Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

Ok so it's day 4, 2nd level of the day (4k/8k, 1k)of the WSOP ME. I have just moved to a new table about 30mins before. Notables are scotty nyguen in the 9 seat, and daniel alahei (sp?) in the 5 seat, im in seat 6. I've played only 2 hands so far, one was a raise that was uncalled, another was a shove over alahei's raise (i had apprx: 180k) with AQo and he tanked and called with AQo for a chop.

Anyway onto the hand in question
-Hero: ~160k in chips
-Button: ~600k+
-SB: ~200k
-BB (nyguen): 500k+

I am in middle position and look down at JJ. I raise to 24k (still 4k/8k). Button calls is old guy who does lots of talking, immedietly asked me my name when i sat down and such. SB is an old guy who hasn't said a thing, he peeks at his cards and after a few seconds pushes all his chips in the middle. I have no reads on the guy. Total chips in the middle at this point is 89k. I have 135k left.

Call or fold? (as this is my bust hand it's obvious that i called) however what ranges do you put him on and why? How likly is this a squeeze or some other type of play? Just thoughts in general.

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

Without a read, this is a very easy call. SB is described as "old guy", which might be a read. How had SB been playing?

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

this is a pretty clear shove.... theres just absolutely no realistic range he can have here that you arent getting odds to call. without running the numbers, im almost certain that you have odds to call QQ+, AK, and his range may well include TT+ and AQ, possibly even 99.

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

"old guy" shoves

fold everything but KK+

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

Sorry you busted on this hand, but unless you won the event you had to bust sometime. This looks like a good place to go broke or get chips. You are well below average and if you fold you are pretty much reduced to playing two card poker (push or fold). Hopefully you are up against AK, AQ, TT or maybe even 99. His range may include a lot worse than that because villian is short as well.

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

JJ
+
20bbs deep
+
I open in late and get called to provide a good squeeze opportunity
=
all in

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

[ QUOTE ]
JJ
+
20bbs deep
+
I open in late and get called to provide a good squeeze opportunity
=
all in

[/ QUOTE ]

old guys dont squeeze but who cares we have jacks and 20 BB

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

[ QUOTE ]
this is a pretty clear shove.... theres just absolutely no realistic range he can have here that you arent getting odds to call. without running the numbers, im almost certain that you have odds to call QQ+, AK, and his range may well include TT+ and AQ, possibly even 99.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is the exact range that i put him on.

Also the fact that he was an old guy did make me want to put him in a higher range, but i felt like QQ was the only hand that had me beat.

Anyway glad others put him on a similar range. He ended up being on a squeeze with Q8o (which i think was a bad play considering my image and stack size)

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

[ QUOTE ]
old guys dont squeeze

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
someone stole an old guy's skin and wore it

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
someone stole an old guy's skin and wore it

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]

yes that was my read that some young LAGGY internet player stole an old guys skin. Goodnews is he busted when the table was moved to the feature table so i get to see what genius play busted him from the ME

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

This is definately a disguised BBV post.

Anyone who makes it to day 4 may know how to do a squeeze play.

Didn't Doyle Brunson bust out of the WPT Championship restealing with Q8o against JJ.

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

[ QUOTE ]
This is definately a disguised BBV post.

Anyone who makes it to day 4 may know how to do a squeeze play.

Didn't Doyle Brunson bust out of the WPT Championship restealing with Q8o against JJ.

[/ QUOTE ]
yeah and Ted Forrest made that insane AJ call, still one of my favorite plays

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

WTF!? live old guys squeeze?

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

[ QUOTE ]
WTF!? live old guys squeeze?

[/ QUOTE ]

dozens of dollars, dozens of dollars!

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

[ QUOTE ]


Anyone who makes it to day 4 may know how to do a squeeze play.

[/ QUOTE ]

Although I am 0-3 for making it to day 4, I have to doubt this postulation.

Blah.

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

[ QUOTE ]

Anyone who makes it to day 4 may know how to do a squeeze play.

[/ QUOTE ]

BAN!

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Anyone who makes it to day 4 may know how to do a squeeze play.

[/ QUOTE ]

BAN!

[/ QUOTE ]
Fine BAN! anyone who disagrees with you. I gave the example of Brunson restealing with Q8o to imply that you can't assume someone only reraises big pairs based on age. If you were seated with Doyle, you wouldn't think, "oh, an old nit".

There are a lot of strong players who in the ME. By day 4, the field in general is probably atleast 1/3 professional players.

In the ME, you have plenty of time to get a read on people's style of play. That is why I asked how the old guy had been playing.

You can't assume every old guy is an ABC nit. Plus, I good TAG player could exploit his image and age to make plays like this.

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

I was at your table for this hand and was kinda suprised when it took you so long to move in with JJ, it seemed like a really easy shove at the time, but i guess you didn't know that the old guy wasn't a typical old live guy.

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

This is a must call against any range, plus the possibility of a squeeze makes it even more of a call.

This seems like a good time for my JJ vs. a squeeze story from the Main Event. Foreign guy in his 30's (Villain) just got moved to my table at the end of Day 1. He hasn't seen me show down the worst cards imaginable all day long, only hand he's seen me play (out of a total of 10 hands or so) was a monster pot I won where I had QQ. I have 80K, he has 30K, blinds are 400/800 I think. I raise to 2K UTG, MP calls, Villain raises to 8K in the SB, BB folds, I instantly shove because I'm including the strong possibility of a squeeze. MP folds, Villain thinks forever and folds KK face up.

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

[ QUOTE ]
This is a must call against any range, plus the possibility of a squeeze makes it even more of a call.

This seems like a good time for my JJ vs. a squeeze story from the Main Event. Foreign guy in his 30's (Villain) just got moved to my table at the end of Day 1. He hasn't seen me show down the worst cards imaginable all day long, only hand he's seen me play (out of a total of 10 hands or so) was a monster pot I won where I had QQ. I have 80K, he has 30K, blinds are 400/800 I think. I raise to 2K UTG, MP calls, Villain raises to 8K in the SB, BB folds, I instantly shove because I'm including the strong possibility of a squeeze. MP folds, Villain thinks forever and folds KK face up.

[/ QUOTE ]
And with KK you mean two Kings, right? Lol. Nice story.

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

cking... were you ever really thinking about folding this? I think this is only a fold vs. Alan Kessler.

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

Wow,

I'm so looking forward to being an old guy and squeeze all the young hotshots w garbage [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]







...only other old guys will probably be doing it by then [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

Re: Day 4, WSOP ME bustout hand
 

I gave folding a consideration. But i wasnt sticking my chips in till i put him on a range of hands. I hadn't been at the table long and once i counted the pot in my head, saw how few chips i had and put him on a range of hands it was easy.

Afterwards talking to people everyone felt like it was a good call in terms of math and equity i have just been meaning to post it on here.

Also freehat i dont think i took more then a minute or so

EDIT: Also this was only the 3rd time I had been all in the entire tournament with the only other time being earlier in that day with AK vs a resteal with A7 and the AQ hand vs Alahei. Point was I didnt want to race until i was sure my hand was a race and i considered my chip stack and the situation.