25/50 vs crablar
 

no real history between us, I have some idea how he plays from his posts but that's all

PokerStars Game #10980373316: Hold'em No Limit ($25/$50) - 2007/07/17 - 00:01:47 (ET)
Table 'Achilles IV' 9-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: $tinger 88 ($7341 in chips)
Seat 2: n_tzzvicodin ($725 in chips)
Seat 3: Hold_emNL ($5007 in chips)
Seat 4: sweetluvin7 ($7791 in chips)
Seat 5: Any2Cards ($1000 in chips)
Seat 7: BONCELA ($1791 in chips)
Seat 8: poopers ($15802 in chips)
Seat 9: CrAbLaR ($14292 in chips)
sweetluvin7: posts small blind $25
Any2Cards: posts big blind $50
sarkaar: sits out
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to $tinger 88 [Ac Qs]
BONCELA: folds
poopers: folds
CrAbLaR: raises $100 to $150
$tinger 88: calls $150
n_tzzvicodin: folds
n_tzzvicodin leaves the table
Hold_emNL: folds
sweetluvin7: folds
Any2Cards: folds
*** FLOP *** [Qd 3s Ad]
CrAbLaR: bets $300
$tinger 88: raises $600 to $900
CrAbLaR: calls $600
*** TURN *** [Qd 3s Ad] [4d]
CrAbLaR: checks
$tinger 88: bets $1650
CrAbLaR: calls $1650
*** RIVER *** [Qd 3s Ad 4d] [Jh]
CrAbLaR: bets $2250

about 4700 effective left on river

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

I dislike the turnbet...as for river, that [censored] is strange, I'd just fold this. I think he's too good to do an ACTUAL blocking bet here against someone he knows is very good/thinking but which he has little history with (which would be a perfect opponent to make this induce against), it's way more likely to be an induce imo.

In the heat of the moment, though, given the betsize, I think even I would often end up calling out of confusion, but I really think that ends up badly more often than not (as in often enough to make it -ev.)

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

really? man w stinger's image i would be so tempted to jam for value.

if he slowplays a flush i would think he always checks it on the river. looks like AJ

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

Honestly, if it is a fake non-flush blockingbet (i.e that is one that is going to call) I'd assume it's likely something like AA/QQ/33 and AxJd (I doubt he raises AxTd and/or gets passed turn with that even), and against that range, raising for value is still not good. I guess AxKd would be possible to, but I find that one to be less likely to fire river given the chance of stinger having A3, which the other hands do well against.

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

I think Crablar is making a questionable blocking type bet just often enough with something like AQ, AJ, or AxKd for you to call. I don't really like a raise at all for whatever reason, I think he could easily have a small flush and will call with it (he's very aggro but does sometimes get tricky with big hands) and he's not bad enough to call that often with the weaker 2 pair hands.

I like your turn bet, he'll definitely be calling with pair/flush draw a pretty high percentage of the time.

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

I shove

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

i'd just calll out of utter confusion

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

i really don't see much value in raising, your line looks pretty strong and i think you'll only get looked up by a better hand here. i'm leaning towards just a call here, although you could make an argument for folding

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

[ QUOTE ]
I shove

[/ QUOTE ]

u is nasty

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

I call, don't see much value in shoving without history.
it might be a blockingbet, but he also might be inducing a shove. I dont think there are many worse hands he bet-calls here with.

i wouldnt fold here because we are getting good odds and I can really see him having a hand like AJ here. seems strange for him to check-call a flush on the turn and then donk the river.

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

Looks like a pretty standard call here. I think we are ahead pretty often but I dont think he calls a shove if he is behind, pretty much ever. Then again I havent played vs u that much or him so if you guys have crazy history then go for it

-Mike

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

I'd just press one of my call buttons.

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

[ QUOTE ]
really? man w stinger's image i would be so tempted to jam for value.

if he slowplays a flush i would think he always checks it on the river. looks like AJ

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree, this is AJ/AQ a lot.

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

[ QUOTE ]
I'd just press one of my call buttons.

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

instashove. its crablar [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img].

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

[ QUOTE ]
I dislike the turnbet...as for river, that [censored] is strange, I'd just fold this. I think he's too good to do an ACTUAL blocking bet here against someone he knows is very good/thinking but which he has little history with (which would be a perfect opponent to make this induce against), it's way more likely to be an induce imo.

