LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

5 or 6 handed cuz table hasn't filled up yet.
Blinds 25-50 10k starting stacks and effective stacks.

Hero UTG makes it 150 with TT
Villain in BB makes it 600
Hero Call

flop AJT rainbow
villain makes it 750
hero calls (thoughts?)

turn AJTJ
villain makes it 1700
hero calls (thoughts?)

river 4
villain pushes approx 7k
hero ??

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

You're right against Aaron this was an easy fold.

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

Kinda sick, but when you think about this, river is a fold. I kind of like your flop call because you never get any money out of him by raising and only a K/Q is really a scare card (which will often scare him as much as you.)

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

My initial thought was fold, but after doing some stove calcs it is pretty close is he can three bet widish.
Giving him a range of
AA,JJ,AJs,KJs,KQs,QJs,JTs,AJo
It's a call.

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

This would be a horrible spot for him to bluff, he probably knows you are strong and just hopes you stack off I suppose.

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

[ QUOTE ]
My initial thought was fold, but after doing some stove calcs it is pretty close is he can three bet widish.
Giving him a range of
AA,JJ,AJs,KJs,KQs,QJs,JTs,AJo
It's a call.

[/ QUOTE ]

Aaron doesn't play all these hands this way though he knows we have a huge hand and he doesn't expect us to fold.

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
My initial thought was fold, but after doing some stove calcs it is pretty close is he can three bet widish.
Giving him a range of
AA,JJ,AJs,KJs,KQs,QJs,JTs,AJo
It's a call.

[/ QUOTE ]

Aaron doesn't play all these hands this way though he knows we have a huge hand and he doesn't expect us to fold.

[/ QUOTE ]
Ya your right. I didn't see the river was an overbet.

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

I think Aaron has aces full here every time.

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

In real life I do the Phil Hellmuth knock my chips over instacall, but I really can't imagine him having anything but a full house or a bluff. And what could he be bluffing with? Nothing makes sense. He reraised you from the blinds when you raised UTG; he rarely has preflop air. He's not playing kings and queens this way on the flop and turn. He's not shoving AK/AQ. This can't be the best way to play KQ.

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

I think that this is a pretty standard fold.

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

I can definitely see how it's a fold, but I would hardly call it 'standard' or 'easy'.

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

[ QUOTE ]
I can definitely see how it's a fold, but I would hardly call it 'standard' or 'easy'.

[/ QUOTE ]

meh, it's pretty standard...we beat a 3 street superbluff into a fairly obvious KQ+

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I can definitely see how it's a fold, but I would hardly call it 'standard' or 'easy'.

[/ QUOTE ]

meh, it's pretty standard...we beat a 3 street superbluff into a fairly obvious KQ+

[/ QUOTE ]

Yea, I agree it doesn't seem like we can beat anything but a bluff. But am I the only one who finds making these folds actually hard in the heat of the moment?

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

aaron is clearly 'valuebluffing' AK here.

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I can definitely see how it's a fold, but I would hardly call it 'standard' or 'easy'.

[/ QUOTE ]

meh, it's pretty standard...we beat a 3 street superbluff into a fairly obvious KQ+

[/ QUOTE ]

Yea, I agree it doesn't seem like we can beat anything but a bluff. But am I the only one who finds making these folds actually hard in the heat of the moment?

[/ QUOTE ]

You need to stop thinking about your absolute hand strength (zomg boat!) and start thinking about your relative hand strength (I beat nothing, absolutely nothing). Once you change the way you think you will be a better and much more profitable player.

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I can definitely see how it's a fold, but I would hardly call it 'standard' or 'easy'.

[/ QUOTE ]

meh, it's pretty standard...we beat a 3 street superbluff into a fairly obvious KQ+

[/ QUOTE ]

Yea, I agree it doesn't seem like we can beat anything but a bluff. But am I the only one who finds making these folds actually hard in the heat of the moment?

[/ QUOTE ]

You need to stop thinking about your absolute hand strength (zomg boat!) and start thinking about your relative hand strength (I beat nothing, absolutely nothing). Once you change the way you think you will be a better and much more profitable player.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ouch.

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

are we unknown?

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I can definitely see how it's a fold, but I would hardly call it 'standard' or 'easy'.

[/ QUOTE ]

meh, it's pretty standard...we beat a 3 street superbluff into a fairly obvious KQ+

[/ QUOTE ]

Yea, I agree it doesn't seem like we can beat anything but a bluff. But am I the only one who finds making these folds actually hard in the heat of the moment?

