Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

From this thread:

I have traveled in the music scene as a musician and recording engineer for better than 25 years. I have worked on a couple thousand records, some of them with famous rockstars, though most of them you're probably never heard of. I know a lot about making records, recording technology, touring, being in a rock band and the like. I own Electrical Audio, a 2-studio recording complex in Chicago, Illinois, where I make records every day.

I will answer any questions related to being in a touring/recording rock band, working in the studio with musicians both great and famous, making records, brushes with actual rock star celebrities, etc.

In NLHE, I am a prolific donator. I can hold my own in 7stud.

Any questions?

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

You are Steve Albini? That is awesome. Of all the people you've worked with what bands do you feel have the best musicianship.

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Do you honestly feel like Cobain was a genuis? Or just a hard worker guy who hit the lotto?

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

Pattdown, the Jesus Lizard was easily the best group of musicians I've ever worked with in terms of aggregate talent and ability, but I've worked with a bunch of incredible musicians on individual instruments. I have been most impressed by great drummers and great singers, because drumming and singing are the two most difficult things to do well.

Drummers:
Jim White (Dirty Three, Nina Nastasia)
Rey Washam (Scratch Acid, Big Boys, Rapeman, Ministry)
Britt Walford (Slint, Breeders)
Martin Atkins (Public Image Ltd, Ministry, Pigface)
Glenn Kotche (Wilco, Edith Frost)
Bun E. Carlos (Cheap Trick)
Dave Grohl (Nirvana)

Singers:
Nina Nastasia
Robin Zander (Cheap Trick)
Kim Deal (Pixies, Breeders)

Most recently, I had my mind blown by Joanna Newsom's playing on the harp. She is a wonder on that thing.

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

Which album of her's did you record? She is so great!

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

Micro? Albini? from Big Black? every indie rock band's dream producer?

Any other avid card players among your contemporaries? Regular card games in Frank Black's or PJ Harvey's basement or somesuch that I'm missing out on?

Also, thanks for the sheer awesomeness of:
Surfer Rosa
In Utero
Goat
Transaction de Novo
Arise Therefore
I'm sure there's like 50 more in my meager collection that I'm not thinking of.

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

My ladyfriend tells me that your original mix of In Utero was not green lighted by their label, and they went with a different mix/track list. She claims that your version is floating somewhere (she says a coworker has it on his iPod) and she's wondering how she could get a hold of it?

EDIT: She also would like to know the rate you charge to record at your studio? Whether you or someone else is the engineer.

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

this thread is very close to delivering. please answer the others questions and continue providing additional intriguing information.

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

Genius is a weird and inappropriate word, and hard work is underrated, but Kurt Cobain had a distinct and personal take on the world, and generally, when someone strikes a chord with his audience, that's what people respond to.

There were a lot of bands the "sounded like Nirvana" at the time Nirvana made it big, but none of them have had the same long-lasting influence. I have to admit that I wasn't particularly a fan of Nirvana when I was asked to work on In Utero, but during the course of making the record I came to appreciate that they were genuine about their band and their music, that Kurt was capable of sophisticated thinking, and that they and their music were unique.

If you think of the other bajillion-sellers of the Nineties, not very many of them have survived as significant influences today. I think there's a reason beyond luck for that to be the case.

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

Who were the worst musicians? Any guys that could barely play their instruments?

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Genius is a weird and inappropriate word, and hard work is underrated, but Kurt Cobain had a distinct and personal take on the world, and generally, when someone strikes a chord with his audience, that's what people respond to.

There were a lot of bands the "sounded like Nirvana" at the time Nirvana made it big, but none of them have had the same long-lasting influence. I have to admit that I wasn't particularly a fan of Nirvana when I was asked to work on In Utero, but during the course of making the record I came to appreciate that they were genuine about their band and their music, that Kurt was capable of sophisticated thinking, and that they and their music were unique.

If you think of the other bajillion-sellers of the Nineties, not very many of them have survived as significant influences today. I think there's a reason beyond luck for that to be the case.

