I Play Weak-Tight
 

Casino AZ 20/40 game that I have been crushing. I am up almost 4 racks in under 3 hours, and a few at the table are doing everything they can to stay out of my way, while others are simply oblivious. UTG is fairly loose and aggressive, but can find folds once in awhile if he thinks he is beat. MP1 is loose as hell and can never find a fold in him. The other cold callers are loose passive idiots who love two cards that have the same shape on them. BB is scared of me, which is the only reason he folds preflop.

UTG raises, I three bet AQo in UTG+1, MP1 tries to call 2 bets, I point out it is three, and he calls even though action hasn't passed him. Two other people come along, and both blinds fold, and UTG calls.

Flop comes AK5 rainbow, UTG checks, I bet, MP1 raises, two folds, UTG threeballs, and I...

Also, am I being too agressive at a 9 handed table with AQo in UTG+1?

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

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UTG is fairly loose and aggressive, but can find folds once in awhile if he thinks he is beat.

Also, am I being too agressive at a 9 handed table with AQo in UTG+1?

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No.

I think there's a reasonable chance that will are still ahead here just because I believe a LAG would cap AK/AA/KK preflop, but I don't like the fact that we have to pay 2 bets. I wouldn't begrudge a fold too much, but I think I call here just so we can see if MP caps. If he does, I think we can lay it down on the turn. If he doesn't, I'm thinking about raising the turn bet by UTG(non J or T) as one of my final bets into the pot but probably just getting to showdown immediately.

This spot is difficult for me and may be considered spew.

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

In this situation your reraise is correct preflop based upon your read of UTG. Hopefully you can limit the field a little bit even though it sounds like a loose table. If the UTG was a tight raiser or a TAG I may just fold here.

As far as the rest of the hand goes I think you should fold. I know these guys are lags but you have been running over the game, three bet preflop, and your still getting lots of action on a not draw heavy board. Sure your may have outs if behind to hands like K5 or A5 but you know it is going to cost you to find out.

This is are my thoughts based upon the information you have given. If you have a read that these players tend to overplay their hands then that is a different story. I will take a guess and say A5 takes this down.

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

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MP1 is loose as hell and can never find a fold in him. The other cold callers are loose passive idiots who love two cards that have the same shape on them.

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If the guys behind you are that loose, I might not be seeing the flop with AQo here.
The chance you're limiting the field here is small, imo.

b

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

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MP1 is loose as hell and can never find a fold in him. The other cold callers are loose passive idiots who love two cards that have the same shape on them.

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If the guys behind you are that loose, I might not be seeing the flop with AQo here.
The chance you're limiting the field here is small, imo.

b

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Passing up the opportunity to iso a LAG with AQ is flushing money down the toilet.

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

Even if you are unable to isolate the UTG you are still punishing the other idiots who decide to call with a hand that might just be best preflop.

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

Not when UTG is loose and you are owning the table. Continue to steamroll and make them adjust.

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

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Casino AZ 20/40 game that I have been crushing. I am up almost 4 racks in under 3 hours, and a few at the table are doing everything they can to stay out of my way, while others are simply oblivious. UTG is fairly loose and aggressive, but can find folds once in awhile if he thinks he is beat. MP1 is loose as hell and can never find a fold in him. The other cold callers are loose passive idiots who love two cards that have the same shape on them. BB is scared of me, which is the only reason he folds preflop.

UTG raises, I three bet AQo in UTG+1, MP1 tries to call 2 bets, I point out it is three, and he calls even though action hasn't passed him. Two other people come along, and both blinds fold, and UTG calls.

Flop comes AK5 rainbow, UTG checks, I bet, MP1 raises, two folds, UTG threeballs, and I...

Also, am I being too agressive at a 9 handed table with AQo in UTG+1?

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I think maybe you're going to have to start taking your current image into account when making this type of decision. If UTG is a steady regular who knows that you're beating the game to death over the last couple of months and he is not the 'I've got to try and get revenge' type this is a likely fold. The CAZ game is not LA or LV. The player pool is smaller w/ fewer tourists. What I'm trying to say (doesn't look pretty so far) is that this decision is player dependant, imo, not a technical matter.

If we are all there together point out who UTG is and I can give you a better answer.

btw: How do you get the monies home? Brinks? [img]/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

I just call. If MP just calls, I would strongly think about popping the turn if you think UTG could have AJ/AT here. If MP cold-calls the turn, I probably check the river.

MP worries me the most in this hand.

