Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrients
 

Story about dead baby and its vegan parents

I don't have a problem with parents raising their children with their beliefs. People have done it as long as there have been parents and kids. eg: Christians told their babies that there was a dude in the sky who has a list of bad things you can do and good things you can do. And if parents want to tell their kids that it's immoral to eat animal flesh, they have that right (although they should also allow the child to make up its own mind when it's capable of rational thought, just like religious parents should allow their children to contemplate agnosticism).

But the second that your neglect of proper proteins and dairy products that a baby needs to sustain its metabolic functions as it grows leads to malnutrition and in this case death, you've gone from being a principled parent to being a negligent killer. This is a pretty disgusting story. I wish people had to take tests to get a parenting license before they got knocked up, kind of like driving.

OK, not really, but you know what I mean. People suck at raising kids sometimes.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

aren't there many many many bigger problems in the world to worry about than parents raising their children vegan?

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

[ QUOTE ]
aren't there many many many bigger problems in the world to worry about than parents raising their children vegan?

[/ QUOTE ]

not when the baby dies?

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

True, but life in prison seems a pretty harsh for what essentially amounted to gross negligence and stupidity. Why'd the felony murder charge go through anyway?

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
aren't there many many many bigger problems in the world to worry about than parents raising their children vegan?

[/ QUOTE ]

not when the baby dies.

[/ QUOTE ]

Fixed your punctuation.

Seriously, fatgirl, what are you smoking? Who's worrying about parents raising their kids vegan? We're worrying about parents killing their children with starvation and malnutrition.

Furthermore, since when are we only allowed to post topics about "the biggest problems in the world?" Is every thread here supposed to be about war, AIDS, and global warming? Lighten up.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

my friend the jackal has been feeding his kid tuna fish, and then waiting for 2 hours to pass, when he forces him to vommit. he says that this a good way to get the nutrients while respecting the tuna fish's right to exist.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

[ QUOTE ]
True, but life in prison seems a pretty harsh for what essentially amounted to gross negligence and stupidity. Why'd the felony murder charge go through anyway?

[/ QUOTE ]

because they murdered a baby.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

Who the hell do you think you are to tell them how to raise their child? Raise your own kid like that. I see what a great job you're doing with your brutal kid who slaughters animals to eat. I bet he's not even on the honor roll.

And are you a doctor? I didn't think so. Who are you to say that kids need nutrition?

There's a neat House episode where some vegan baby gets all screwed up. It turns out that they didn't do anything wrong, and that the kid had another issue, but House had some good words for their stupidity.

You're a lot nicer than I am when it comes to criminal stupidity. The parents should be killed.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

[ QUOTE ]
my friend the jackal has been feeding his kid tuna fish, and then waiting for 2 hours to pass, when he forces him to vommit. he says that this a good way to get the nutrients while respecting the tuna fish's right to exist.

[/ QUOTE ]

I really hope you're joking.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
my friend the jackal has been feeding his kid tuna fish, and then waiting for 2 hours to pass, when he forces him to vommit. he says that this a good way to get the nutrients while respecting the tuna fish's right to exist.

[/ QUOTE ]

I really hope you're joking.

[/ QUOTE ]

ahhahah...seriously, how do people not get KKF after all this time?

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrients
 

If the facts are as represented in the news, I'd be in favor of the death penalty for these parents.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

Natural Selection 1 Vegans 0

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

It's just dumb to worry so much about a random baby dying if one doesn't care about millions of approximately as advanced beings (such as pigs) being systematically murdered all the time.

According to some article, it wasn't even very much about the parents being vegan, it was that they didn't feed the baby almost at all. Don't know the specifics though, maybe they were just idiots.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

[ QUOTE ]
It's just dumb to worry so much about a random baby dying if one doesn't care about millions of approximately as advanced beings (such as pigs) being systematically murdered all the time.

According to some article, it wasn't even very much about the parents being vegan, it was that they didn't feed the baby almost at all. Don't know the specifics though, maybe they were just idiots.