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Thanks for the response. I hope it didn't come off like I was knocking him for "just being hard working". I have read a few Biography's on Nirvana (with you included) and I find him to be fascinating.
Just wondered what you thought having actually met the man.

Thanks again.

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] in utero, one of my favorite albums, and there are VERY few that compare, in my opinion.

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Any other avid card players among your contemporaries?

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There's a regular game here in Chicago that has several musicians and engineers in it. Guys who have worked with Sonic Youth, Pavement, Tortoise, Wilco, Smashing Pumpkins, and members of various rock bands. I once had to pay-off a straight flush held by the bass player of High on Fire (a Five-card draw hand no less), and I played a bit with Ed Cherny (a first-call engineer for hit records) but that's about it. The card player and music worlds don't overlap that much.

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

A friend of mine has been slowly releasing some tracks he made with McNeilly from their Atlanta days together around the mid 80s, if you are interested in hearing something you might not have come across before let me know.

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

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My ladyfriend tells me that your original mix of In Utero was not green lighted by their label, and they went with a different mix/track list. She claims that your version is floating somewhere (she says a coworker has it on his iPod) and she's wondering how she could get a hold of it?

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There were only a couple of different mixes used on the final album. Ultimately, the band made the decision about what versions they would use, though they had to suffer a combination of their own insecurity and a bunch of people at their label freaking out, which probably influenced their decision. The version of the album in the stores is the version the band wanted people to hear, and I respect that. Any "alternate version" floating around out there is either totally bogus or a generations-removed copy of a cassette dub, and not worth your attention.

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EDIT: She also would like to know the rate you charge to record at your studio? Whether you or someone else is the engineer.

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Pricing is kinda complicated, depending on which studio is being used, which engineer, whether there is an assistant required, lodgings, etc. There is a session cost calculator on the rates page of the studio website. For location recording at an outside studio, I charge my normal daily rate, $650 a day. I don't charge a royalty on any record I work on, something that has caused some controversy within engineering circles.

I try to make myself as inexpensive as possible for the underground and independent bands that are my closest peers and regular clientele. For big label stuff that will require an open-ended schedule and a lot of bureaucratic nonsense to get paid, I get paid a lot more.

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satanic verses by milemarker was awesome.

i thought you'd done stuff with "your enemies friends" and "this moment in black history" but wikipedia doesn't have either of them listed.

question: if there was a mixer you could watch work who would it be?

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

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Who were the worst musicians? Any guys that could barely play their instruments?

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Well, very few people who can't play at all find themselves in the studio making a record. More common is a band whose expectations outstrip their abilities, even if only by a little bit. If the band's aesthetic allows their record to reflect their limitations, then it isn't much of a problem. Many great records have gaffes and clinker notes on them -- listen closely to Led Zeppelin or Crazy Horse records and you'll hear a bunch of clams. If a band wants an album with no imperfections on it, but is unable to play impeccably, then the meticulous process of piecing-together a record can be exhausting. I am grateful that the bands I work with usually don't have budgets at their disposal to make records like that, because it is torture.

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

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A friend of mine has been slowly releasing some tracks he made with McNeilly from their Atlanta days together around the mid 80s, if you are interested in hearing something you might not have come across before let me know.

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Is this 86 material? Phantom 309?

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

What is your biggest consideration when deciding which bands to work for? If you had one "do over" on either a single track or an album, which would it be and why?

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

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i thought you'd done stuff with "your enemies friends"

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nope

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and "this moment in black history"

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They did an album here last year. Cleveland represent.

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question: if there was a mixer you could watch work who would it be?

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Honestly, not too interested in mixing as distinct from recording. I have always been impressed by Al Schmitt's engineering, and some Motown sessions sound impeccable. I would have loved to watch Stevie Wonder play a whole album by himself.

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

wow, it's my first post

1. What is the best way to get into the recording industry?(If you were just starting out would you go to school, or just try to find an internship)

2. Do you find schools like full sail a waste of money?

3. How is your hearing?

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

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2. Do you find schools like full sail a waste of money?



