National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

Hey EDGD,

I'm gonna have some free time this summer between taking the bar exam and starting my first job as a lawyer. I'm strongly considering using a couple of those weeks in August to do some hardcore camping out West. I think as of now I'd like to pick two national parks and spend one week at each of them, but I am an eastcoaster and have no idea about which ones to go to. The names that immediately spring to mind are Yellowstone and Yosemite, but that's probably cause they are the most famous. The only criteria I have is that I have is I want to avoid the deserts or any places that will be regularly greater than 100 degrees. Other than that, I am open-minded. I'm going to be starting my trip in Colorado for a wedding and want to end the trip in Vegas, so that might eliminate places like northern Washington and Montana.

I have very little camping experience other than a trip I took before freshman year of college, but I am in very good shape and not afraid to get dirty.

In addition to which places to go, I've got a lot of logistical questions, many that are probably noobish:
- I'll be doing this by myself, so what precautions should I take to ensure I don't end up like that guy who had to saw his own arm off?
- Once you get to the parks, how much freedom do you have in picking your own route? Are certain areas off limits to camping?
- What kind of supplies should I be getting? I've got a really good pack and a 40 degree sleeping bag (warm enough), but thats about it. Is a tent necessary?

Thanks in advance.

Also, feel free to use this thread for more general discussion, posting pictures, etc.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

I highly recommend getting a jetboil stove. it's the most efficient thing I own. you will also need a compass, cooking/eating utensils, paper towels, a good lighter, and a million other little things I am forgetting.

as far as camping, there are two ways to camp in most national parks. you can apply for a backcountry permit, which means you can set up camp wherever you want within a designated (but very large) area. some parks have seasonal restrictions on fires for backcountry campers.

the other way to do it is reserve a campsite. a campsite consists of a fire ring, grill type thing, flat space for your tent, parking space and nearby bathrooms/dishwashing stations/etc. usually these campsites are a mix of ppl with RVs and tent campers.

there is usually a separate "hiker's camp" which is normally a lot further away from cars (no parking spots nearby) and cheaper.

car campsites will run you 15-25/night, hiker's camps are around 5 bucks. backcountry permits are sometimes free, sometimes 5-10 bucks. you can usually apply for a receive a backcountry permit the same day you want to camp. if you want to get a car campsite, for that time of year you will need to reserve far in advance. there will be a *lot* of other people camping. I am not kidding or exaggerating.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

Since you are already going to be in Colorado, I'd reccommend Rocky Mountain National Park. Your weddding is probably in Denver/Colorado Springs? So RMNP is only a 2 hour drive or so away.

I grew up near there so I may be biased, but I think it's pretty underrated as far as parks go. Regarding your other questions:

1) You won't have to saw your arm off. Leg, maybe. No, just get a good map of the park. Not a tourist, drive-by map, a detailed map. I assume you have a compass or GPS. I'm not sure if there is any type of cell recepition there. I would be suprised if there were. The only other thing I would tell you is to not get into a serious rock climbing there, because you're toast if something goes awry and you are alone.

2) There may be wildlife migrations that cause officials to prohibit some areas from camping. The ranger station will let you know about this. In fact, you may want to check with them before your trip as far as getting a permit. I don't know what those rules are nowdays.

3) Tent? Yes. The major road in the park, Trail Ridge Road usually opens on Memorial Day. Why so late? Because of all of the snow. Snowing in June is not uncommmon. Regardless of what mountian park you visit, don't underestimate how cold it can get at night at 12,000 feet.

Well I'm done with my pitch for Rocky Mountain National Park. Good luck wherever you go. It sounds like one of those trips you can look back on when you're 85 and brag to the grandkids about.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

Clarification: I'm looking to stay on foot and generally stay away from busy campsites. I probably want to avoid any heavy climbing for safety reasons.

Thanks for the great replies so far.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

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Since you are already going to be in Colorado, I'd reccommend Rocky Mountain National Park. Your weddding is probably in Denver/Colorado Springs? So RMNP is only a 2 hour drive or so away.

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Yeah, the wedding is in Colorado Springs. Sounds like a good candidate for my first stop

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

Man, I really think you are going to have a hard time finding a place that isn't real hot in that area, during that time frame.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

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Man, I really think you are going to have a hard time finding a place that isn't real hot in that area, during that time frame.

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I can deal with heat, I just want to avoid really really hot places like Death Valley. And I've already done the Australian outback, so I'd like to spend some time in non desert-like terrain.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

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Clarification: I'm looking to stay on foot and generally stay away from busy campsites.

