2 very thin value river raise possibilities
 

First one:

Is there ANY value in raising?

Villain is 25/23/2.5 with river AF of 1.00 but only after 60 hands

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 5 Players - (LegoPoker HH Converter)

SB: $50.25
Hero (BB): $160.80
UTG: $50.00
CO: $117.85
BTN: $94.95

Preflop: Hero is dealt 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (5 Players)
3 folds, <font color="red">SB raises to $1.50</font>, Hero calls $1.00

Flop: ($3) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">SB bets $2.50</font>, Hero calls $2.50

Turn: ($8) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players)
SB checks, Hero checks

River: ($8) 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">SB bets $5.00</font>, Hero ??



----------------------------

2nd hand:

Again, is there any value in raising?

No stats on villain:

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 6 Players - (LegoPoker HH Converter)

SB: $106.25
BB: $55.20
UTG: $11.90
Hero (MP): $67.25
CO: $55.55
BTN: $33.30

Preflop: Hero is dealt J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (6 Players)
UTG folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $1.75</font>, 3 folds, BB calls $1.25

Flop: ($3.75) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
BB checks, <font color="red">Hero bets $2.00</font>, BB calls $2.00

Turn: ($7.75) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
BB checks, Hero checks

River: ($7.75) J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">BB bets $7.00</font>, Hero ??

Re: 2 very thin value river raise possibilities
 

hand 1
bet the turn , you have an overpr , double gutter and position , i think your taking it down right there most of the time

as played , i wouldnt raise , i probably fold here

hand 2
really no value, and this is pretty close call/fold again ...so RR here is pretty bad

Re: 2 very thin value river raise possibilities
 

[ QUOTE ]
hand 1
bet the turn , you have an overpr , double gutter and position , i think your taking it down right there most of the time

as played , i wouldnt raise , i probably fold here

hand 2
really no value, and this is pretty close call/fold again ...so RR here is pretty bad

[/ QUOTE ]

meh, I think betting the turn in hand 1 is bad because it has great showdown value. There's only 1 card to come and if he has air, I'm not getting any monies from him by betting. Because I also have straight possibilities, why would I want to take it down right then and there?

Re: 2 very thin value river raise possibilities
 

Both hands really suck but i think they are actually pretty easy folds against an unknown, reads make these decisions a lot easier. I dont see any value in raising, you will only get called by better hands.

Re: 2 very thin value river raise possibilities
 

hand 1 3bet pf this changes everything. As played if villian is any good i dunno if we are gettin any value on river by raising given that alot of draws hit plus we played the hand like a draw, Sooo id just call the river. EDI: also given how alot of draws do hit here on river its probably also closer to a fold

hand 2 tbh not sure what is best. hands like this tho you dont get called to often raisin river when the board is soo cordinated. If i raise the river here its probably like a minraise.

Re: 2 very thin value river raise possibilities
 

I reraise pf in the first hand. I call riv, but its close.

2nd hand, wtf @ your flop bet, make a real cbet of 3. River is an easy fold, a donk for a psb is pretty much always a 10 here

Re: 2 very thin value river raise possibilities
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
hand 1
bet the turn , you have an overpr , double gutter and position , i think your taking it down right there most of the time

as played , i wouldnt raise , i probably fold here

hand 2
really no value, and this is pretty close call/fold again ...so RR here is pretty bad

[/ QUOTE ]

meh, I think betting the turn in hand 1 is bad because it has great showdown value. There's only 1 card to come and if he has air, I'm not getting any monies from him by betting. Because I also have straight possibilities, why would I want to take it down right then and there?

[/ QUOTE ]

Bet the turn for value. If you needed to make the straight to win the hand then checking would be fine. As it is, you want to get money in there while you are ahead, which you most likely are in that spot quite often. Also, no value in raising either of these rivers.

Re: 2 very thin value river raise possibilities
 

Shox you are on the money today [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img], I've looked at a few posts and agreed 100% with your replies to them, but I don't wanna just repeat what you're saying so I move on lol.

Re: 2 very thin value river raise possibilities
 

Hand1: Its a very thin call, let alone raise. Meh, I suppose you have a chance to fold out a five, but nothing you beat calls you here.

Hand2: I make a crying call.

In both hands, raising would never even cross my mind.

Re: 2 very thin value river raise possibilities
 

Raising these isn't for value, it basically turns your hand into a bluff, unless you are playing against a HUGE donk. I would probably call both but expect to be losing a decent % of the time. I would also 3bet both of them pf, though calling w/ 99 is OK. And I would play the first 99 hand faster on the flop/turn.

Re: 2 very thin value river raise possibilities
 

[ QUOTE ]
I reraise pf in the first hand. I call riv, but its close.

2nd hand, wtf @ your flop bet, make a real cbet of 3. River is an easy fold, a donk for a psb is pretty much always a 10 here

[/ QUOTE ]

Im gonna have to disagree with the second hand comments. I think betting under the pot will give you the same info as betting the pot. Generally I always bet more closer to the pot if I feel my hand is vulnerable to draws, and closer to 1/2 pot if my hand is less vulnerable. Theres no reason to always bet the pot, betting slightly under the pot still achieves the same result.

Re: 2 very thin value river raise possibilities
 

i´m calling both of them, there def is no value in raising though.
and i am def betting the turn in hand one. you said there is no value in it but there is. you charge a fourflush for drawing, worse 1 pair hands will call you and you make the pot bigger so you might even get paid off when you flush hits. If villain had a hand like 89 you are missing value on the river but against the majority of his hands a raise is the best way to light money.

Re: 2 very thin value river raise possibilities
 

Hand 1:
Sometimes I bet the turn here -depends on how likely he will fold. This is for protection vs overcard broadway and to charge fdraw/str8 draws. Also this allows us to check behind in position.

Vs. Better aggro players and as an earlier poster mentioned our hand has showdown value so a check on the turn is fine too. River I call but expect to be beaten alot -I'm certainly not re-opening the betting on 4 to a str8 flush river with top set -what hands would call that u beat if u were in their situation facing a raise with a lower set/2pair ?

Hand 2: I bet 3 too and agree with others that say this but I almost always bet 3. Firstly my hand value doesn't affect my cbet size - only flop texture and ability to get AI by the river.

On the river I call - the flush got there but we beat QJ and other hands -after all we did PFR+cbet then check turn so they may put us on nothing.

Re: 2 very thin value river raise possibilities
 

[ QUOTE ]
Both hands really suck but i think they are actually pretty easy folds against an unknown.

[/ QUOTE ]
are you serious?

[ QUOTE ]
2nd hand, wtf @ your flop bet, make a real cbet of 3.

[/ QUOTE ]

hardly an issue. sizing is a bit on the small size, but definetly not terrible.


Oh, and i think both hands are calls.