Which one is hardest?
 

For a reasonably fit person with decent work capacity, etc.---which of these would be hardest to accomplish?

(1) 2xBW bench press
(2) 2.5xBW squat
(3) 3xBW deadlift
(4) Straddle planche pushup ( http://youtube.com/watch?v=Qu5ikO0UFjE )
(5) 36 in. standing vertical

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

Ok, I know the disturbing subtlety of this question makes it scary to answer with merely the anonymity of your 2+2 handle. So lets make it double-blind:

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

The answer will likely greatly depend on said persons height and thus the mechanics of said lift

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

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The answer will likely greatly depend on said persons height and thus the mechanics of said lift

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Excellent answer.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

I would guess the 36" vertical would be the most difficult for most people. With years of strength training most people can build up to very high levels, but with vertical jump there are physical limits to most people based on how high their calf muscles are set and how many fast twitch fibers their muscles can recruit. It might not seem so if you read the NFL Combine results, but I believe 36" is close to world class and well beyond the limits of most people. It's like the equivalent of running a sub 10.5 second 100m.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

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I would guess the 36" vertical would be the most difficult for most people. With years of strength training most people can build up to very high levels, but with vertical jump there are physical limits to most people based on how high their calf muscles are set and how many fast twitch fibers their muscles can recruit. It might not seem so if you read the NFL Combine results, but I believe 36" is close to world class and well beyond the limits of most people. It's like the equivalent of running a sub 10.5 second 100m.

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While what you say is somewhat true. A 2.5x BW squat is pretty world class and the two are very closely related. I doubt there may be anyone on the planet who can squat 1000 and not hop 30 inches. Even those 350+ behemoths.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

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I would guess the 36" vertical would be the most difficult for most people. With years of strength training most people can build up to very high levels, but with vertical jump there are physical limits to most people based on how high their calf muscles are set and how many fast twitch fibers their muscles can recruit. It might not seem so if you read the NFL Combine results, but I believe 36" is close to world class and well beyond the limits of most people. It's like the equivalent of running a sub 10.5 second 100m.

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While what you say is somewhat true. A 2.5x BW squat is pretty world class and the two are very closely related. I doubt there may be anyone on the planet who can squat 1000 and not hop 30 inches. Even those 350+ behemoths.

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i don't know about this...i think the heavyweight powerlifters than can squat 1000lbs and weight over 300/400 lbs are not gonna jump anywhere near "world class" 30-35inches...these guys carry way too much bodyfat which will kill your vertical jump even though they are strong in the correct muscles for good hops...

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

30-35 isn't world class. There are probably over 100k of these people on the planet. World class would be 40+ easily and even then there would be thousands in my estimation.

The average male jumps what 17?

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

I voted for 2xBW bench because that would probably be hardest for me.

About those huge powerlifters who can squat 3xBW, yes they're moving a ton of weight in those squats but they're not moving the weight fast/explosively at all so I don't think that kind of strength translates well to their vertical leap. I have no experience about any of this and am basing this on intuition/opinion [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

Weightlifters actually do work on explosiveness/speed. Many specifically have a "speed day" in their work-out schedule.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

This is dumb. Answer: It depends on the person.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

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This is dumb. Answer: It depends on the person.

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QFT, but........which would be hardest for you Smiley?

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

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This is dumb. Answer: It depends on the person.

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QFT, but........which would be hardest for you Smiley?

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2xbw bench ldo. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Over the past year it's possible I've raised my bench from 1xBW to....1.2XBW SHIP IT HOLLA.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

I think it's def 36in vertical. you are born with that kind of stuff.

Other stuff is hard as hell and i think that is mostly genetic as well, but not like vertical.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

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This is dumb. Answer: It depends on the person.

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QFT, but........which would be hardest for you Smiley?

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2xbw bench ldo. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Over the past year it's possible I've raised my bench from 1xBW to....1.2XBW SHIP IT HOLLA.