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Trail Ridge Road gets some heavy tourist traffic sometimes, (it's still a 2 lane road), but RMNP is so huge, you won't have ANY trouble getting away from crowds. The vast majority of RMNP visitors are people who drive the road then stay at a hotel at Estes Park or Grand Lake.

P.S. If you ever saw "The Shinning" you need to visit the Stanley Hotel in Estes Park.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

Definitely recommend RMNP. Also, check with the rangers at the park about camping elsewhere in the area. I don't know about the back country permit turnipmonster was talking about, but back around 2000 a friend and I were going to camp there but balked at the ~$15 fee. We talked to a ranger and he told us that, if we found an established fire ring outside the park bounds, it was ok to camp there. We found one just outside the park borders, up this little dirt track that needed 4WD to get to. It was incredible. Double check with the rangers, but I've done it a couple times since and every time its been way better than paying for a tent space in a campsite with RVs and everything else.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

Man I could write a few pages on this. But with August you are somewhat limited. First of all get a National Parks Pass - although I think they call it something funky this year and they raised the price from $50 to $80. If you go to more than one park it pays for itself.

Sounds like Rocky Mt. Natl park would be a good place to start. IF you wind up coming SW be sure to check out Zion and Yosemite. Although Zion will be fairly hot and Yosemite will be crowded, but so will everywhere else that's not scorching in August. Best time to do the Zion Narrows river hike is August - it's awesome. To me one of the highlights of So. Utah is just taking the backroads all over the place, and as long as you have AC, you can do this anytime. Bryce Canyon is a lot cooler than Zion as it's at higher elevation, and definitely worth seeing.

Here's my trip report and pics from that area which you may find helpful:

http://www.synergizethis.com/FourCornersTrip.html

Also there's a link to some CA deserts stuff off that page.

And Yosemite is such a magical place, I can't imagine ever having a bad time there. If you do Yosemite - try hiking from Toulame Lake (sp) up to Cloud's Rest. But be sure to train first, the first couple miles are fairly brutal. But once you get to Cloud's rest and the day hikers have gone back, you'll have the place all to yourself. In August there's a good chance you can sleep out under the stars, which is a really magical experience. Then from there you can hike down towards the valley and do half-dome - if you have any legs left. Hiking to the top of Half-dome after Cloud's Rest is probably the most worn out I've ever been in my life. But I made it, and I'm a fat POS. So a lot of people should be able to.

Feel free to PM me if you have more questions.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

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I highly recommend getting a jetboil stove.

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I'm going with a group of 3 to Yosemite for 5 days in two weeks. Is it really worth the extra $$ for the JetBoil, or would a cheaper alternative suffice if none us are planning on doing any serious camping in the near future?

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

You can also rent camping gear.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

At REI you can get tons of good advice about both about how to choose the equipment that is right for you, as well as the actual things you should know to do while camping. Their advice page is here.

I've never shopped with them, but they are one of the best online resources for beginner information about camping. Have fun - the western parks are really beautiful.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

probably not. a jetboil is nice because it's super compact, light, and extremely efficient meaning you use much less gas than you would with another brand stove.

it's really not necessary unless you are backpacking, but it is the best camping stove I've ever used.

with a large group, especially if you are staying in one place you probably won't use a stove too much and cook over the campfire. it's much better to have a stove if you're by yourself and don't want to make a big fire just to cook dinner.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

suzzer, thank you for posting that trip report. Amazing photos.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

Ok, I've decided on Rocky Mountain National Park and Yellowstone. Now I just need to map out my route. I can probably spend 5-6 days at each. Any advice on which trails to go for would be great. Also, I'll have a car and am willing to spend a day or two driving around and hitting up the touristy spots.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

I have no camping tips but just want to say that camping [besides getting drunk in Vegas] is probably the best male bonding experience. When my friends and I went, we forgot to bring chopsticks and had to eat using random sticks. Come to think of it, this was probably the reason why I had that major stomachache. Nevertheless, camping trips that involve fishing, sitting around and playing Chinese Poker / 13 cards for 3 straight days are always awesome.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

just wanted to second Suzzer's endorsement of Utah's amazing National Parks.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

Those are some real great pictures. I am trying to learn to take better pictures. What kind of Camera/lens were you using? These are the sort of pics I am most interested in. Just nature, at it's best.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

All thos pics were taken with a Sony point-and-shoot (DSC-W1) which has now gone to camera heaven. I just bought a Nikon D80 - my first serious camera - that I'm taking to Ireland in a few days. I'm still getting used to carrying around a camera that won't fit in my pocket. But I knew that was going to be tough. Hopefully I won't leave it on a bus in Ireland, as I like to do with anything that's not attached to me when I'm travelling.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

Don't just limit yourself to National Parks. They are beautiful, but they tend to be crowded, and have pretty restrictive regulations. There are a lot of beautiful places on Forest Service and BLM land where you can pretty much do what you want as long as you don't set the forest on fire or excessively disturb the cows.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

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Don't just limit yourself to National Parks. They are beautiful, but they tend to be crowded, and have pretty restrictive regulations. There are a lot of beautiful places on Forest Service and BLM land where you can pretty much do what you want as long as you don't set the forest on fire or excessively disturb the cows.

