL$100, KK on button facing limp reraise
 

I agree doo doo...find another better looking pile to taste

Re: NL$100, KK on button facing limp reraise
 

Well if he'd limp/reraise with QQ, why not AK? If so Then these two possibilities cancel each other out. That leaves 3 combo's of AA that still crush you. If you add the JJ's then you are ahead 3 combo's.

You might consider floating if you think he wouldn't two barrell you and there is a possibility you could bluff on a diamond. Depends on your read of the villian, but I probably wouldn't try it myself.

I'd probably go with the safe and obvious fold here I guess. I think I probably would have 4 betted PF though.

Re: NL$100, KK on button facing limp reraise
 

yeah, i agree i would fold this flop. You are gonna have to try and see another 2 streets after this for v.cheap if u want to continue with the hand, and could end up stacking off stupidly. His sample size is way to small to judge his play. If you call what is your plan for the turn??

Re: NL$100, KK on button facing limp reraise
 

is he going to put you on a FD in a rr pot?? i dont think so, so representing a flush isnt the greatest play in this hand imo

Re: NL$100, KK on button facing limp reraise
 

[ QUOTE ]
I love how you played this if you folded.

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: NL$100, KK on button facing limp reraise
 

With the Ace on the flop does it discount the odds of him having AA?

Re: NL$100, KK on button facing limp reraise
 

ya dude you played it fine since he had JJ

Re: NL$100, KK on button facing limp reraise
 

What are the chances the other guy is holding KK in this specific spot?

Re: NL$100, KK on button facing limp reraise
 

[ QUOTE ]
ya dude you played it fine since he had JJ

[/ QUOTE ]

if no one wants to give advice forget about it. why even have a forum to talk about it?

Re: NL$100, KK on button facing limp reraise
 

[ QUOTE ]
With the Ace on the flop does it discount the odds of him having AA?

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, it depends on the range of hands he could have. If he would NEVER limp/reraise with less than AA, then no, the odds of him have AA is still 100%.

Obviously this probably isn't the case and even if it was you can't know it, so yes it decreases the chances he has AA.

There are only 3 possible ways he could have AA now that one is spoken for on the flop instead of 6 ways he could have it if there weren't an ace on the flop.

Is this enough to allow us to continue? Well that depends on what his full range is which is a judgment call. Most people seem to say it isn't enough.

What do people limp/rereaise with? AA usually, KK maybe but less likely, QQ now you're stretching, etc. If you thought that he would limp reraise with QQ just as often as he would with AA then you can continue since there are 6 possible QQ combinations and only 3 AA. But if you think he limp/reraise less than half as often with QQ as with AA then you are back to not continuing.

Of course there are other coniderations too. Like, if he has AA he will likely bet again at some point this hand costing you more money, but if he has QQ, he can shut down and not pay you off OR he can keep bluffing. You won't know for sure so you will have to pay to find out.

So, as i've said before, if you have a good read on him, and think he won't two barrel bluff, then you can float this bet because if he bets again you can be pretty sure you're beat and if he doesn't you can be pretty sure your ahead, so you are essentially paying for information. It isn't worth it to do this unless you have a good read and are sure the information is reliable though. Or, you can just assume that since most people limp/reraise with a narrow range, usually AA or KK, and rarely anything else, that it is just too likely you are beat and it isn't worth to pay anymore to find out for sure and dump it. This is what i would probably do.

Re: NL$100, KK on button facing limp reraise
 

Guys thats how you reply to a post.

Take notice.

Re: NL$100, KK on button facing limp reraise
 

You go all in pf with KK because you don't want to see a scare card.

Re: NL$100, KK on button facing limp reraise
 

[ QUOTE ]
Guys thats how you reply to a post.

Take notice.

[/ QUOTE ]

OK thanks. If you have any other pointers you can post them in the "about the forums" section.