100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

No reads on villain since it's his 2nd orbit since sitting down. Shortie is 55/18/2 (38) so I'm not worried about him obviously. Is this a close call here at all?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

BB ($95.50)
UTG ($91)
Hero ($185.75)
CO ($179.05)
Button ($43.90)
SB ($32.20)

Preflop: Hero is MP with A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $4</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, SB calls $3.50, BB calls $3.

Flop: ($12) 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets $5</font>, <font color="#CC3333">BB raises to $91.5</font>, Hero?

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

fold and observe his game

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

I snap call this. But I don't know if that's good.

I just don't see how I could lay it down.

The problem is usually these weird looking raises signify some kind of draw semi-bluff. But that clearly can't be the case here. I really don't know what he has, but I call.

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

If we call this we are givign gorgeous implied odds for playrs to flop sets against us

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

very easy fold with no reads.

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

I don't think this is a snap call at all. Yeah, we have no reads on villain whatsoever so it's nearly impossible to know what his range is here. He pretty much instashoved, so it looked like he couldn't care less what I have here when I have yet to act postflop.


I can't remember seeing a shove like this before on NL 100 without any draws on the board so it threw me off a bit. But I've only invested 4 BB in this pot so I agree it's better to wait and observe his game here.

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

instamuck

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I can't remember seeing a shove like this before on NL 100 without any draws on the board so it threw me off a bit.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah. Spot on.

I'm very confused by it aswell. I'm pretty sure I'd stack off and (most likely) lose.

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

Fold.

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

I could go broke here vs some players but I dont think you can vs unknown and I think this makes a fold even better because shortie wlll probably call for sure and you can see his hand.

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

He could always be trying to fold you out with a worse hand to get all in vs the shortie and not know how much to raise.

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

such a strange move w/ sets and its such a strange move w/ lower aces. i don't think you should call here, but i wouldnt really hate it if you did

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

I don't think it can possibly be a set, to be honest.

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

This happend twice vs my AA on FTP ...
I raise PF, bet flop, villian pushes, I snapcall, villian has a set

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

It's different with a shortstack in there.

Seriously, the more I think about the more I want to call.

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

[ QUOTE ]
This happend ... on FTP ...
I raise PF, bet flop, villian pushes, I ...call, villian has a set

[/ QUOTE ]

I've had similar experience. It looks damn odd to push or check/push so I've called with overpairs out of confusion [img]/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img]

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I don't think it can possibly be a set, to be honest.

[/ QUOTE ]

why?

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I don't think it can possibly be a set, to be honest.

[/ QUOTE ]
why

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

Ok ok, it can be a set. Saying it can't possibly was stupid and wrong obviously, it's very late [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

I really don't think it is though, and I'm sticking with my comment that he has a medium-to-strong hand that he doesn't mind getting all-in with the shortstack, but he just wants you out of the way.

Seriously though, I'm deleriously tired, so there's every chance I'm dribbling nonsense.

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

I dont think you are wrong, I just wanted to know why you didn't think it was a set.
You could be right about him wanting shorty alone with A10/AJ/AQ

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

With the bet sizing I don't see folding here being +EV, it's NL100, people are dumb, shoves usually mean they don't know how to play on the next street(s), call and stack off his AT/A9

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

Fold and wait to see retard's A3 or 33 or something

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

If he had a set he would likely just call the shortie and see what you do. Sure he could possibly have a set but I go broke here everytime in this situation.

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

[ QUOTE ]
You could be right about him wanting shorty alone with A10/AJ/AQ

[/ QUOTE ]

I think you make a good point about that. The fact that shortie is involved in this hand and donkbet the flop could have influenced him to push with a wider range to get me outta there. That's exactly why I had trouble with this hand because if shortie wasn't involved I think it would be an instamuck in a 3-way pot with full stacks.

Of course, I'm only assuming this since I have no idea how this guy plays. But from my experience, I gave him a little more credit as an unknown and thought he would just call if he had a set to try to trap me into raising him here. I figured I was flipping against his range here and called. Yeah he had 33 and stacked me gg whatever. I was just wondering if this call was close and could be neutral to slightly EV, or if I have a leak here by calling. Just wondering for future reference when I see these kind of shoves from unknowns.

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

lol- sb rarely will have a set here or two pair- probably has something like AT or AJ. Meh, You can jus fold. Anyone who will make retarded overbets like this you can just stack later. This is a very marginal call if you were to do it, especially if SB did actually lead with a big flopped hand.

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

nah SB was a donk and I wouldn't even give him credit for more than mid pair here. He instafolded once I called anyway.

I would fold here, but I guess I couldn't find that button in time. I figured it was marginal and felt like taking a chance here, but I felt like I made a mistake as soon as I clicked call. Not a big deal for losing one stack, I'll just be more patient next time and wait for a better chance to stack him.

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

overbet-pushing a dry, A high flop with a set is a pretty sick move., especially vs an unknown

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

yeah i thought so too. maybe I should start doing this and people will actually start to pay my sets off for once. I doubt he was thinking on this level though but who knows, NL 100 could be getting tougher these days!

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

i think you have to call so you can tell us what he had

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

all in

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

[ QUOTE ]
all in

[/ QUOTE ]

care to elaborate on that?

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

you have top top. BB super shoves. He never has a set, it wastes so much value. A9 and A3 beat you, and a variety of weaker aces do not.
SB obv has nothing. You even have decent equity vs A3, though not so much so vs A9. Why in the world would he just shove two pair here, that is retarded. The board is so dry it looks more like weakness than him trying to baffle you into calling with a big ace.

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

I actually have seen this play a lot in both tournaments and side games. In most of my experience, villain has A9 or A3 here. I'd fold here, especially because the short stack will likely let you see.

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

short stack is not calling this raise usually, his weak bet is just a stab to take it down with air in my experience.
This line is so terrible from villain as it only gets value from AK, any other ace you have could fold. Even AK might fold. While it is entirely possible MP has you beat I really dont see any sense in his play.
Someone is gonna say, but look, you called with AK. Yea so what? AK is prob the only ace I make this call with

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

whoever snap calls this is not a winning player. this is so so bad to call. atleast if youre going to call these kinds of bets open to 20 dollars preflop so youre not making a mistake stacking off when an ace hits.

Re: 100 NL | AK flops TPTK. Who goes broke here?
 

[ QUOTE ]
whoever snap calls this is not a winning player.

[/ QUOTE ]

what range do you put villain on. IMO he never has a set so my range is
Ax, A3, A9.
You have pretty damn good equity vs that range.
If you include sets, which I think is a little ridic, your equity goes down.
I can see the arguement for folding. This used to be a super easy snap call but it may be that the games have changed enough for this to be a fold.