[/ QUOTE ]

You need to stop thinking about your absolute hand strength (zomg boat!) and start thinking about your relative hand strength (I beat nothing, absolutely nothing). Once you change the way you think you will be a better and much more profitable player.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ouch.

[/ QUOTE ]

Daniel, dont let it get to you, your a ranked superstar. [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

btw i agree with what cornellfiji says here.

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

If you're calling with tens full here, you might as well be calling with QQ. Fold and feel good that you just saved 7K chips vs. a skilled opponent who is basically NEVER 3-street bluffing in the first round of a deep-stacked tourney... certainly not for stacks. Whether or not Hero is "unknown" is irrelevant in this situation, IMO.

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

Fwiw Aaron said he had complete air but he also said you got the bet sizes wrong.

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

[ QUOTE ]
Fwiw Aaron said he had complete air but he also said you got the bet sizes wrong.

[/ QUOTE ]

Learn to recall a hand correctly or deal with having no credibility forever.

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

[ QUOTE ]
Fwiw Aaron said he had complete air but he also said you got the bet sizes wrong.

[/ QUOTE ]


[img]/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

[ QUOTE ]
Fwiw Aaron said he had complete air but he also said you got the bet sizes wrong.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's like... sooooooo not Aaron Been

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

[ QUOTE ]

You need to stop thinking about your absolute hand strength (zomg boat!) and start thinking about your relative hand strength (I beat nothing, absolutely nothing). Once you change the way you think you will be a better and much more profitable player.

[/ QUOTE ]

Very well put. i liiiiiike

Post deleted by Ryan Beal
 

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

loll. I always wonder why spammers choose the threads they do.

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

lol

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think that this is a pretty standard fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

Cornell (and Gobbo),

Why such strong convictions re: a fold? It this somethings specific about Aaaron (I know nothing about him, so have no knowledge of how he plays)? If he is a reasonable player then the only real hand he can have that fits his betting and beats us is aces full, nothing else makes sense. In fact, against most players, I still don't think this makes much sense. Hero has only called in this hand possibly conveying weakness to villain. I don't see why we can't be ahead here, most likely against some kind of a value bluff that thinks hero can be pushed off of hand.

Please explain your thinking, esp if this is something specific to Aaron.

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

bet was 950 not 750 on flop, everything else correct. yes he claims he was bluffing with 78 but i believe that as likely as i do that he thinks jamie gold is good.

the questions are more honestly preflop and flop then it is river I guess. By the way, I am not an unknown

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

lol aaron is supposed to be good as [censored], so i have no idea why people are so sure he wasnt FOS here

he's repping 2 hands, and AA def doesnt always take this line.

so he's repping like 1.5 hands here

and we beat everything else.

saying "i fold without much thought" or "standard fold" or any of that nonsense that ppl are saying to show how baller they are that omg i can fold 3rd nuts without batting an eye is nothing more than show-off and unreasoned

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

5th nuts

and it's a fold because you don't beat any of the made hands in his range; if he's running a total bluff, that's one of those things that's totally dependent on a live read of him

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

[ QUOTE ]
and it's a fold because you don't beat any of the made hands in his range

[/ QUOTE ]

do i seriously come across as retarded enough that this is a necessary point to make?

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

[ QUOTE ]
do i seriously come across as retarded enough that this is a necessary point to make?

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
saying "i fold without much thought" or "standard fold" or any of that nonsense that ppl are saying to show how baller they are that omg i can fold 3rd nuts without batting an eye is nothing more than show-off and unreasoned

[/ QUOTE ]

i'm confused, do you want people to not explain why it's a fold, or to explain why it's a fold?

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

what's his bet size on the river with KQ?

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

THERE'S NOTHING TO EXPLAIN.

this is supposed to be High Stakes MTT. leave the explanations for regular MTT where people don't know how to put people on ranges.

i know that we don't beat anything but what he has turned into a bluff.

KQ is totally irrelevant, he has nuts or relative air here always bro

and just so we're clear, i didnt say it's necessarily a call. im just saying that if it's so [censored] clear, then that's a huge dig at aaron's abilities

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

if aaron had checked, what would you do?

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

small bet/call shove

and that's part of the reason why this isn't some slam dunk. if he just shoves river with JJ every time, he's not nearly as good as the impression i've gotten from the respect ppl give him.

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

I still don't see why hero has shown enough strength for Aaron to think he's calling a shove on the river. I also don't see why Aaron should suspect that a naked J, KQ, or AK or something isn't good.

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

LOL

Re: LVL 1 Bellagio 5k vs AaronBeen
 

aaron's betsize on the river with KQ is shove turning it into a bluff.

if checked to, I check behind i'm pretty sure