3/5nl
 

So my local cardroom has introduced a 3/5nl $200max game (with $1 on the button and $4 rake every hand even if there's no flop so you basically you start the hand with only $5 in play from the $9) and I'm having a tough time adjusting to it, especially from online play. I was a fairly experienced live player before I moved to online play but for the last year apparently I've forgotten how to play live poker. I just cannot get used to playing short and have had no luck finding books on the subject or even experienced players to pick their brain. The game seems pretty passive but it can be pretty aggro as well. Some fish out there, but some nits as well.

The hardest parts about the game seem to be figuring out when to c-bet and other dynamics, since you're only 40bb deep any bet into a healthy field is like committing to the pot. How should I be adjusting my preflop ranges with the small stacks because youre not exactly getting any real implied odds because if other people are deep you're still short. And assuming this game has a lot of variance, how should the bankroll be adjusted? Is 20 buyins 20-$200 buyins totalling 4k enough, or should it be more because 20 buyins at 100bb would be 10k? Help me 2+2 [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

Re: 3/5nl
 

If there is such an outrageous rake I wouldnt even consider playing here, as well as the $200 max buy-in. This game is going to turn into an allin donk fest.

Re: 3/5nl
 

lol at the rake

Re: 3/5nl
 

Yeah, I will admit the rake is the most ridiculous thing ever. However, the players are pretty bad so this makes up for it. Plus the idea of having to drive a long ways for any nl action isn't too great so I think if I can find a way to beat this game then there will be an acceptable medium.

Re: 3/5nl
 

with a $200 max buyin and big rake, it would be very difficult to make long term profit from this game. even if the players are horrible, their horribleness is de-emphasized by the low buyin.

Re: 3/5nl
 

I guess that depends on how quickly the game gets (and stays) deep.

Re: 3/5nl
 

[ QUOTE ]
I guess that depends on how quickly the game gets (and stays) deep.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, I guess at some point I should've mentioned that although you have to start short it's not uncommon to have some decent stacks at the table (around 4-600+). The problem isn't finding donks with money on the table, it's finding a way to get it all when you're startig so short.

Re: 3/5nl
 

There's no way I play here. *chuckle*

Re: 3/5nl
 

i don't care how bad the players are, its almost doubtlessly negative ev for you to play in that game.

Re: 3/5nl
 

[ QUOTE ]
i don't care how bad the players are, its almost doubtlessly negative ev for you to play in that game.

[/ QUOTE ]

heh, it sure seems that way. How about if this was a 500max or uncapped game? Would this still be a pretty bad game to play in?

Re: 3/5nl
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
i don't care how bad the players are, its almost doubtlessly negative ev for you to play in that game.

[/ QUOTE ]

heh, it sure seems that way. How about if this was a 500max or uncapped game? Would this still be a pretty bad game to play in?

[/ QUOTE ]

I think so. The rake is absolutely ridiculous.

Re: 3/5nl
 

Except for the dollar on the button, this is the identical structure of the Commerce game. Its quite profitable. I think theytake a 5th dollar on the turn. No flop, just a dollar drop at the commerce.

Re: 3/5nl
 

This rake isn't even close to being unbeatable. $4/hand * 30 hands/hour = $120/hour that's coming off the table. That's the same as paying $6/half in time charge. High, yes. Unbeatable, not at all.

40BB is an awkward stack size, but in a live game you should find it easy enough to get all your chips in on the flop and get a quick double up. Play a solid short stack strategy and once you and some opponents have doubled up, you're 80BB deep. This will be very boring, no doubt, but also profitable. The key to making the best hourly rate in a game with such a low buy in is playing longer sessions. Once you double up or better, your winrate should go up.

And since it's an immediate drop, stealing the blinds is worthless. Just find someone who will play with you for all their chips when they're taking the worst of it. I'm sure most of the players will fit this description.

Re: 3/5nl
 

[ QUOTE ]
Except for the dollar on the button, this is the identical structure of the Commerce game. Its quite profitable. I think theytake a 5th dollar on the turn. No flop, just a dollar drop at the commerce.

[/ QUOTE ]

They only take rake preflop every hand no matter what. After that there is no extra drop.


[ QUOTE ]
This rake isn't even close to being unbeatable. $4/hand * 30 hands/hour = $120/hour that's coming off the table. That's the same as paying $6/half in time charge. High, yes. Unbeatable, not at all.

40BB is an awkward stack size, but in a live game you should find it easy enough to get all your chips in on the flop and get a quick double up. Play a solid short stack strategy and once you and some opponents have doubled up, you're 80BB deep. This will be very boring, no doubt, but also profitable. The key to making the best hourly rate in a game with such a low buy in is playing longer sessions. Once you double up or better, your winrate should go up.

And since it's an immediate drop, stealing the blinds is worthless. Just find someone who will play with you for all their chips when they're taking the worst of it. I'm sure most of the players will fit this description.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah I've pretty much just ignored stealing blinds because not only is it pointless, there are always too many players in the hand to be able to steal. I'm lost as to what is a profitable shortstack strategy? Am I basically looking to play pairs for set value and big cards hoping to get it all in with a hand like tptk or combo draw? I just can't figure out what I'm exactly looking to do. It seems just trying to outplay opponents postflop isn't as affective because of being short. I just can't find the best way to get that first double up. Should I open up my range and try to take a lot of flops, or basically play lock down poker where I'm just looking to get it in?