AA vs tight guy
 

Poker Stars - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $3/$6 Blinds - 6 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

Hero (SB): $1,221.20
BB: $617.35
UTG: $160.20
MP: $576.00
CO: $600.00
BTN: $462.50

Preflop: Hero is dealt A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (6 Players)
2 folds, CO checks, BTN calls $6.00, <font color="red">Hero raises to $36.00</font>, BB calls $30.00, 2 folds

Flop: ($84) 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">Hero bets $65.00</font>, <font color="red">BB raises to $130.00</font>, Hero calls $65.00

Turn: ($344) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players)
Hero checks, BB checks

River: ($344) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">Hero bets $215.00</font>,

if villain raised i was planning on folding, i swear. he is like 18/8 in 200 hands.

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

villians agg factor?
i think villian has something like ak, as a set wouldnt check the turn behind like that.
i bet 275 instead.

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

shove flop

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

shove flop is bad

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

why is everybody responding to every thread with shove flop? In this case that seems bad to me.

I think that this line gets the most out of KQ,KJ...most people would've raised those out of the button though.

A standard range for him at this point would be a lot of air (air thats not likely to have picked up anything warranting sd value), some straight draws that didn't get there, and some weak kings.

If we knew he had air I like a weak lead or check.

if we knew he had a straight draw (likely with a pair of 9s now). I like a bet large enough to make him realize his hand isn't good but small enough to make him think he can bluff us.

If we knew he had a weak king I like a large bet. This way he will think he is ahead of our bluffs and behind our big hands and opt to call instead of shoving (where our big hands call and bluffs fold).

So I don't know, you're best guess as to what kind of range he has and what kinds of moves he is capable of. Against a kind of weak tighty I'd probably bet like half pot and fold to a raise.

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

Was your plan to c/c turn c/f river if he bet turn and river. As played if he is supertight then I like your river line assuming you're b/f'ing this river.

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

I think you should nearly always be good here. if hes that tight then he doesnt have 87, K7, or K8. His flop minraise can be AK, or maybe a dumb QQ/JJ minraising for cheap showdown if he's bad. if he had a set he would bet the turn, esp with the strait draw. so i think you will see AK, QQ, JJ most often here.

if he raises it would be tough, but if hes that bad you can put him on KKK and fold.

were you planning to CF turn?

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

plan for turn was prob: i don't fold overpairs to minraises but don't want to inflate pot.

this line looks fine. b/f on the riv looks good too

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

This line to me is good. As for the shove flop responses to every thread, this is admittedly starting to get a little ridiculous. Poker exists beyond moving all in like you see on TV, guys.

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

[ QUOTE ]
Was your plan to c/c turn c/f river if he bet turn and river. As played if he is supertight then I like your river line assuming you're b/f'ing this river.

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we were getting pretty shallow by the turn so my plan was to c/c a small bet (consistent with Kx that would check behind river) but c/f to a bigger one.

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

I like it.

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

[ QUOTE ]
This line to me is good. As for the shove flop responses to every thread, this is admittedly starting to get a little ridiculous. Poker exists beyond moving all in like you see on TV, guys.

[/ QUOTE ]

number of posts saying too many people say to shove flop: 2
number of people saying to shove flop: 1

[img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

number of posts in last week with &gt; 50% of responses advocating shoving flop no matter circumstances: 306

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

Number of posts for someone who can't read that my commentary includes the phrase "shove flop responses to EVERY thread" - 10256.

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

[ QUOTE ]
Number of posts for someone who can't read that my commentary includes the phrase "shove flop responses to EVERY thread" - 10256.

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ok, i think we're really nitpicking, but....

[ QUOTE ]
number of posts saying too many people say to shove flop: 2
number of people saying to shove flop: 1

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you're still wrong. i just said that a) 2 people said too many people said to shove flop and b) only one person said to shove flop.

i understand what your post said, i just thought this was a stupid time to bring up your complaint.

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

Do you bet because you dont think KQ KJ bets river again? I mean i think i like this line pretty good when im being careless because of my bad runs of cards or overplaying aa, you will run into sets,8s, and maybe even boats... Ill explain

But honestly why not just check call river? If your so off about gaining 3 bets post flop with AA? He has already shown strength. I think the times he does have two pair, boat, set on river this bet is just like splashing money into the pot carelessly. If he does have KQ KJ, he will probably fold because of a paired board on your river spalsh or put you on aces and fold, if he does call just two plays splashing around money on river when they shouldn't be especially you.Just my two cents, not how many combos beats yours.