[/ QUOTE ]

pigs = babies?

c'mon now.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

Christ. There's nothing wrong with raising children without them eating meat, but these two are just retarted. There would have been no problem if the idiot mother had breast fed this kid, and then let him eat solid vegetable food after he was a 1-1.5 years old. But instead of breast milk (take that corporations!) they shovel soy milk and apple juice into the kid.

[censored] hippies. The baby weighed 3 pounds and they never took him to a pediatrician!

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

[ QUOTE ]

pigs = babies?


[/ QUOTE ]

So I heard. It's about the same kind of "difference" as people dying in school shootings/WTC versus people dying in random poor country due to starvation/war/something.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrients
 

The kid died of malnutrition period. From things I've read, fruits and vegitables contain all of the nutrients your body needs.

I eat meat, but I believe that a vegan diet is the most healthy way to live life. Some of the strongest animals on earth are vegiterians. Once you start cooking meat (or any food) you loose a lot of the nutrients, so I don't even look as cooked meat as being that healthy.

Cows milk... I try not to drink it. Why would I want to drink something that's genetically meant for a 400lb'ish baby animal with the brain the size of a walnut?

Those parents who killed their baby from starvation are just a couple of crack pots. You can easily raise a healthy baby as a vegan. I just can't believe they didn't feed the baby breast milk!

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

[ QUOTE ]
The kid died of malnutrition period. From things I've read, fruits and vegitables contain all of the nutrients your body needs.

I eat meat, but I believe that a vegan diet is the most healthy way to live life. Some of the strongest animals on earth are vegiterians. Once you start cooking meat (or any food) you loose a lot of the nutrients, so I don't even look as cooked meat as being that healthy.

Cows milk... I try not to drink it. Why would I want to drink something that's genetically meant for a 400lb'ish baby animal with the brain the size of a walnut?

Those parents who killed their baby from starvation are just a couple of crack pots. You can easily raise a healthy baby as a vegan. I just can't believe they didn't feed the baby breast milk!

[/ QUOTE ]

what are you reading that you honestly believe this? do you also follow the raw movement?

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrients
 

“Vegetarians and their Hezbollah splinter faction, the vegans, are a persistant irritant to any chef worth a damn. To me, life without veal, stock, pork fat, sausage, organ meat, demiglace, or even stinky cheese is not a life worth living.”

“Vegetarians are the enemy of everything good and decent in the human spirit, an affront to all I stand for, the pure enjoyment of food”

- Anthony Bourdain

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The kid died of malnutrition period. From things I've read, fruits and vegitables contain all of the nutrients your body needs.

I eat meat, but I believe that a vegan diet is the most healthy way to live life. Some of the strongest animals on earth are vegiterians. Once you start cooking meat (or any food) you loose a lot of the nutrients, so I don't even look as cooked meat as being that healthy.

Cows milk... I try not to drink it. Why would I want to drink something that's genetically meant for a 400lb'ish baby animal with the brain the size of a walnut?

Those parents who killed their baby from starvation are just a couple of crack pots. You can easily raise a healthy baby as a vegan. I just can't believe they didn't feed the baby breast milk!

[/ QUOTE ]

what are you reading that you honestly believe this? do you also follow the raw movement?

[/ QUOTE ]

I read lots of things, but some of the things I mentioned above are mentioned in Stanley Burroughs "The Master Cleanse."

Regarding raw food, I think raw food is much healthier than cooked food. This is why I like to juice fruits and vegtables.

However, I eat stuff cooked too.

I live life to enjoy it, not be healthy. However, some of the healthy things I do allow me to enjoy life a little more by feeling good.

I enjoy steak; I don't enjoy fasting but I do it becase it makes me feel better in the long run and allows me to enjoy life a little more.

I really enjoy shell fish, but I don't eat it because it's unhealthy for you. Same with pigs.