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i went to ex'pression: center for new media

while the school was awsome and i leanred tons and got some experience, i dont work in the field. most of my classmates do however. if you have the money id go for it but its certainly not necessary.

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

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What is your biggest consideration when deciding which bands to work for?

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Honestly, I'm not too selective. If a band wants to work with me, and I think I can do a good job, I'll put them on the schedule. The only time I'm ever suspicious is when a manager or label person contacts me rather than the band. In those instances, the band may not have even expressed an interest in me, and the whole thing may be being cooked-up by somebody else. In those cases, I always suggest that the band contact me directly so I can have a conversation with them and gauge their interest. If the band are consistently kept at arms length, then that's a tell that the whole thing is not going to happen.

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If you had one "do over" on either a single track or an album, which would it be and why?

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Man, good question. There are only a few records I've worked on where I felt like I dropped the ball, and those records really bum me out, because I know that the band is only getting one shot at making their record, and they have to carry it around forever. Tomorrow, I will be making another record, but the one I did today, that band is stuck with it forever.

About 10 years ago, I did an album with an amazing German band called Wuhling, and despite working my ass off, I felt like it never sounded as good as the band were. Their previous album had been recorded by a friend of mine, and it was terrific. The record isn't bad, but the band were amazing, and they deserved an amazing record. I still wonder what I could have done differently.

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

10 songs which you've worked on for the Steve Albini best of? If 10 is too hard pick 5 or 3 or whatever.

Thanks, Cameron.

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

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1. What is the best way to get into the recording industry?(If you were just starting out would you go to school, or just try to find an internship)

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It's super cheap to buy recording equipment and start experimenting. It's super expensive to go to a recording trade school. I always recommend getting started as an amateur to see if you enjoy the process before you get into any more serious enterprise. Every town has bands that need demos recorded, so there are plenty of opportunities to experiment with no pressure and no expectations.

"Getting into the industry" is just about impossible. There are no jobs. I mean none, like zero none. Since the advent of cheap recording software, many traditional studio clients (ad agencies, film and tv productions, jingle writers and commercial music publishers) have been able to do most of their own recording in-house. Having lost much of their client base, the big institutional studios have cut their staff to the bare minimum to keep costs low, and most engineers have gone freelance. Studios that used to have dozens of in-house engineers now have only a couple.

Newer, smaller studios that cater to rock bands are usually owner-operated, sometimes by a partnership of a very few people, all of whom have some vested interest in the studio. If you are going to be a recording engineer for a living, you are either going to be freelance, or you are going to build a studio and work there.

There are audio-related jobs, in PA design and installation, touring and live sound, church, auditorium and architectural acoustics, acoustical testing and certification, broadcast engineering, etc, but there basically are no open-call staff positions for recording engineers any more.

If you are considering going into a recording program, I would strongly recommend going to a normal accredited university with a concentration in engineering, acoustics or music. Some schools offer a Tonmeister-equivalent recording program (UMass Lowell and University of Iowa used to, I don't know who does now). The for-profit trade schools (Full Sail, Recording Arts, SAE, etc) are operated as businesses where their clients are the students and the product they sell is a diploma. A degree from an accredited university carries more weight in the real world and can even get you involved in interesting graduate-level work.
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3. How is your hearing?

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Good enough, apparently.

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10 songs which you've worked on for the Steve Albini best of? If 10 is too hard pick 5 or 3 or whatever.

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Man. Another good question. Hard for me to name individual songs, so I'll mention a few whole albums I think came out well:

the Jesus Lizard, Goat
PJ Harvey Rid of Me
the Breeders Pod and Title TK
Nina Nastasia the Blackened Air
Silkworm Lifestyle or Italian Platinum
Palace/Will Oldham Viva Last Blues or Arise Therefore

The above is material that might be comprehensible to a general audience. I've made a bunch of records I like that are closer to pure noise (Whitehouse) abstract freak rock (Zeni Geva, Stinking Lizaveta, Neurosis), heavy metal (High on Fire, Zao), country music (Robbie Fulks, the Sadies), instrumental music (Shadowy Men on a Shadowy Planet, Man or Astro-Man, Don Caballero) and all sorts of other crap. All of it has its merits as music, and I'm lucky that I get to work on so much different stuff.