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surprising, maybe, hmmmm, maybe not.

i wish it was the hardest for me.
the silly gymanstic push up plange disaster looks like a huge problem in my dept., especially considering how ridiculously sore a bunch of handstand pushups made me today. good god.

how is your "bench technique"?

i got a couple of pointers from a powerlifter friend and it made my twice a year benching sessions much more productive and easier. anyhooooooo.......nice to know you aren't superman. later. J.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

this depends on bodytype, for example im 6 2 225, i have done a 2.5x bw squat, come close to a 3x bw deadlift(with no gear just a belt) and benched 385 for a pause rep with no gear(so im sure i could have easily done 2x bw if i had a bench shirt, etc). my vertical was over 36 inches when i was in high school(when i was 6 0 and 155 and a high and long jumper). there is no way in hell i could come close to doing a planche push up.

some gymnast guy could bust out 5 of them in row and not come close to a 36 inch vert, but could probably come close to the lifts as gymnasts are VERY strong pound for pound. plenty of basketball players have much better verticals than 36" and couldnt come close to the lifts or the planche.

i'll say this, all the x bodyweight lifts are way easier when you dont weigh very much, same thing with planches and one arm push ups(i can do 100 push ups in a row easily and do 10 push ups with 3 45 pound plates on my back but cant do a one arm push up to save my life) and one legged squats(pistols)

i would say that if someone can bench 225 for more than 10 reps, squat 315 for ten good reps, deadlift 365 for 5 reps and clean 225 for 3-5 reps, that person is STRONG regardless of bodyweight. if you can do 12 pull ups and you weigh over 200 pounds, thats great, if you can only do 12 pull ups and you weigh 140, lol

a small guy doing bodyweight stuff, meh, who cares, a big guy lifting alot, meh who cares. when a small guy can move alot of weight, thats impressive. when a big guy can excel at bodyweight exercises and move well thats impressive too.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

Yeah, I guess a planche pushup becomes close to impossible as you get any taller than 5'8" or 5'9" or something.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

I voted for 36" vertical, but after I watched the video of that push up I want to change my vote.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

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I voted for 36" vertical, but after I watched the video of that push up I want to change my vote.

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Seriously? I would think that the average person would at least have a fighting chance of doing the pushup with years of training. I have read that the average vert of a Division 1 men's basketball player is 28". So the average person probably is probably at 20-22". There's simply no way in hell they'd ever get to 36". They could take all the Winstol and Erythropoietin they could get and they'd still have zero chance.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

Uston,

Why would EPO, a compound used by bikers to increase RBC count and thus improve aerobic prowess, do much with respect to extremely short term explosive power production?

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

LOL @ Winny-V being used for "strength".

Put that clown on a test/deca cycle and rerun.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

I know this is probably not relavent, and that with training I could get my wrists to be more flexible, BUT;

I looked at my hand and pointed it upward = 12 o clock.
I flexed it down and could get 90 degrees = 9 o clock,
then i tried to flex it backwards and got
as far as 45 degrees, it hurt if i went farther = 1:30
(no weight bearing on my wrists)
To do that wierd push up you need to put your wrist at
approx 135 degrees = 4:30 and put half your body weight
on each wrist.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

You could try it on parallettes if you think wrist flexibility is the sticking point.

(Btw, I don't have a planche and am not trying to attain one.)

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

I don't know how I am supposed to guess how hard that push up is. I have never done one. I would imagine it is mostly body tension control and not strength.

I am pretty sure there is nothing I could do to get a 36 inch vert. So i choose that.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

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Uston,

Why would EPO, a compound used by bikers to increase RBC count and thus improve aerobic prowess, do much with respect to extremely short term explosive power production?

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Eh, pharmacology isn't my strong suit, LDO. My thoughts were that the EPO would help get someone's bodyfat freakishly low.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

I'm 6'4" and the only one of these that seems possible at all for me is a 3xBW deadlift. I can do 2xBW without too much work on it. I've been squatting 3x per week for the last year and a half to get to 325lb ATG. No way will I ever get to 600lb+. Some short stubby guys make it seem easy to squat 2.5xBW or bench 2xBW.

True 36" standing vert is very rare.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

blah blah blah it depends on the person

but for your typical run of the mill average reasonably fit person, its the 36" vertical and it isnt even remotely close.

Also the planche looks sick hard, but would actually be MUCH easier to achieve through training for your average person than a 2x bench and the other lifting feats.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

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I'm 6'4" and the only one of these that seems possible at all for me is a 3xBW deadlift. I can do 2xBW without too much work on it. I've been squatting 3x per week for the last year and a half to get to 325lb ATG. No way will I ever get to 600lb+. Some short stubby guys make it seem easy to squat 2.5xBW or bench 2xBW.

True 36" standing vert is very rare.

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There are entire NCAA D1 secondaries where no starter or regular has under a 36 inch vert. I'm sure anyone at the Olympic trials for high jump can match this in addition to a decent number of volleyball and basketball players or any other vertical leap sports.