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

if he plays that tight n passive pre, good chance hes on ak/ kq, id say he's going to continue betting turn w anything stronger, assuming he wouldnt play JT pre and on the flop this way. so river value is good imo.

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

Yeh this is prolly a good line. I like it. I dont know about the fold to a raise though, your getting such good odds you might as well call.

Shove flop is horrible. It allows him to get away from weaker hands and call with better ones. It gives him far superior implied odds. And I doubt your going to be shoving flop here on a bluff very often so you are going to allow him to make the correct decision.

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

I like this line. If he had a set he would be betting the turn. He'll call with AK, KQ almost all the time and probably won't bluff raise the river with a K, or TT-QQ.

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

Yeah i mean hes reraise flop, then his check behind (what good players do against good players with sets and two pairs(gets trickier obviously with two pair)on the turn, then this guy right here the one were talking about makes a splash bet on river that will only be called by better made hands...do you see the board is paired with straight draws, why must you risk chips on a bad board when he shows strength on the flop.
make sense when he showed so much strength on the flop.

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah i mean hes reraise flop, then his check behind (what good players do against good players with sets and two pairs(gets trickier obviously with two pair)on the turn, then this guy right here the one were talking about makes a splash bet on river that will only be called by better made hands...do you see the board is paired with straight draws, why must you risk chips on a bad board when he shows strength on the flop.
make sense when he showed so much strength on the flop.

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yea, you're 100% correct. a monster wouldn't bet the turn and a worse hand will never call a river bet here. spot on. [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Yeah i mean hes reraise flop, then his check behind (what good players do against good players with sets and two pairs(gets trickier obviously with two pair)on the turn, then this guy right here the one were talking about makes a splash bet on river that will only be called by better made hands...do you see the board is paired with straight draws, why must you risk chips on a bad board when he shows strength on the flop.
make sense when he showed so much strength on the flop.

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yea, you're 100% correct. a monster wouldn't bet the turn and a worse hand will never call a river bet here. spot on. [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

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yeah i mean we always have to value bet AA on the river after a turn check on a paired/straight board after a flop reraise. [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

lol

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

if villain had 88, 77 why wouldn't he fire the turn? if he had KK don't you think he would have 3-bet preflop? a player with those type of stats will rarely have a hand to make a str8 here. when the river pairs 8s it is even less likely he has 88 so really the only hand that would beat AA that makes sense is 77. however, hands like AK, KQ are in villain's range and he may check the turn for pot control.

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

bet/fold&gt;c/r&gt;c/c

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

Exacltly why isnt villian thinking this same way about his opponent since we give him so much credit for checking AK KQ, what is wrong with checking river, nothing at all, in fact it is probably the better play after he has reraise on flop. He will think the same way as you are telling me DirteAA that a set is unlikely because board pairs so he value bets his AK...I dont see villian with KQ here but it can happen if he is bad.

Why throw out a block bet on this board when villian is checking behind for pot control and will most likely fire river whether he has a boat or AK, maybe even KQ......

We dont gain anything at all except the times when we are lucky enough that he does call with AK. 16 combos bro...when he does have 77 88 KK, 18 combos man before the flop even hits..18 to 16 more sets then AK just for ha ha's, so now we take board texture and see that villian thinks just how you think this guy posting here should be thinking so he will value bet river with AK, if he doesnt but you say we most value bet here so how does betting make it any better?When we fold to his shove.

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

I like this line
I think b/f &gt; c/c &gt; c/r

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

like your line here

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

[ QUOTE ]
bet/fold&gt;c/r&gt;c/c

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i honestly never considered c/r till you said it. i dunno if it's really a good line, but it's kind of clever. if he did bet his Kx on the river, and i think he might, especially if it's AK or possibly KQ, he'd be getting great odds and would probably talk himself into a call.

one reason i wanted to bet was to get a call from some of the misc stuff that has sort of hit like T9 (oesd on flop) and weak Kx hands that won't bet.

Re: AA vs tight guy
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
bet/fold&gt;c/r&gt;c/c

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i honestly never considered c/r till you said it. i dunno if it's really a good line, but it's kind of clever. if he did bet his Kx on the river, and i think he might, especially if it's AK or possibly KQ, he'd be getting great odds and would probably talk himself into a call.

one reason i wanted to bet was to get a call from some of the misc stuff that has sort of hit like T9 (oesd on flop) and weak Kx hands that won't bet.

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I really dont think this is the right spot to c/r.