AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

Sign of the end of poker or a good thing? What do you think?

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

Are they going to use it for the Omaha game? That would make the most sense since it is slower and more work to deal. I think when I played there they even charged a higher rake for Omaha than holdem.

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

How's the drop?

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

Chill and Bill,
They say they are going to use it for holdem, and since it is where table 1 used to be, probably 3/6.
They haven't said what the drop will be, but they still intend to have the JP.
It is a big thing and will play 10 handed. Today was play money, but they plan to begin charging tomorrow.
I have to say that I don't like it and hope that nobody uses it, but that's because I don't want to see dealers lose jobs. I might change my mind if the drop is reduced significantly.

It is a monstrosity in more ways than one. Imagine AJs, the last place I'd figure.

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

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I might change my mind if the drop is reduced significantly.


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Total cost for dealers for a live game is maybe $15 an hour per table?
Cost to rent the table is?

Difference (savings?) divided by 40 hands per hour?

Even adding the additional hands per hour the table might produce, I don't expect any "significant reduction" in drop.

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

Artichoke Joe's is in California?

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

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Artichoke Joe's is in California?

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San Bruno, just south of San Francisco

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

Think about the savings of not tipping the dealer for a moment:
30 hands/hour (conservative)
$1.50/tip per hand (some more/some less...average)
$45/hour taken out of the game (just in tips)

So this means the dealer makes $50/hour ($5/hr salary + $45 tips). And the argument from the dealer would be I don't make money when I am sitting on a dead spread...or on break. True, but there is always a dealer in front of us. So it costs us $45/hr to have a dealer. Do you make $45-$50/hr? Do you think a dealer should make that much? Do they really add that much to the game? [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

I'm all for our robot overlords. Less mistakes, more hands, less tip. Jackpot.

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

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Think about ......

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Think about this thread is about electronic tables being introduced at on of the oldest cardrooms in the nation. Not about what you think a dealer should make.

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

Wow, never would have expected that.

I don't like, of course, except in one of the two scenarios:

* significant drop in the rake (as already menitoned, quite unlikely)
* they spread games they usually don't (it seems wasted on 3/6 LHE, but if it opened up NLH or PLO or whatnot at the room then that might make me consider it)

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I might change my mind if the drop is reduced significantly.


[/ QUOTE ]

Total cost for dealers for a live game is maybe $15 an hour per table?
Cost to rent the table is?

Difference (savings?) divided by 40 hands per hour?

Even adding the additional hands per hour the table might produce, I don't expect any "significant reduction" in drop.

[/ QUOTE ]

For comparison:

Four Winds Casino in New Buffalo Mich just installed 15 electronic poker tables. The rake is $3, plus $1 for a bbj. Hands per hour was 48.

A few minutes away in Northern Indiana, the casinos have all live dealers. Rake is $5, plus a $1 bbj, plus a dealer tip of $1. Hands per hour was 30.

So --- with the electronic tables you get 18 more hands per hour (over 50%) and there is only $4 taken off the table per hand compared to $7.

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

I was just at 4-Winds...and that was the talk of the table. If you are going to play poker for any serious length of time...you have to at least consider the automated tables. To just say "I like to play with the chips while I'm playing" is all well and good, but at what price? If it costs an extra $3/hand...and you play a couple of days a week....that's a lotta jack.

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

whoa AJs is my pokerroom, but i haven't been in about a month..

this is kinda sad to hear, we should start a boycott on the table. too bad, people will play it b/c they cant wait 30 minutes for a seat.

ayaaah, indeed

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

Or they just want to save money, experience new technology.... [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

I swore off AJ's months ago when I had Aces cracked by 2-outters twice in the same session (one of them for a monster pot), but I might have to stop by just to see what the tables look like in real life.

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

[ QUOTE ]
whoa AJs is my pokerroom, but i haven't been in about a month..

this is kinda sad to hear, we should start a boycott on the table. too bad, people will play it b/c they cant wait 30 minutes for a seat.

ayaaah, indeed

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If the experience is anything like HP's and Hustler's it won't be successful.

With the drop being so high in California I doubt that there is any justification for these etables.