[edit]: I'll answer more tomorrow after my dentist appointment if there's still interest.

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

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Who were the worst musicians? Any guys that could barely play their instruments?

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Forgot to answer your actual question. Urge Overkill.

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

If asking two is rude then feel free to ignore this, but I figured I might as well try and push my luck.

Do you ever listen to albums or songs and just think "ugh, If I'd recorded this it could have sounded so much better, I'd have....."?

Any examples if so?

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

This is the greatest thread in 2+2 history, not close.

Hi Mr. Albini sir,

Do you think downloading is killing the music industry or is it something else? Is rock with guitars becoming like Jazz in the 70s? Do you think bands that are severely derivative, like most garage rock bands, are inferior to bands like Jesus Lizard who sound totally unique? Can you name drop some very new or recent young bands that are carrying the torch for rock and roll? Do you find your taste for heavy noisy stuff is diminishing as you get older (mine is!) and your appreciation for quiet folksy stuff is growing?

Sorry for the barrage but im about to get on a plane to vegas. Feel free to ignore...

Thanks!

--GA

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

there have been many a time i hear an album the band sounds so good, and then you see them live, and you're like, wtf is going on?

which band have you made the biggest improvement on their sound, in this manner?

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

I will state up front that you are a 'micro celebrity' to only those people that have only 'micro exposure' to music. I thank you for the work you have done in the industry.

My question revolves around Martin Atkins (Public Image Ltd, Ministry, Pigface). If you don't wish to answer in the open for whatever reason then that is understood. Is he really the pretentious prick that other bands and label managers make him out to be? I have only dealt with him on one issue ever and getting a straight answer out of him was a pain, but I have heard the rumors floating about. But, they were always from people that had a 'bone to pick' with him.

As for Martins talent, there are few that can match his stage intensity and overall raw ability. One of the best out there for sure. But the off-stage persona... willing to give your thoughts?

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Are there any bands in the Chicago area that you were just like 'wow, I need to try to get these guys...'? Also, do you work w/ any jam style bands and how do you do studio work w/ those bands?

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

A few months back you did an interview w/ a friend of mine for a Scratch Acid Doc he's working on and pretty much anyone who's ever heard them will agree that Scratch Acid is/was a 'criminally underrated' band, Are there any other bands that you've worked with that you feel deserve to be heard that we may have overlooked?

P.S. I've pointed anyone who would listen to your
'The problem with Music' article, especially my friends who are musicians, thanks for the info.

and

what do you think of the iPhone?

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

awesome thread

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

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P.S. I've pointed anyone who would listen to your
'The problem with Music' article, especially my friends who are musicians, thanks for the info.


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Funny.. I always point my musician friends to Big Black's final tour diary, "Turkey Trot to the Sound of Tuna" or something like that. Awesome writing.

Found it: http://www.petdance.com/actionpark/bigblack/tourdiary/

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

do you hate hippies and hippy music as much as everyone else?

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A friend of mine has been slowly releasing some tracks he made with McNeilly from their Atlanta days together around the mid 80s, if you are interested in hearing something you might not have come across before let me know.

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Is this 86 material? Phantom 309?

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I'll have to find the press packet he sent me, it's floating around somewhere. My recollection of what he is doing is somewhat fuzzy, but to my knowledge the collection he is publishing is from a combination of warehouse shows so I think the tracks are rather obscure and mostly unknown. The disc he sent me is from the "Destroy All Music Festival 2" at the Pillow Tex Wharehouse.

BTW, 24 Hour Revenge Therapy has not left my turn table since 95 and Seamonsters has never left my thoughts. It's amazing how much of my collection you were involved in.

Re: Ask a music scene micro celebrity
 

Vinyl or Digital?

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lol.... does everybody here actually believe this is really steve albini, or am i just getting massively leveled?

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lol.... does everybody here actually believe this is really steve albini, or am i just getting massively leveled?

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why cant it be him?