3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

villian is 21-18 standard tag imo, can be agro can float can do w/e etc

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $3/$6 Blinds - 6 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

SB: $420.10
BB: $572.90
UTG: $768.45
Hero (MP): $1,238.30
CO: $236.25
BTN: $511.00

Preflop: Hero is dealt Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (6 Players)
UTG folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $21.00</font>, CO folds, BTN calls $21.00, SB calls $18.00, BB folds

Flop: ($69) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 Players)
SB checks, <font color="red">Hero bets $48.00</font>, BTN calls $48.00, SB folds

Turn: ($165) 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 Players)
Hero checks, <font color="red">BTN bets $105.00</font>, <font color="red">Hero raises to $546.00</font>

like it? love it? hate it?

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

I call turn. Are you trying to make him fold 2 pair?

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

I see no reason to do this.

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

If you play aggro I like it alot

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

It's fine, I think I prefer calling though.

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

2 pair raises this flop 95% of the time. same goes with sets.

not sure if I like it too much, not many worse hands will call.

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

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If you play aggro I like it alot

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thanks, and yes I do play agro all the time

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

Hey Gordy mind if I pick your brain?

Say the river blanks (2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]) we have check/called the turn and the river pot is now $105*2+$165=$375. Villain has $511-($105+$48+$21)=$336, and we cover.

The board is T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]... we have Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

1A. We check and villain bets $200
1B. We check and villain shoves
1C. Do we make any type of lead here?

The board is T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]...

2A. Do we lead and for how much (villian has ~psb left)
2B. Say we bet 1/3pot like $111 and villain shoves.. autofold yes?

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

I think calling is way better than shoving.

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think calling is way better than shoving.

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Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think calling is way better than shoving.

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sure, can u back that up? indlucing river senarios?

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

reup,

1A: Call
1B: No easy answer here, read based. As a default I'd probably fold.
1C: Don't really like leading, I think he should be able to fold most of his J's, and we take his bluff away. If he's the type to pay off a little light though I guess somehing like $225 fold to a push is okay.

Situation 2 depends so much on villain's tendencies. If he's bluffy c/c, if he's loose passive then a smallish ($150) b/f, against a rare type of suspicious TAG who I have an aggro dynamic with I might overbet shove trying to sell a bluff.

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

coo thanks G.

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

[ QUOTE ]
reup,

1A: Call
1B: No easy answer here, read based. As a default I'd probably fold.
1C: Don't really like leading, I think he should be able to fold most of his J's, and we take his bluff away. If he's the type to pay off a little light though I guess somehing like $225 fold to a push is okay.

Situation 2 depends so much on villain's tendencies. If he's bluffy c/c, if he's loose passive then a smallish ($150) b/f, against a rare type of suspicious TAG who I have an aggro dynamic with I might overbet shove trying to sell a bluff.

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yo he has &lt;pot left, not folding ever if you call turn pretty much

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
reup,

1A: Call
1B: No easy answer here, read based. As a default I'd probably fold.
1C: Don't really like leading, I think he should be able to fold most of his J's, and we take his bluff away. If he's the type to pay off a little light though I guess somehing like $225 fold to a push is okay.

Situation 2 depends so much on villain's tendencies. If he's bluffy c/c, if he's loose passive then a smallish ($150) b/f, against a rare type of suspicious TAG who I have an aggro dynamic with I might overbet shove trying to sell a bluff.

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yo he has &lt;pot left, not folding ever if you call turn pretty much

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oh whoops, yeah the stuff I posted above was under the impression of deeper stacks.

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

maybe you should weaklead turn and shove over a raise instead

or, c/c and c/c river

crai here probably polarizes his range in a manner you don't want

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think calling is way better than shoving.

[/ QUOTE ]

sure, can u back that up? indlucing river senarios?

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What hands is shoving the turn optimal against?

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

[ QUOTE ]
maybe you should weaklead turn and shove over a raise instead

or, c/c and c/c river

crai here probably polarizes his range in a manner you don't want

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Yea I agree with this......if these the type who would turn a weak made hand into a bluff right here I like the weak lead.

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

[ QUOTE ]
Hey Gordy mind if I pick your brain?

Say the river blanks (2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]) we have check/called the turn and the river pot is now $105*2+$165=$375. Villain has $511-($105+$48+$21)=$336, and we cover.

The board is T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]... we have Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

1A. We check and villain bets $200
1B. We check and villain shoves
1C. Do we make any type of lead here?

The board is T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]...

2A. Do we lead and for how much (villian has ~psb left)
2B. Say we bet 1/3pot like $111 and villain shoves.. autofold yes?

[/ QUOTE ]

I like your analysis here. this why push makes sense here. you are only gonna have much more than the pot left after a smooth call here. if you feel you have the best of it, this is a easy push. looks like a JK type of hand protecting.

your check looks weak, makingit lesslikely he made a flush. you also have the Q of clubs. doubt he is on a big draw since you also have a Q.

I think it is played well. I sometimes would lead turn, but CR is even better.

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

I would think most standard TAG's range here is mostly only PP's since he CC'd PF. I really dont see how a 21/18 could have KJ of some kind of wacky 2pair.

call &gt; CRAI IMO.

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

It seems like a check raise is out of desperation, unless you have a bluffy image, and think you get called by much worse. Sure a flat call gives us a tougher river decision, but we are letting off all the worse hands easy, and never folding anything that beats us when we shove.

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

i doubt hed simply call with sets or two pairs on a board like this, if he has a jack, ur letting him off the hook for less value and if he has a flush, ur commiting urself being in pretty bad shape. there is no hand u beat which would call this raise except for maybe something like AcJx, only hand this play really makes sense against is if u put him on the lone king or ace of clubs and dont want him to draw.
i woulda prob led turn and folded to a raise depending on size or maybe c/c (which isnt great since it sets u up for a tough river decision)

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

although when u lead turn, its true that ur prob only gonna get called by a better hand (although its possible he has a stubborn jack or fd) u get away for cheaper if ur beat than u would check-raising and it gives u a much better idea of where ur at in the hand - once u check, his betting range widens quite a bit in my opinion and makes it tougher to proceed

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

c/c seems the best way to play it or just lead with the checkraise you are turning your hand into a bluff

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

Would you play AK/AQ with the Ac this way?

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

Call.

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

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Would you play AK/AQ with the Ac this way?

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a lot of the time ya, but i doubt he's thinking this

Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

[ QUOTE ]
you should lead turn and shove over a raise instead

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Re: 3/6 gut says to crai turn
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
you should lead turn and shove over a raise instead

[/ QUOTE ]

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what is villain raising here that we have beat? shove is gibberish, ud almost certainly be behind his turn raise and if ur not than ur missing value. the only hand i can think of that villain might make this raise with that we have beat is AcJx