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

Guess I must be the only dealer around who's not worried about these things. Hell, if the internet didn't kill live poker, neither will a video table.


q/q

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

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Guess I must be the only dealer around who's not worried about these things. Hell, if the internet didn't kill live poker, neither will a video table. q/q

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As I was playing yesterday I was trying to observe the dealers to see if the machine was stressing them at all, and interestingly it didn't seem to phase them at all, or at least that they would/could admit at work. So maybe you're not alone.

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

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Guess I must be the only dealer around who's not worried about these things. Hell, if the internet didn't kill live poker, neither will a video table. q/q

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As I was playing yesterday I was trying to observe the dealers to see if the machine was stressing them at all, and interestingly it didn't seem to phase them at all, or at least that they would/could admit at work. So maybe you're not alone.

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Except AJ's pays the City of San Bruno based on the amount of tables they have in the house. Each etable which goes in means that a live table won't be staffed.

AJ's has an allowance to add x amount more poker tables (I forget what the actual number is, but let's say its 8-12), so in theory if the etables grew their business AJs could retain dealers and add etables, though that scenario seems unlikely.

Each one of these which goes in figures to cost dealer jobs. Right now that may not be a problem as overtime is common but if they put a dozen etables in it would stand to reason that some dealers will be underemployed.

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

I would think it would make a lot more sense to use it for the Omaha game. That is what they were using it for the one time I saw one, at Hollywood Park (although no one was playing at it there).

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

Im out of town for the next week but Ill be interested in seeing this in person. If they lose any staff over this I hope its only 1 specific floorperson, everyone else at AJs is pretty good to deal with.

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

As I see it, it's kind of like worrying that fast food will kill fine dining. They're just qualitatively different experiences.

Recreational players are in it for that experience, not for upping their hands-per-hour stats or nitting themselves to death over the EV of toking the dealer. And let's be clear: live poker is ALL about the recreational player. The sharks and wannabe pros are purely incidental to the game. In the long run, they'll go where the recreational players go.

On the other hand, if the guys that obsess over every point of EV all were to migrate to etables, well, perhaps that's a net positive for the real games too. If it draws the tougher/tighter players away, it seems to me that will leave more money on the table for the casual players and keep the skill level more balanced [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Food for thought, I suppose.


q/q

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

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I would think it would make a lot more sense to use it for the Omaha game. That is what they were using it for the one time I saw one, at Hollywood Park (although no one was playing at it there).

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Sorry to co-opt the thread, but I'm interested in the mechanics of these things in a room.

How does a game get started on these things? Are rooms employing props to start games short handed? There's no list, I assume. Is there? When someone leaves the game, who gets the next spot and who reports the empty seat to the floor?

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

I’ll be in the area today, so I might head over to AJ’s to check it out, if only for the novelty of the experience. I haven’t played 3/6 in years though.

I’m also curious about how the floor handles seating, etc., for an e-table.

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

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If they lose any staff over this I hope its only 1 specific floorperson, everyone else at AJs is pretty good to deal with.

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A moustache perchance?

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

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If they lose any staff over this I hope its only 1 specific floorperson, everyone else at AJs is pretty good to deal with.

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A moustache perchance?

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Yes. Really just unpleasant about everything and I dont know why since AJs has to be the easiest room for a floorperson Ive ever seen. I haven't seen him much recently though since Ive been playing weekend afternoons which is nice.

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

For the longest time I just thought he was putting people on with his behavior, so it didn't bother me. I just couldn't believe that someone in that position could actually get away acting like that. Then I came to the same realization as you.

Re: Follow up on-AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

I was by there this afternoon and they are using the electronic poker table for $40 no-limit sit-n-go's.

My guess is that this will be a goldmine for the internet players. Imagine a table full of passive, limit, live cash players!

Re: Follow up on-AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

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My guess is that this will be a goldmine for the internet players.

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Hard to say ... maybe true for those few who still remember how to beat a game without PokerTracker!

Re: Follow up on-AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

I'm curious to try it just to see what the distribution of cards is. On my old Party account and the accounts I've got now, the cards never seemed to come out the way they do in real life. I don't know if I've had the fabled "Doomswitch" accounts or what, but the way the cards fall is just... weird.

Re: AYAAH, Electronic poker table at Artichoke Joe\'s
 

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Guess I must be the only dealer around who's not worried about these things.


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You're not.