If I was 100% focused on health then yes, I would be part of the raw food movement.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

I'm actually fasting right now; I'm hoping it will clear up my psoriasis. After I'm done fasting, I'm going to try a vegatarian diet. Although I've never understood why people think raw food is any better than than cooked veggies. The nutritional content is going to be pretty much the same; nearly all of the nutrients in veggies are insensitive to heat.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The kid died of malnutrition period. From things I've read, fruits and vegitables contain all of the nutrients your body needs.

I eat meat, but I believe that a vegan diet is the most healthy way to live life. Some of the strongest animals on earth are vegiterians. Once you start cooking meat (or any food) you loose a lot of the nutrients, so I don't even look as cooked meat as being that healthy.

Cows milk... I try not to drink it. Why would I want to drink something that's genetically meant for a 400lb'ish baby animal with the brain the size of a walnut?

Those parents who killed their baby from starvation are just a couple of crack pots. You can easily raise a healthy baby as a vegan. I just can't believe they didn't feed the baby breast milk!

[/ QUOTE ]

what are you reading that you honestly believe this? do you also follow the raw movement?

[/ QUOTE ]

I read lots of things, but some of the things I mentioned above are mentioned in Stanley Burroughs "The Master Cleanse."

Regarding raw food, I think raw food is much healthier than cooked food. This is why I like to juice fruits and vegtables.

However, I eat stuff cooked too.

I live life to enjoy it, not be healthy. However, some of the healthy things I do allow me to enjoy life a little more by feeling good.

I enjoy steak; I don't enjoy fasting but I do it becase it makes me feel better in the long run and allows me to enjoy life a little more.

I really enjoy shell fish, but I don't eat it because it's unhealthy for you. Same with pigs.

If I was 100% focused on health then yes, I would be part of the raw food movement.

[/ QUOTE ]

what nutrients do you think are lost in cooking food?

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

Soy milk and apple juice, lmao.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The kid died of malnutrition period. From things I've read, fruits and vegitables contain all of the nutrients your body needs.

I eat meat, but I believe that a vegan diet is the most healthy way to live life. Some of the strongest animals on earth are vegiterians. Once you start cooking meat (or any food) you loose a lot of the nutrients, so I don't even look as cooked meat as being that healthy.

Cows milk... I try not to drink it. Why would I want to drink something that's genetically meant for a 400lb'ish baby animal with the brain the size of a walnut?

Those parents who killed their baby from starvation are just a couple of crack pots. You can easily raise a healthy baby as a vegan. I just can't believe they didn't feed the baby breast milk!

[/ QUOTE ]

what are you reading that you honestly believe this? do you also follow the raw movement?

[/ QUOTE ]

I read lots of things, but some of the things I mentioned above are mentioned in Stanley Burroughs "The Master Cleanse."

Regarding raw food, I think raw food is much healthier than cooked food. This is why I like to juice fruits and vegtables.

However, I eat stuff cooked too.

I live life to enjoy it, not be healthy. However, some of the healthy things I do allow me to enjoy life a little more by feeling good.

I enjoy steak; I don't enjoy fasting but I do it becase it makes me feel better in the long run and allows me to enjoy life a little more.

I really enjoy shell fish, but I don't eat it because it's unhealthy for you. Same with pigs.

If I was 100% focused on health then yes, I would be part of the raw food movement.

[/ QUOTE ]

what nutrients do you think are lost in cooking food?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not sure offhand. I'm sure if one would google around you'd find some studies on it.

IIRC, all those juices you see come out of food when you cook it are packed with nutrients. So I guess if you drank the juice from the cooked food and ate it, then you'd get all of the foods nutrients.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

There are certain foods that lose nurtritional value from cooking, there are other foods that dont have as much nutritional value if not cooked (because our body cant process it), there are no generaliziations. A lot of the veggies/vegans in this thread are following something that is fairly major as far as your life goes, and they have no [censored] clue what they are talking about, which is hilarious.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

[ QUOTE ]
A lot of the veggies/vegans in this thread are following something that is fairly major as far as your life goes, and they have no [censored] clue what they are talking about, which is hilarious.

