2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

Villain is around 40/20 but plays well postflop. He does cold call almost any SC in or oop. He hasn't played back at me much or shown down big moves, but who knows? I imagine he sees me as solid/aggro.

Like/dislike?

No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $2/$4
5 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $950.20
Hero: $530.45
Button: $416.10
SB: $409.40
BB: $183.80

Pre-flop: (5 players) Hero is CO with 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
UTG folds, <font color="#cc0000">Hero raises to $14</font>, Button folds, SB calls, BB calls.

Flop: 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($42, 3 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero checks.

Turn: 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($42, 3 players)
<font color="#cc0000">SB bets $25</font>, BB folds, Hero calls.

River: K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($92, 2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">SB bets $60</font>, <font color="#cc0000">Hero raises to $188</font>, <font color="#cc0000">SB raises all-in $370.4</font>, Hero folds.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

std

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

He doesn't play K7 like this?


edit: I guess you have a good postflop read..

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

Raise the turn. As played on turn I like river fold.

Edit : especially as you are repping jack-sh*t with a turn raise.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

I snap call. You're hand looks really bizarre to your opponent. And even if he does play good post flop, I'm sure a 40/20 is capable of some weird overaggressive plays.

Edit: I also like a turn raise.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

Whats the point of raising the river if you are going to fold a set to a a reraise?

So you are assuming he flopped a set/straight and checked it?

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

I hate it!
Why don`t you cbet? Raise turn, he could be drawing.
I assume you didn`t raise to catch a bluff on the river, right? If yes, plz don`t raise, if you`re planning to fold.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

He's not valuetowning worse, and I doubt he's giving you such amazing pot odds on a stone bluff.

Good fold.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

[ QUOTE ]
He does cold call almost any SC in or oop.

[/ QUOTE ]

This flop hit a lot of SCs with 2-pair or pair + OESD type hands.

Therefore, raise the turn and call a push.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

[ QUOTE ]
This flop hit a lot of SCs with 2-pair or pair + OESD type hands.

Therefore, raise the turn and call a push.

[/ QUOTE ]

Agreed. Plus a turn raise looks like you're FOS and he will probably pay you with 2pair.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

raise turn! as played call river, he has 2pair alot and puts u on AK [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

I can't fold this given your line. He is clearly beating a pair of kings but that is all we can reasonably conclude from his river shove. I would much rather raise the turn.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

i like just calling river bet here. if your folding to a reraise just a call. he wouldnt make this move with AK\KQ would he?

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

[ QUOTE ]
raise turn! as played call river, he has 2pair alot and puts u on AK [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

Why would he put you on AK? You are calling a turn bet w/ A-high on a board that is squarely in villains range?

More appropriately, b/c you checked the flop and just called the turn, he CLEARLY does not put you on a set. Either way, against a 40-20 i'd be thrilled to call this guy's push w/ bottom set.

I still don't understand what you are expecting him to call with when you raise the river. If you think he's going to fold busted draws and raise made straights and higher sets (ONLY), then why raise to begin with?

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

considering ur getting sick odds and ur hand is waaaaaay underrepresented (i dont think he could ever put u on two pair/set/any straight thats not the nuts) i think i would call. ur raise is representing one legit hand: T9. i dont even know if i would be surprised if hes bluffing here, lol.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

All - hardly anyone is 3betting this river without a straight, set and sometimes air. We have to figure out if the air % is enough to call now, since all the hands he is value-towning are beating us.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

[ QUOTE ]
All - hardly anyone is 3betting this river without a straight, set and sometimes air. We have to figure out if the air % is enough to call now, since all the hands he is value-towning are beating us.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah correct I think. Also I think he is almost never betting 25 into 40 with 2 ppl on the turn and 60 into 92 on the river as a bluff.

I think the turn is the debatable street.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

I don't see any debate on it atm. What were your reasons for not raising turn?

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

[ QUOTE ]
I don't see any debate on it atm. What were your reasons for not raising turn?

[/ QUOTE ]

ya this is by far the most debatable street.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I don't see any debate on it atm. What were your reasons for not raising turn?

