AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

I usually go a little bigger preflop here. I was timing down due to action at other tables. Hit pot real quick and of course everyone calls. None of the villains are good.

I check. UTG is stabbing with any piece including, of course, hands that currently beat me badly. If there were a bet/raise out there, I was gonna fold! If there were a bet/call, I was gonna c/r ai! Thoughts on these plans?

Bet/call/call, well, I got rockets, I push.

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.50/$1 Blinds - 6 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

Hero (SB): $99.00
BB: $104.15
UTG: $72.55
MP: $131.10
CO: $180.20
BTN: $64.40

Preflop: Hero is dealt A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (6 Players)
UTG calls $1.00, MP calls $1.00, CO calls $1.00, BTN folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $6.00</font>, BB folds, UTG calls $5.00, MP calls $5.00, CO calls $5.00

Flop: ($25) T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (4 Players)
Hero checks, <font color="red">UTG bets $19.00</font>, MP calls $19.00, CO calls $19.00, <font color="red">Hero raises all-in to $93.00</font>...

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

interesting line. i actually think that you're going to have the worst of it alot when/if called. but meh, what can you do?

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

nooooooo this is nasty imo. Make it more preflop, you are going to be OOP in a 4way pot soo much with this raise size. I probably bet/fold this flop usually (re-evaluating if called, and I'm usually not liking my hand all that much).

As played with the strong UTG bet and 2 callers I'm just calling, and I really don't like my hand one bit. Seriously I'd rather fold in this spot than shove.

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

[ QUOTE ]
Make it more preflop,

[/ QUOTE ]

I explained preflop. And I'm not just making that up like some people do.

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

Calling is pretty bad here. Folding seems terribly weak (but maybe it's not that bad?). Shoving is probably your best play.

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

this is perfect, except for preflop

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Make it more preflop,

[/ QUOTE ]

I explained preflop. And I'm not just making that up like some people do.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sorry, missed that bit.

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

I love your line but this isn't the flop for it imo.

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

This is not awful. There is so much money in there to make up for when you are behind. I personally don't see many people slowplaying with two pair+ on this flop and given how big everything is. So that leaves UTG and like you said he's aggro.

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

seriously, how can you think your AA is still good after a bet, call and a overcall... You are so beat

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

[ QUOTE ]
seriously, how can you think your AA is still good after a bet, call and a overcall... You are so beat

[/ QUOTE ]
Because the board is suited and three to a straight?

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

wow fold

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

[ QUOTE ]
This is not awful.

[/ QUOTE ]

!!!

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

At first I thought this was pretty bad, as in I'd rather just fold the flop when it gets back round to you but given how the preflop action has gone down a set seems relatively unlikely so I don't hate the shove as a semibluff.

If you do get called you don't really have any outs if you are behind, but some percentage of the time you might get called and be up against a combo draw and there's plenty of dead money in the pot to make this a worthwhile raise for protection/semibluff.

I think it is much more likely that the overcallers are calling light with draws than slowplaying a hand that has you crushed. Then again this is just about the worst flop possible for AA.

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

it's possible you're ahead and it's possible villain's have each other's outs

i think it's pretty close, it's better than an open shove though, imo

i think folding to a bet and then a raise is fine, and this is very marginal

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

[ QUOTE ]
As played with the strong UTG bet and 2 callers I'm just calling, and I really don't like my hand one bit. Seriously I'd rather fold in this spot than shove.

[/ QUOTE ]

Dno why I said I'd played as call lol, that would be terrible.

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

i like it. i think you can get called by draws all over the place which helps make up for the times you are against T9 which you do have some equity against

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

I sigh and fold pretty fast. This flop is all kinds of ugly. I don't know how many times I've overplayed AA in these spots, but it rarely works out.

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

[ QUOTE ]
i like it. i think you can get called by draws all over the place which helps make up for the times you are against T9 which you do have some equity against

[/ QUOTE ]

there are more combos of QJ and 76 than T9 or any other 2 pair

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

I c/f flop.

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

I actually do this play alot more than other people do evidently. In this hand I got looked up by UTG's Ad7d and CO's 5d6d.

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

[ QUOTE ]
I actually do this play alot more than other people do evidently. In this hand I got looked up by UTG's Ad7d and CO's 5d6d.

[/ QUOTE ]

HAHA! they did eat each other's outs!

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

[ QUOTE ]
I actually do this play alot more than other people do evidently. In this hand I got looked up by UTG's Ad7d and CO's 5d6d.

[/ QUOTE ]

Congrats. You are 40% here, which is nice but not a huge edge, and it's just about the best situation you could hope for. Still don't like it.


http://twodimes.net/h/?z=3094129
pokenum -h ah as - ad 7d - 6d 5d -- td 9c 8d
Holdem Hi: 903 enumerated boards containing 9c Td 8d
cards win %win lose %lose tie %tie EV
As Ah 351 38.87 525 58.14 27 2.99 0.399
Ad 7d 438 48.50 438 48.50 27 2.99 0.495
6d 5d 87 9.63 789 87.38 27 2.99 0.106


If the CO is not a huge idiot:

http://twodimes.net/h/?z=3094132
pokenum -h ah as - ad 7d -- td 9c 8d
Holdem Hi: 990 enumerated boards containing 9c Td 8d
cards win %win lose %lose tie %tie EV
As Ah 435 43.94 528 53.33 27 2.73 0.453
Ad 7d 528 53.33 435 43.94 27 2.73 0.547

Re: AA on messy flop? I c/r all-in sir(s).
 

this is definitely a check-fold due to action.