[/ QUOTE ]

I imagine this is true of most people regarding what they eat, so it doesn't seem like the most compelling criticism to me.

As far as life sentences for these people go, I don't think that's right. If they did this to somebody else's child, or ran a daycare or something like that, you could make a stronger case for it, in my opinion. As is, putting them away isn't really protecting society from dangerous hippies. And while I think a certain element of retributive justice is probably a good thing, these people lost their own child. That's a pretty harsh [censored] sentence from the getgo. And I seriously doubt that jail is the disincentive that others will need to try not to starve their kids.

What I'm curious about is two things:

Where were their doctors in all of this? Maybe they didn't have any. (The article says they refused to take their baby to the doctor while he was wasting away - I'm inclined to think they were just clueless. I don't know what the schedule is for checkups immediately following birth, but six weeks isn't very long.) But, I would guess that if they did have prenatal care, it seems reasonable to assume that their veganism would have come up. If so, I'd think that the doctors would have some things to say on this front as far as what they should do when the baby is born. While they were obviously guided by their vegan beliefs, I would be surprised if they knew better and just decided "[censored] them. We're doing this our way."

Soy milk? Do vegan principles preclude the drinking of human breast milk? Because if so that's completely and utterly idiotic.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

[ QUOTE ]
but I believe that a vegan diet is the most healthy way to live life

[/ QUOTE ]

total utter [censored]

it can be healthy, but its not the "most" healthy

a balanced diet including meat, other animal products is the most healthy for nearly everyone

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

[ QUOTE ]
There are certain foods that lose nurtritional value from cooking, there are other foods that dont have as much nutritional value if not cooked (because our body cant process it), there are no generaliziations.

[/ QUOTE ]

According to http://www.rawfoods.com/articles/rawfreshproduce.html:

"It is well understood and recognized in scientific literature that heat breaks down vitamins, amino acids and produces undesirable cross-linkages in proteins, particularly in meat. "

Here it seems that heat is prejudice against vitamins, amino acids and proteins, not against certain foods.

It then goes on to say:

"When food is cooked above 117 degrees F for three minutes or longer, the following deleterious changes begin, and progressively cause increased nutritional damage as higher temperatures are applied over prolonged periods of time: ï‚· proteins coagulate, ï‚· high temperatures denature protein molecular structure, leading to deficiency of some essential amino acids, ï‚· carbohydrates caramelize..."

As far as cooking aids in digestion, I've heard that before-that's why I think it's best to juice fruits and vegetables. Though I'd be interested to see a study where they weigh the amount of nutrients lost due to cooking vs the absorbtion rate of raw foods.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

I imagine this is true of most people regarding what they eat, so it doesn't seem like the most compelling criticism to me.


The reason I think it is more valid of a criticism is because vegans/etc argue their point and spout off about how healthy they are. Most of the population has no idea how to eat correctly, but when called out on it they arent arguing they are healthy, they just say "well, ya, I dont know how to eat healthy, but I dont care".

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

[ QUOTE ]
I imagine this is true of most people regarding what they eat, so it doesn't seem like the most compelling criticism to me.


The reason I think it is more valid of a criticism is because vegans/etc argue their point and spout off about how healthy they are. Most of the population has no idea how to eat correctly, but when called out on it they arent arguing they are healthy, they just say "well, ya, I dont know how to eat healthy, but I dont care".

[/ QUOTE ]

Okay, fair enough.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
but I believe that a vegan diet is the most healthy way to live life

[/ QUOTE ]

total utter [censored]

it can be healthy, but its not the "most" healthy

a balanced diet including meat, other animal products is the most healthy for nearly everyone

[/ QUOTE ]

What nutrients do you get from animals that you don't get from fruits and vegetables?

I read somewhere that when you eat animal flesh that carbon molecules in your stomach lining form around the piece of flesh because it thinks that it's part of you... your flesh, and this is the reason why it's so hard to digest meat.

Look at all the diseases you can get from meat.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

"I read somewhere that when you eat animal flesh that carbon molecules in your stomach lining form around the piece of flesh because it thinks that it's part of you... your flesh, and this is the reason why it's so hard to digest meat."

uhh... this is the best you could come up with?