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

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[ QUOTE ]
Casino AZ 20/40 game that I have been crushing. I am up almost 4 racks in under 3 hours, and a few at the table are doing everything they can to stay out of my way, while others are simply oblivious. UTG is fairly loose and aggressive, but can find folds once in awhile if he thinks he is beat. MP1 is loose as hell and can never find a fold in him. The other cold callers are loose passive idiots who love two cards that have the same shape on them. BB is scared of me, which is the only reason he folds preflop.

UTG raises, I three bet AQo in UTG+1, MP1 tries to call 2 bets, I point out it is three, and he calls even though action hasn't passed him. Two other people come along, and both blinds fold, and UTG calls.

Flop comes AK5 rainbow, UTG checks, I bet, MP1 raises, two folds, UTG threeballs, and I...

Also, am I being too agressive at a 9 handed table with AQo in UTG+1?

[/ QUOTE ]

I think maybe you're going to have to start taking your current image into account when making this type of decision. If UTG is a steady regular who knows that you're beating the game to death over the last couple of months and he is not the 'I've got to try and get revenge' type this is a likely fold. The CAZ game is not LA or LV. The player pool is smaller w/ fewer tourists. What I'm trying to say (doesn't look pretty so far) is that this decision is player dependant, imo, not a technical matter.

If we are all there together point out who UTG is and I can give you a better answer.

btw: How do you get the monies home? Brinks? [img]/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]

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The UTG was the same guy that was between us while you were still at the table. But this hand happened after you moved to the main game, so you weren't the BB that was scared of me [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]. If you need further clarification, you spilled his rock star and he bummed a smoke off of you.

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

I think I fold here, but I play weak-tight too. The problem with this spot is that we are in a really bad RIO situation, where it's going to be hard to get paid off very well if we have the best hand now, but when we are behind we could get whipsawed the whole way through. If one of these goobers has a set then we are drawing nearly dead, but we've got 5 fake outs that'll force us to show down. Even if MP3 just have 2 pair now, it'll be hard to get value when we draw out on him because there aren't any turn cards that'll make us love our hand.

PF seems pretty standard against a LAG.

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

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Casino AZ 20/40 game that I have been crushing. I am up almost 4 racks in under 3 hours, and a few at the table are doing everything they can to stay out of my way, while others are simply oblivious. UTG is fairly loose and aggressive, but can find folds once in awhile if he thinks he is beat. MP1 is loose as hell and can never find a fold in him. The other cold callers are loose passive idiots who love two cards that have the same shape on them. BB is scared of me, which is the only reason he folds preflop.

UTG raises, I three bet AQo in UTG+1, MP1 tries to call 2 bets, I point out it is three, and he calls even though action hasn't passed him. Two other people come along, and both blinds fold, and UTG calls.

Flop comes AK5 rainbow, UTG checks, I bet, MP1 raises, two folds, UTG threeballs, and I...

Also, am I being too agressive at a 9 handed table with AQo in UTG+1?

[/ QUOTE ]

I think maybe you're going to have to start taking your current image into account when making this type of decision. If UTG is a steady regular who knows that you're beating the game to death over the last couple of months and he is not the 'I've got to try and get revenge' type this is a likely fold. The CAZ game is not LA or LV. The player pool is smaller w/ fewer tourists. What I'm trying to say (doesn't look pretty so far) is that this decision is player dependant, imo, not a technical matter.

If we are all there together point out who UTG is and I can give you a better answer.

btw: How do you get the monies home? Brinks? [img]/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

The UTG was the same guy that was between us while you were still at the table. But this hand happened after you moved to the main game, so you weren't the BB that was scared of me [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]. If you need further clarification, you spilled his rock star and he bummed a smoke off of you.

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I think I cap against that guy. He's likely not holding KK, just an Ace and probably weaker than yours. That watch he was wearing costs more than my car so I don't think the money means much to him. Plus, he's a 40 regular and is just passing time in the 20. I think for him this is just fun. Raise his turn bet on most cards. If he 3-bets that one you're no good. Still, that money is just on loan. Nice guy, though. And I got the replacement Rock Star for just the tip. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

im calling down, unless this turns into a reraise war.

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

I don't think you can call i dont think he is limp/3-betting AJ or even AQ he obviously has huge hand otherwise he just would have donked flop. Considering his most likely holding here is AK I'd fold.

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

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MP1 is loose as hell and can never find a fold in him. The other cold callers are loose passive idiots who love two cards that have the same shape on them.