[/ QUOTE ]

ya this is by far the most debatable street.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't really see too much of a case for not raising tbh.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

yea, bad wording, most WTF WERE YOU DOING street.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

jack it up on the turn yo

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

you have to raise the turn

end thread

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

River raise is really thin imo. He won't have a hand you beat that he'll call the raise with often enough compared to the times he'll 3-bet you with a set/straight/air.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

Yeah ok raise turn lol.

I was planning on reducing my reverse implied odds but the stacks are kinda wrong for that I think now.

Plan for the turn if we are 180BB deep?

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

[ QUOTE ]
you have to raise the turn

end thread

[/ QUOTE ]

put in a little more effort. ya raising turn is way better, but if you dont whatever. i dont think you can fold to the 3b here just because you add so many unknown variables when you take a line as weird as this. i might be stupid, but i have no idea how you can estimate his bluffing frequency given your line and his - and because of that, i wouldnt fold.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

I wouldn't fold this river - our hand looks bizarre to our opponent, and we are not convincingly representing anything stronger than AK, so he could well be 3betting us with any 2pr that value-bet the river, or even be straight bluffing knowing we will often be unable to call. I mean, if we're folding bottom set (which is the strongest hand we can possibly hold that's not T9) what are we calling with? If I were in his shoes I would strongly consider a bluff given hero's line.

That said I think just calling the river is fine if you don't think you can call a shove.

Surf

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

[ QUOTE ]
River raise is really thin imo. He won't have a hand you beat that he'll call the raise with often enough compared to the times he'll 3-bet you with a set/straight/air.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think our line is so weird that we get looked up super light on the river. I think folding the river is correct but after taking such a strange line, I don't think I could possibly talk myself into a fold, especially since if villian is smart he can be doing this with air.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

I hate the river fold. I think there's a good chance he's rebluffing or is just shoving two pair or w/e out of frustration.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

yo if you dont raise turn, dont fold river

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

[ QUOTE ]
I hate the river fold. I think there's a good chance he's rebluffing or is just shoving two pair or w/e out of frustration.

[/ QUOTE ]

agreed. aren't tehre more two pair combos than str combos?

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

hated it at first but now i like it. this isn't 2 pair and it's not a bluff

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

I STRONGLY disagree with some of the posts in this thread. Its you guys who are saying we shouldnt raise the river if we are folding to a shove. With a riverraise we get paid of by a lot of twopairhands and maybe even onepairhands since we have taken such a weird line. I believe too many people are saying this just because we have A SET but our hand isnt really that much stronger than AK in this spot as he wont valueshove twopairs very often. I think its a good fold.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

[ QUOTE ]
I STRONGLY disagree with some of the posts in this thread. Its you guys who are saying we shouldnt raise the river if we are folding to a shove. With a riverraise we get paid of by a lot of twopairhands and maybe even onepairhands since we have taken such a weird line. I believe too many people are saying this just because we have A SET but our hand isnt really that much stronger than AK in this spot as he wont valueshove twopairs very often. I think its a good fold.

[/ QUOTE ]
agree, also I'd raise closer to 160 on the river so folding is more comfortable, but yes I think this fold is standard.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

I'd raise the turn always here, maybe if he potted the turn I might just call, but given his turn bet sizing I'd say a straight or higher set is unlikely, but I guess so is two pair. Shrug ..

As played your raise/fold looks ok, but I call here a lot anyways given the odds we're getting and it's impossible for villain to put us on a hand as strong as a set. That might not be relevant here but it definitely is against some players who wouldn't be afraid to stick it in with air on the river. I make a lot of crying calls in general so take it fwiw, but I think both calling and folding are both fine.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

People saying u shouldnt re-raise river if ur folding to a 3bet shove...thats really bad advise

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

Why don't we cbet this? its a drway board and we hold a set.

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

i think you gotta call this after you underrep your hand that much

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

Just put him on AA and stop torturing yourself

Re: 2/4, I plan on folding a set and follow through
 

Flop check is just fine. Lots of combo draws that you AREN't ahead of will call flop.

Turn, I don't see how this is not a turn raise. He bets $25 into $42 and you want to get value into this hand so do it now.

What I don't get is if you guys reraise turn, do you guys bet/fold river? It seems kind of weak if we do.