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

[ QUOTE ]
"I read somewhere that when you eat animal flesh that carbon molecules in your stomach lining form around the piece of flesh because it thinks that it's part of you... your flesh, and this is the reason why it's so hard to digest meat."

uhh... this is the best you could come up with?

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, I thought the part about all of the diseases you can get from meat was better than that :-)

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpag...5BC0A967948260

"Meat-eating societies, such as the United States, tend to have higher levels of cholesterol in their blood, and higher rates of coronary heart disease, than societies where people depend more heavily on plant foods."

There is lots of research done on how meat is bad for you, and I don't agree that you need to eat meat to have a well balanced diet. However, a nice steak tastes way good.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrients
 

This story should be called "stupid parents" not "vegan parents". These people are no different than the other dozens of idiots who get caught with malnourished children every year. They are either malicious or extremely stupid and/or uneducated.
I have never in my life heard of vegans not breastfeeding a baby, and I know a lot of vegans.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

[ QUOTE ]
What nutrients do you get from animals that you don't get from fruits and vegetables?

I read somewhere that when you eat animal flesh that carbon molecules in your stomach lining form around the piece of flesh because it thinks that it's part of you... your flesh, and this is the reason why it's so hard to digest meat.

Look at all the diseases you can get from meat.

[/ QUOTE ]

As for the nutritional defecits in a vegan diet, a three second trip to Wikipedia came up with this:
Note that it doesn't say that a vegan diet is necessarily deficient, but it is extremely hard to maintain levels of certain nutrients without supplements.

[ QUOTE ]
Health effects

Main article: Vegan nutrition

The position of the American Dietetic Association is that "appropriately planned" vegan diets "are healthful, nutritionally adequate, and provide health benefits in the prevention and treatment of certain diseases."[29] Vegans are potentially at risk for being deficient in nutrients such as vitamin B12,[51] vitamin D,[52] calcium,[53][52] iodine[54] and omega-3 fatty acids.[55] These deficiencies can have potentially serious consequences, including anemia,[56] rickets[57] and cretinism[58] in children, and osteomalacia[57] and hyperthyroidism[58] in adults. Supplementation, particularly for vitamin B12, is highly recommended for vegans.[59]

[edit] Specific nutrients

Vitamin B12, a bacterial product, cannot be reliably found in plant foods.[60][61][56] While it may take one to five years to exhaust some individual's reserves of vitamin B12, many people do not have such reserves[62] and serious health consequences are a risk as a result of B12 deficiency.[63] Additionally, mild B12 deficiency can develop even with such reserves.[62] In a 2002 laboratory study, more of the strict vegan participants' B12 and iron levels were compromised than those of lacto- or lacto-ovo-vegetarian participants.[64] The Vegan Society and Vegan Outreach, among others, recommend that vegans either consistently eat foods fortified with B12 or take a daily or weekly B12 supplement.[60][61][56][65][66] Tempeh, seaweeds, spirulina, organic produce, soil on unwashed vegetables, and intestinal bacteria have not been shown to be reliable sources of B12 for the dietary needs of vegans.[67][68]

Adequate amounts of vitamin D may be obtained by spending 15 to 30 minutes every few days in the sunlight, although this may be difficult for vegans in areas with low levels of sunlight during winter.[57][69][60]

A 2007 study showed that vegans have an increased risk of bone fractures than both meat eaters and vegetarians, likely due to lower dietary calcium intake, but that vegans consuming more than the UK's estimated average requirements for calcium (525 mg/day) had risk of bone fractures similar to other groups.[53] It is recommended that vegans eat three servings per day of a high calcium food, such as fortified soy milk and take a calcium supplement as necessary.[52][29]