The raw 3x dead is probably more rare than a dude with a 36 inch vert.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

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I'm 6'4" and the only one of these that seems possible at all for me is a 3xBW deadlift. I can do 2xBW without too much work on it. I've been squatting 3x per week for the last year and a half to get to 325lb ATG. No way will I ever get to 600lb+. Some short stubby guys make it seem easy to squat 2.5xBW or bench 2xBW.

True 36" standing vert is very rare.

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There are entire NCAA D1 secondaries where no starter or regular has under a 36 inch vert. I'm sure anyone at the Olympic trials for high jump can match this in addition to a decent number of volleyball and basketball players or any other vertical leap sports.

The raw 3x dead is probably more rare than a dude with a 36 inch vert.

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I played volleyball fairly competitively in high school in Canada, and 36 inch verticles were very common, and many of the players I played with didn`t do any jump training or even much athletic activity outside of volleyball.

I`d assume that of people who get very competitive in volleyball/basketball, quite a huge % can jump.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

i don't know much about jumping...how technical is it to actually jump properly? i imagine that with a bit of training a person could improve their vert a bit...

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

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I'm 6'4" and the only one of these that seems possible at all for me is a 3xBW deadlift. I can do 2xBW without too much work on it. I've been squatting 3x per week for the last year and a half to get to 325lb ATG. No way will I ever get to 600lb+. Some short stubby guys make it seem easy to squat 2.5xBW or bench 2xBW.

True 36" standing vert is very rare.

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There are entire NCAA D1 secondaries where no starter or regular has under a 36 inch vert. I'm sure anyone at the Olympic trials for high jump can match this in addition to a decent number of volleyball and basketball players or any other vertical leap sports.

The raw 3x dead is probably more rare than a dude with a 36 inch vert.

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meh, most of those vert numbers are BS. Its like 40 yard dash times, EVERYONE is running the 40 in 4.3 or whatever, but in reality almost none of them are. A true vert jump is flat flooted straight up in the air, and 36" is out of reach for the average person, regardless of the amount of training. Now maybe the same is true for a 3x deadlift, but I think given the way people age, The window to achieve a strength feat is much bigger than the window to achieve one based on explosive power.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

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I played volleyball fairly competitively in high school in Canada, and 36 inch verticles were very common, and many of the players I played with didn`t do any jump training or even much athletic activity outside of volleyball.

I`d assume that of people who get very competitive in volleyball/basketball, quite a huge % can jump.

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Then you played with athletes who would be elite even in the NFL. Dwayne Wade has a 36" vertical with a one-step runup. His standing vert is a few inches less. the avg NBA 1st round pick has around 28" of hops.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

I've always used a 1 step vert.

I've noticed there are differences in people, some get better jumps off one foot when running, some when two. It just depends. I guess I'm leaning toward the teachable aspect of it.

There's just so little benefit to training entirely for vertical leap at the expense of other sports.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

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I'm 6'4" and the only one of these that seems possible at all for me is a 3xBW deadlift. I can do 2xBW without too much work on it. I've been squatting 3x per week for the last year and a half to get to 325lb ATG. No way will I ever get to 600lb+. Some short stubby guys make it seem easy to squat 2.5xBW or bench 2xBW.

True 36" standing vert is very rare.

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There are entire NCAA D1 secondaries where no starter or regular has under a 36 inch vert. I'm sure anyone at the Olympic trials for high jump can match this in addition to a decent number of volleyball and basketball players or any other vertical leap sports.

The raw 3x dead is probably more rare than a dude with a 36 inch vert.

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meh, most of those vert numbers are BS. Its like 40 yard dash times, EVERYONE is running the 40 in 4.3 or whatever, but in reality almost none of them are. A true vert jump is flat flooted straight up in the air, and 36" is out of reach for the average person, regardless of the amount of training. Now maybe the same is true for a 3x deadlift, but I think given the way people age, The window to achieve a strength feat is much bigger than the window to achieve one based on explosive power.

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I'd be surprised if this weren't true. I remember reading somewhere that men's strength peaks in their 40's. But we all know that, for instance, boxers are usually long since flat-footed by that time. The legs loose their spring fairly young.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

Blarg,

I'll go with that. I think its late 30s personally for strength peak. Like no 25 year old can compete with someone in their late 30s other factors equal. But tennis etc... This is weird. Too much thinking.

Re: Which one is hardest?
 

I only made this thread to confirm that people would grossly underestimate the difficulty of the squat and deadlift. Interesting.