2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

Im new to pokerstars, so I'm not too familiar with the regs atm. Villain in this hand seems kinda bad and overly loose postflop, and sorta passive. HouseeLover for those who may knw him. He's been opening a ton of hands preflop so I 3 bet him because I'm ahead of his range and I can probably outplay him postflop if he calls. He called the turn bet pretty quickly FWIW. Do we bet this river? and if so, how much?

Poker Stars - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $2/$4 Blinds - 6 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

SB: $685.40
BB: $1,101.15
UTG: $656.60
MP: $505.95
Hero (CO): $562.25
BTN: $99.60

Preflop: Hero is dealt A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (6 Players)
UTG folds, <font color="red">MP raises to $16.00</font>, <font color="red">Hero raises to $52.00</font>, 3 folds, MP calls $36.00

Flop: ($110) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 Players)
MP checks, Hero checks

Turn: ($110) J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 Players)
MP checks, <font color="red">Hero bets $72.00</font>, MP calls $72.00

River: ($254) 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 Players)
MP checks, <font color="red">Hero ???

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

Sigh

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

This is a more interesting spot than the one you posted.

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

Hehe, just kidding. My answer FWIW is that you can't value bet this river. You may be able to turn your hand into a bluff by betting. But it's better to just check it down and not expect to be ahead.

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

so what exactly are you putting him on here?

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

i think betting is pretty standard here. $155

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

[ QUOTE ]
so what exactly are you putting him on here?

[/ QUOTE ]

it's not that i don't think ur ahead a fair amount here. i just think it's way to thin for value w/o some history.

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

i check it. don't think there's much you can get a call from.

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

I think I check here. I don't think we are getting value from many weaker hands. Plus we get to see what he is calling with and you can start to get an idea of hand ranges for him (is this a valid point at all??!??!?!?!!). I expect to be good here FWIW.

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

I should have included this hand because it's pretty relevant to this situation I'd think. This happened pretty early in the session.


Poker Stars - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $2/$4 Blinds - 6 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

Hero (SB): $397.60
BB: $138.10
UTG: $645.40
MP: $1,212.15
CO: $375.80
BTN: $415.75

Preflop: Hero is dealt A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (6 Players)
3 folds, <font color="red">BTN raises to $16.00</font>, <font color="red">Hero raises to $54.00</font>, BB folds, BTN calls $38.00

Flop: ($112) T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">Hero bets $77.00</font>, BTN calls $77.00

Turn: ($266) 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">Hero bets all-in for $266.60</font>, BTN calls $266.60

River: ($799.20) Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 Players - 1 All-In)

Pot Size: $799.20 ($3 Rake)

BTN had 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (a pair of Tens) and WON (+$398.60)
Hero had A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (high card Ace) and LOST (-$397.60)

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

I would check. If you think he will call with KK,QQ and TT vb river.

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

well if u think he will call any A then go ahead and value bet it but if he is even a slightly decent hand reader he is going to know almost exactly what you have when u bet the river.

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

[ QUOTE ]
well if u think he will call any A then go ahead and value bet it but if he is even a slightly decent hand reader he is going to know almost exactly what you have when u bet the river.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't really see the idea in a bet if you think he has an A. It's a 3bet pot so I guess most of the aces you beat folds preflop.

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

overly loose and passive postflop = bet

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

ez bet

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

[ QUOTE ]
ez bet

[/ QUOTE ]

How big we talkin now?

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
ez bet

[/ QUOTE ]

How big we talkin now?

[/ QUOTE ]
$185

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

[ QUOTE ]
ez bet

[/ QUOTE ]

lol...no matter what no matter who its against?

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

$199

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

super ez bet 190

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

$100.

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

[ QUOTE ]
$199

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok. I bet $162 and he instashoved GAHHHH! I folded, but just wanted to make sure that making a decent sized bet is ok/good there.