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Yep, this is true. I think it varies from state to state but one of my favorite camping trips was in some forest in Washington where you can just pull over anywhere and trek into the woods and set up camp, have a fire, etc. It's nice to get away from all the RV's and developed campground scene.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

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P.S. If you ever saw "The Shinning", the mini series on tv, you need to visit the Stanley Hotel in Estes Park.

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how you say, "fyp"?

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

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just wanted to second Suzzer's endorsement of Utah's amazing National Parks.

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I love the southern Utah canyon and slickrock country, but summer is really not the best time to visit. It gets really hot (Bryce Canyon is an exception as it is at 8,000-9,000 feet above sea level). Also, July to mid-September is "monsoon season", which means the possibility of thunderstorms and flash floods. You do not want to get caught in a narrow canyon in a flash flood. It was always a sobering experience to be walking through a narrow canyon, look up and see a piece of driftwood wedged 20 feet above my head.

Spring (mid-April through may) and fall (October especially) are the best times to visit that area. Fall colors can be quite nice in late October, though days are getting short by then and snow is not impossible.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

Replace Yellowstone with Glacier NP. You can still enjoy Yellowstone from a car when you are old and fat.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

Yosemite is a little strange because of how crowded it can be. You get tickets through Ticketron for crissakes.

But if you're in Yellowstone, you might seriously want to include flyfishing on your agenda. Even if you get a guide, it's something you might really enjoy. Just tell the guide exactly what you want - easier fishing for someone with little experience (don't worry, you don't have to do all that crazy casting to catch trout), out-of-the-way place where you'll probably not see anyone else, more small fish, fewer big fish, etc. I've found nothing like flyfishing to get me in touch with nature and the workings of an ecosystem. Being *in* the water is much different than drifting in a boat.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

Pretty much all of the western states have lots of public land. Some of this is boring desert (not all desert is boring -- see Utah canyon country), prairie or sagebrush country, but there is a lot of beautiful mountain country. There are lots of wilderness areas (roadless, access by hiking/horses only), as well as areas accessible by back roads (often gravel). The public lands close to cities gets used pretty heavily, but there are many places you will see few other people. In general, the road-accessible public lands are not as pristine as the parks -- sheep and cattle grazing, logging, mining and oil and gas drilling are allowed, and the sheep and cattle are almost everywhere, including in some of the wildernesses, but much of this country is quite beautiful, nonetheless.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

[ QUOTE ]
Clarification: I'm looking to stay on foot and generally stay away from busy campsites. I probably want to avoid any heavy climbing for safety reasons.

Thanks for the great replies so far.

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If you really want to get away maybe you want to consider something other than National Parks. I see you've already decided on RMNP and Yosemite. I realize these are both fantastic places, but you might want to do a little more research. For the record I'm not saying that because they are not remote enough. You just might find something that interests you in a particular way. UT/AZ will have some more crazy scenery you won't see other places (Examples- note slideshow is mislabelled as Bryce and Zion), CO/WY will have a lot of the impressive sweeping mountainous landscapes.

Whatever you choose you won't go wrong.

Here are two of awesome hikes I did in the Rockies.
Wind Rivier Range, Wyoming
San Juan Mountains, CO

Torres Del Paine, Chile Yeah, this is out of the question, but it was awesome.

I wish I could take credit for that site. Something Dreamed, but it's my hiking buddy's.

I'm going to try and dig up a post I did a while ago about gearlists. Gearwhoring is fun and expensive. You could could probably get by with just a few things, but I wouldn't have 3 tents, 2 sleeping bags and 3 sleeping pads if camping gear wasn't so great.

Don't worry about being a novice in most of the areas that have been mentioned. You'll be on well marked trails with at least moderate (for hiking) traffic.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Clarification: I'm looking to stay on foot and generally stay away from busy campsites. I probably want to avoid any heavy climbing for safety reasons.

Thanks for the great replies so far.