In the heat of the moment, though, given the betsize, I think even I would often end up calling out of confusion, but I really think that ends up badly more often than not (as in often enough to make it -ev.)

[/ QUOTE ]

LOL this is maybe the worst advice ive ever seen.......

Raise more on flop, bet turn, just call the river.

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I dislike the turnbet...as for river, that [censored] is strange, I'd just fold this. I think he's too good to do an ACTUAL blocking bet here against someone he knows is very good/thinking but which he has little history with (which would be a perfect opponent to make this induce against), it's way more likely to be an induce imo.

In the heat of the moment, though, given the betsize, I think even I would often end up calling out of confusion, but I really think that ends up badly more often than not (as in often enough to make it -ev.)

[/ QUOTE ]

LOL this is maybe the worst advice ive ever seen.......

Raise more on flop, bet turn, just call the river.

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

[ QUOTE ]
I shove

[/ QUOTE ]

what are u trying to achieve by shoving? do u think AK is going to call you? i think the only thing that will call is a better hand.. is this not basic stuff??? possibly the only hand that will call a shove is AJ... thats 1 hand out of many possibles that u beat v.s many u lose to... i dont like folding but u have to call this bet imo.

Not sure if u were kidding around here cts or u know something about this player but would be interested if u would explain why u would shove here

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

Funny to see what kind of giant retards EM2 and True are.

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

would be very torn between call and shove.. i'd hate to shove and get instacalled by a set

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

aren't you missing out on value from other aces and two pair hands?

given that they play a little more laggy, isnt a turn bet here standard?


[ QUOTE ]
Funny to see what kind of giant retards EM2 and True are.

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

this ia pretty sick given the right game conditions...
absolutely sick.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I shove

[/ QUOTE ]

u is nasty

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

he slow played flush IMO

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

this is AJ a lot.

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

I don't think this is a flush, isn't the point of the c/c with a flush on turn move is so that u shove river to rep a missed nut draw? the small bet doesn't make sense.

that said if u can rule out a flush i think this is a shove

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

I feel like we should go all in and this looks like AJ/AQ exactly.

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

i would be amazed if he showed up with AJ here. I think it's very unlikely he'd play it like this.

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

but AJ seems like the most likely hand... but then again I'm transparant.

[ QUOTE ]
i would be amazed if he showed up with AJ here. I think it's very unlikely he'd play it like this.

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

but no it doesnt seem like his most likely hand. it seems, at least to me, like a very UNlikely hand.

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

AxJd is by FAR his most likely hand here

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

[ QUOTE ]
AxJd is by FAR his most likely hand here

[/ QUOTE ]

i think so too, but i don't think it's enough to warrant a shove; but that has to much to do with balancing , etc, tbh, if you shove as a bluff here often, and he also knows this, then i think it warrants a shove; without having a rep exactly like that, i don't think shoving is worth it...

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

first thoughts were Aj with qq coming in a distant second. i think em2000 gave the best line, but cts' answer has me curious as to what better ( or of equal value ) hands might we get to fold here by shoving. any takers!?

edit: bleh, not many given stingers stack so id assume it would be purely for value, but what if effective stacks were 14k?

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

its for value obv

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

what do you guys think crablar thinks stingers raising range is on this flop? AQ A3 33 FD's and air?? That said wouldn't AxJd be at the bottom of his range after he calls this turn bet??? I agree that it is a very likely holding but theres a lot of stuff he could have slow played and then made this small valueish bluff inducer type bet with like sets or flushes.

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

Since there is no real history between the two of you here I really like just calling this river. I just think that it isn't going to be too often you will get looked up by a worse hand here. I do thinnk your hand is good though and I think axjd is easily his most likely holding.

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

[ QUOTE ]
I'd just press one of my call buttons.

[/ QUOTE ]

haha

someone should mod your table so you have 2call buttons

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

[ QUOTE ]
AxJd is by FAR his most likely hand here

[/ QUOTE ]

there's also two combos of JxJ[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

should I post results yet?

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

yes!

Re: 25/50 vs crablar
 

lemme guess, you shoved and he called w/ 76dd? just a guess...