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

One hundred and eighty-five

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

wow not betting here against this opponent would seriously be awful...bet half pot or so...fold quick to a push

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

Funny how the first group of responses is like wtf check, and the latter half is like wtf BETBETBET LDO!!!

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Funny how the first group of responses is like wtf check

[/ QUOTE ]

With one exception [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

given the previous hand i think definately a bet is good here, some where in the 185 range i think , too small and u leave ur self vulnerable to a cr, i think its important to value bet somewhat thin in these spots a decent amount in order to be paid off on future hands. although, if i'd seen this guy cr or go for cr's on rivers b4(bluff or value), i may be more inclined to check it.

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

[ QUOTE ]
given the previous hand i think definately a bet is good here, some where in the 185 range i think , too small and u leave ur self vulnerable to a cr, i think its important to value bet somewhat thin in these spots a decent amount in order to be paid off on future hands. although, if i'd seen this guy cr or go for cr's on rivers b4(bluff or value), i may be more inclined to check it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I just assume guys like this are not really capable of c/r bluffing the river. Also, there's not really a hand he can get here this way that c/rs the river as a bluff.

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

I check this; you haven't repped a lot of strength so far and a small bet here is really asking to be called/outkicked or even rr'ed against a thinking opponent. If you must bet then make it $200-215 as you don't want a call.

PS I wrote this before I saw your result.

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I check this; you haven't repped a lot of strength so far and a small bet here is really asking to be called/outkicked or even rr'ed against a thinking opponent. If you must bet then make it $200-215 as you don't want a call.

PS I wrote this before I saw your result.

[/ QUOTE ]

Dude, I'm not bluffing here, I want him to call.

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Funny how the first group of responses is like wtf check, and the latter half is like wtf BETBETBET LDO!!!

[/ QUOTE ]

well it's kind of unclear until you posted that other hand. i don't think it is always a bet w/ AT vs a good or even decent player. it appears from the other hand he could easily be calling the 3 bet w/ Axs hands. w/o knowing how bad/passive he is postflop i don't think it's a clear bet. if he's kind of a station tho then betting is fine.

$180-195ish is good

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

lucid - i think its a super ez bet given history

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Funny how the first group of responses is like wtf check, and the latter half is like wtf BETBETBET LDO!!!

[/ QUOTE ]First group of responses would have saved $162... seriously, nothing you beat is calling a re-raise pre-flop, a bet on the turn, and another bet on the river.

Betting big as a bluff is dumb because you have showdown value. If you have to bet, bet small, like 1/4 pot - then at least you get calls from hands you beat.

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Betting big as a bluff is dumb because you have showdown value.

[/ QUOTE ]

please, just stop. whether we bet big or small, this is in no way a bluff.

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

That was just in response to the guy who said bet big because you don't want him to call... which sounds like a bluff to me.

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

[ QUOTE ]
That was just in response to the guy who said bet big because you don't want him to call... which sounds like a bluff to me.

[/ QUOTE ]

And of course since OP does want him to call it means I simply misread his original post.

I'd check.

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

Obv bet.

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Funny how the first group of responses is like wtf check, and the latter half is like wtf BETBETBET LDO!!!

[/ QUOTE ]


k well it is super easy, and it's dumb that anyone said check, especially after you checked flop. and probably the fact that you added that other hand swayed some of the opinion...just a guess though

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

id bet like 80 and fold to a raise.

Re: 2/4 To bet or not to bet?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Funny how the first group of responses is like wtf check, and the latter half is like wtf BETBETBET LDO!!!

[/ QUOTE ]First group of responses would have saved $162... seriously, nothing you beat is calling a re-raise pre-flop, a bet on the turn, and another bet on the river.

Betting big as a bluff is dumb because you have showdown value. If you have to bet, bet small, like 1/4 pot - then at least you get calls from hands you beat.

[/ QUOTE ]

Jesus, did you not see the other hand I posted or something? Everything you just said here is flat out wrong.