[/ QUOTE ]
If you really want to get away maybe you want to consider something other than National Parks. I see you've already decided on RMNP and Yosemite. I realize these are both fantastic places, but you might want to do a little more research. For the record I'm not saying that because they are not remote enough. You just might find something that interests you in a particular way. UT/AZ will have some more crazy scenery you won't see other places (Examples- note slideshow is mislabelled as Bryce and Zion), CO/WY will have a lot of the impressive sweeping mountainous landscapes.

Whatever you choose you won't go wrong.

Here are two of awesome hikes I did in the Rockies.
Wind Rivier Range, Wyoming
San Juan Mountains, CO

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Wow, both of those slideshows are awesome. What kind of camera did you use for those pics? I would definitely consider doing either of those hikes. RMNP and Yellowstone aren't set in stone, but I picked them because they are more of a known quantity and easier to find information about. I've been so busy with weddings, studying for the bar exam, and trying to plan a trip to South Africa in September, that I'm worried about having enough time to map out my routes and such. How long were the San Juan and Wind River hikes that you did? I'd definitely be interested in finding out more info about them and seeing if I can fit them into schedule.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

As I mentioned I wish I could take credit for the site, and likewise I wish I could take credit for the pictures. Although I have some equally impressive ones from those areas with my point and shoot 6MP Fuji. It's hard to come out of there with bad photos. My friend uses a Digital SLR, I'm not sure which one. I can check with him tomorrow.

You can follow my exact footsteps in Wyoming at another friend's website. (Elevation profile lower right). We had a GPS with us that tracked it. Unfortunately the pictures attached to the journal entries were removed. You could click on each campsite and there'd be a picture of it. So that's another cool site to poke around.

Both hikes were easy doable for my new-to-hiking girlfriend, but not too simple. Right now I'm actually keeping her awake and she needs to get up fow work in 5 hours so I'm gonna check out. I'll try to write more about these two hikes tomorrow.

These are all Wyoming:

http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/8...ing0039jb7.jpg
http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/5...ing0085at1.jpg
http://img528.imageshack.us/img528/9...ing0171mb0.jpg

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

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What kind of camera did you use for those pics? I would definitely consider doing either of those hikes.

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FYI he used a Nikon D70. My pictures were taken with a Fuji something or other. It's just a point and shoot digital, but I've been very happy with it.
PM me if you want any details about how to get to these hikes.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

Did you pick your hikes yet? Did you go on any of them?

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

I actually liked California's parks the best, but Yellowstone is in a league completely to itself.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

i. am. so. jealous.

with fly rod or not? if not Yosemite is fine. we've gotten snowed on on the 4th of July, so bring a cold weather bag and good jacket. with fly rod i second Glacier. pan-fried trout for breakfast is the best. been to Bryce Canyon and Zion for day trips and feel the camping would be better elsewhere.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

My friends and I went camping last week at Yosemite. I still don't understand how people enjoy hiking uphills for miles and miles ...

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

When the hell did camping get so expensive? The last 2 campgrounds I stopped at were $20 and $22. This seems way out of line considering that you can get a cheap hotel room for around $40 in a lot of places.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

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My friends and I went camping last week at Yosemite. I still don't understand how people enjoy hiking uphills for miles and miles ...

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It feels good when you get to the top and look down. It also helps to be in a little bit of shape beforehand so you don't get destroyed.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

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When the hell did camping get so expensive? The last 2 campgrounds I stopped at were $20 and $22. This seems way out of line considering that you can get a cheap hotel room for around $40 in a lot of places.

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QFT I've been thinking this exact same thing every time I go camping. I've been to places that were $25/night and $20 to get in the park, making it more expensive than a cheap motel!!

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Anyway, it seems bizarro but of course the reason is the budgets for the parks have been slashed and they have to raise money any way they can. It's the same reason speeding tickets and such keep getting more and more expensive. The retarded voters keep voting to lower taxes but the government just has to get the same money some other way. IMHO the parks should all be free to enter, it's our shared natural treasure and you shouldn't have to pay to get in to see the Grand Canyon or whatever.
[/politics]

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

Don't backpack alone, it's just dumb.

Re: National Parks and Camping (advice for me + general discussion)
 

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Don't backpack alone, it's just dumb.

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I have to disagree (having done lots of backpacking alone). It does increase your risk some, as if you get hurt there's nobody to go for help, so don't get hurt. Backpacking with a partner does reduce your weight somewhat, as one of you can carry the tent, and the other the stove, pots and pans. If you know what your are doing at all, the drive to wherever you are backpacking is much riskier than the backpacking, even if you are alone.