[edit] Link with eating disorders

The American Dietetic Association found that vegetarian diets may be more common among adolescents with eating disorders than in the general adolescent population, and that professionals should be aware of adolescents who limit the food choices and exhibit symptoms of eating disorders.[29] The ADA indicates that the evidence suggests that the adoption of a vegetarian diet does not lead to eating disorders, but "vegetarian diets may be selected to camouflage an existing eating disorder."[29] Other studies and statements by dietitians and counselors support this conclusion.[70][71][72]

[edit] Vegan pregnancies

The American Dietetic Association considers well planned vegan diets "appropriate for all stages of the life cycle, including pregnancy and lactation,"[29] but recommends vegan mothers supplement for iron, vitamin D, and vitamin B12.[73][74] Severe vitamin B12 deficiency in lactating vegetarian mothers has been linked to deficiencies and neurological disorders in their children.[75][76] A 2006 study found that vegan mothers are five times less likely to have twins than those who eat animal products.[77]

[/ QUOTE ]


Next, no your body does not recognize meat as "self" and create a special carbon coating around it. This is so retarded that it requires no further explanation.

Your comment about food-borne illnesses is equally uninformed. Do you remember the problems with the vegetable supply (scallions, spinach) this past year?

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

So, if the above is true, and vegans lived exclusively on foods they could grow themselves, no supplements allowed, they would be really unhealthy or die. So much for it being the superior natural diet.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
What nutrients do you get from animals that you don't get from fruits and vegetables?

I read somewhere that when you eat animal flesh that carbon molecules in your stomach lining form around the piece of flesh because it thinks that it's part of you... your flesh, and this is the reason why it's so hard to digest meat.

Look at all the diseases you can get from meat.

[/ QUOTE ]

As for the nutritional defecits in a vegan diet, a three second trip to Wikipedia came up with this:
Note that it doesn't say that a vegan diet is necessarily deficient, but it is extremely hard to maintain levels of certain nutrients without supplements.

[ QUOTE ]
Health effects

Main article: Vegan nutrition

The position of the American Dietetic Association is that "appropriately planned" vegan diets "are healthful, nutritionally adequate, and provide health benefits in the prevention and treatment of certain diseases."[29] Vegans are potentially at risk for being deficient in nutrients such as vitamin B12,[51] vitamin D,[52] calcium,[53][52] iodine[54] and omega-3 fatty acids.[55] These deficiencies can have potentially serious consequences, including anemia,[56] rickets[57] and cretinism[58] in children, and osteomalacia[57] and hyperthyroidism[58] in adults. Supplementation, particularly for vitamin B12, is highly recommended for vegans.[59]

[edit] Specific nutrients

Vitamin B12, a bacterial product, cannot be reliably found in plant foods.[60][61][56] While it may take one to five years to exhaust some individual's reserves of vitamin B12, many people do not have such reserves[62] and serious health consequences are a risk as a result of B12 deficiency.[63] Additionally, mild B12 deficiency can develop even with such reserves.[62] In a 2002 laboratory study, more of the strict vegan participants' B12 and iron levels were compromised than those of lacto- or lacto-ovo-vegetarian participants.[64] The Vegan Society and Vegan Outreach, among others, recommend that vegans either consistently eat foods fortified with B12 or take a daily or weekly B12 supplement.[60][61][56][65][66] Tempeh, seaweeds, spirulina, organic produce, soil on unwashed vegetables, and intestinal bacteria have not been shown to be reliable sources of B12 for the dietary needs of vegans.[67][68]

Adequate amounts of vitamin D may be obtained by spending 15 to 30 minutes every few days in the sunlight, although this may be difficult for vegans in areas with low levels of sunlight during winter.[57][69][60]

A 2007 study showed that vegans have an increased risk of bone fractures than both meat eaters and vegetarians, likely due to lower dietary calcium intake, but that vegans consuming more than the UK's estimated average requirements for calcium (525 mg/day) had risk of bone fractures similar to other groups.[53] It is recommended that vegans eat three servings per day of a high calcium food, such as fortified soy milk and take a calcium supplement as necessary.[52][29]