[/ QUOTE ]

If the guys behind you are that loose, I might not be seeing the flop with AQo here.
The chance you're limiting the field here is small, imo.

b

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Passing up the opportunity to iso a LAG with AQ is flushing money down the toilet.

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Given the players behind you, you're not Iso'ing a LAG. Ignoring that bit of info can also be seen as flushing money.

b

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

Wayyyy too agressive.

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

I had a similar situation in the pink (7.5/15) at the Trop a few weeks ago. I had JJ UTG against a 10 high flop. I had folded to a flop bet/raise several times in past hour and suspected my image was somewhat weak. I bet, fat drunk raised, late position reraised, the BB (a good player) check-capped, I just called. The turn was a blank, BB checked, I checked, and the other two players checked. River made a small straight possible. BB checked, I bet was was called by one other player. JJ was good.

On the other hand at my regular 4/8 home game where most of the players are somewhat tight, this is an insta-muck.

This is a hard decision. Top pair (Ax) will usually raise. Straight draws (QJ) will often bet or raise. UTG could have Ax and be trying to push you out or making a "free card" check raise. I suspect that you are no worse than second place, with a reasonable chance that you are best. In a tight game, this is an easy fold. But the game as you described is not tight. Your decision here is based entirely on how you read the game and the other players.

Do you smell that one of you opponents have two pair or set? Think at several levels. What do you think they have? What do they think that you have? How often do they try to muscle people of the pot? Do you usually showdown winners? Do they usually showdown winners? Weigh the possibilies, consider the payoffs and risks. If you have a weak-tight image, opponents are more willing to take shots at you.

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

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Given the players behind you, you're not Iso'ing a LAG. Ignoring that bit of info can also be seen as flushing money.

b

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Then the raise is for value. There's no way that not 3-betting preflop is anything but +EV if you have any idea what you're doing postflop.

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

Calling down is not terribly bad, I don't think. You probably sacrifice equity when you have the best hand against the MP, but you also save money when you don't. The UTG is supposedly a good player, so if you do have the best hand against him, you probably end up making him fold correctly on the turn/river if he does have AJ/AT, and not AK. If you do in fact raise, you probably are going to end up paying a whole bunch of bets to the MP if he has the best hand whom you are OOP against, also allowing the UTG to get away fairly pain free. The UTG calling out of position w/ AK preflop is not out of the question here, but so is him calling w/AJ, AT here. I think he takes the same line with all these hands.

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

Folding is best I dont think he is taking this line w/ a10-aj.

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

Fold flop.

Yes to second question.

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

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Given the players behind you, you're not Iso'ing a LAG. Ignoring that bit of info can also be seen as flushing money.

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If you could guarantee me that two loose passive idiots would cold call behind me here I'd be just as happy (or maybe even happier) to put in three bets here preflop with AQ.

-ActionBob

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

Was this hand typical for that game; i.e., getting three people cold-calling three bets after utg opens and utg+1 pops it? If it was, I certainly understand why you were up four racks. (And you were being especially generous to the dealer, right?)

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

Thanks for the responses. I am glad that my decision to fold was agreed on by many who posted. But unfortunately the one person who knows the guy (Howard) had the best answer, in a player specific and results oriented way. I still don't know if the exact situation came up again, if I would be able to close my eyes and call 3 BBs down, hoping to be good.

Results for those of you who like stuff like this.

Well, after the UTG guy threebet, images of AK were dancing in my head, and that doesn't take into consideration the MP1 guy, who has exactly two cards.

I think for no more than 7 seconds and my AQ is in the muck, and MP1 calls the bet. The turn comes a 2, UTG bets, MP1 calls, river is a 4, UTG thinks because 4 to a straight out there, but no normal human being has a 3 here, so he bets, and MP1 folds, mumbling something about his pocket pairs never holding up.

I am instantly furious he raised on the flop, and that feeling gets repeated when UTG showed his obvious hand of AJ.

The feeling of rage leaves my body when I cash out and put my new found money in cloth bags with dollar signs on them to take home.

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

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I think there's a reasonable chance that will are still ahead here just because I believe a LAG would cap AK/AA/KK preflop, but I don't like the fact that we have to pay 2 bets. I wouldn't begrudge a fold too much, but I think I call here just so we can see if MP caps. If he does, I think we can lay it down on the turn. If he doesn't, I'm thinking about raising the turn bet by UTG(non J or T) as one of my final bets into the pot but probably just getting to showdown immediately.

This spot is difficult for me and may be considered spew.

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GFG

Re: I Play Weak-Tight
 

results so typical of a game like that, still don't know if i could ever call-down in this spot.