[edit] Link with eating disorders

The American Dietetic Association found that vegetarian diets may be more common among adolescents with eating disorders than in the general adolescent population, and that professionals should be aware of adolescents who limit the food choices and exhibit symptoms of eating disorders.[29] The ADA indicates that the evidence suggests that the adoption of a vegetarian diet does not lead to eating disorders, but "vegetarian diets may be selected to camouflage an existing eating disorder."[29] Other studies and statements by dietitians and counselors support this conclusion.[70][71][72]

[edit] Vegan pregnancies

The American Dietetic Association considers well planned vegan diets "appropriate for all stages of the life cycle, including pregnancy and lactation,"[29] but recommends vegan mothers supplement for iron, vitamin D, and vitamin B12.[73][74] Severe vitamin B12 deficiency in lactating vegetarian mothers has been linked to deficiencies and neurological disorders in their children.[75][76] A 2006 study found that vegan mothers are five times less likely to have twins than those who eat animal products.[77]

[/ QUOTE ]


Next, no your body does not recognize meat as "self" and create a special carbon coating around it. This is so retarded that it requires no further explanation.

Your comment about food-borne illnesses is equally uninformed. Do you remember the problems with the vegetable supply (scallions, spinach) this past year?

[/ QUOTE ]

From the book I gave earlier:
"There is a sodium coating covering
the entire inside wall of the stomach, which, if it remains intact, will prevent the digestive juices from
digesting the stomach itself. However, when any form of flesh food enters the stomach, the meat
attracts the sodium in the same way as the walls of the stomach. Some of the sodium is drawn from the
walls and gathers around the meat, thus preventing the digestion of the meat in the stomach and at the
same time depleting the sodium on the walls of the stomach.

As one continues to eat meat and a deficiency of sodium in the diet occurs, the sodium lining is not being
replaced on the walls of the stomach. The digestive juices then start digesting the stomach, producing
what we call an ulcer. When this occurs, all orthodox methods to heal the ulcer fail completely.

Sometimes the meat can remain in the stomach for two or more hours and begin to ferment and spoil.
To be broken down and digested it must pass on into the small intestine. All forms of meat take longer to
digest than fruit and vegetables do. Chicken and other fowl take the longest of all. Just because meat is
already a form of flesh, it does not follow that it is readily usable by our bodies. In fact, just the reverse
is true. "

You can find all of those vitamins you listed in non-meat products.
B12, which I guess has the most debate can be found in spirulina.

You can find loads of B12 in human poo, you won't catch me eating it ;-)

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrients
 

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This story should be called "stupid parents" not "vegan parents". These people are no different than the other dozens of idiots who get caught with malnourished children every year. They are either malicious or extremely stupid and/or uneducated.


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Bingo.

There's a boatload of kids in worse shape thanks to the habits of their meat eating parents.

That said, meat is delicious and not eating it is a crime against your taste buds.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
This story should be called "stupid parents" not "vegan parents". These people are no different than the other dozens of idiots who get caught with malnourished children every year. They are either malicious or extremely stupid and/or uneducated.


[/ QUOTE ]

Bingo.

There's a boatload of kids in worse shape thanks to the habits of their meat eating parents.

That said, meat is delicious and not eating it is a crime against your taste buds.

[/ QUOTE ]

I dunno dids, dead is pretty bad shape. I just think that if you are an adult, fine, eat whatever you want, but listen to a friggen doctor in regards to your child no matter what your morals/ideas may be.

Re: Parenting tip for vegans: please feed the baby vital macronutrient
 

A sodium lining? You've GOT to be kidding me. Sodium is an ion. It diffuses rapidly through all parts of your body. It can't form any kind of protective coating. Furthermore, it's more likely to be REQUIRED for the activity of your digestive enzymes than it is to inhibit them. Man, have at least a rudimentary understanding of biochemistry before you rattle off any more of this [censored].

Oh, yuck. Then you go with more [censored] about ulcers. It's been conclusively proven that most ulcers are the result of a bacterial infection, not from your own stomach acid. Quit spreading this [censored] propaganda and misinformation.