Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

Hello. This is the first time I have posted on this site, but I am a frequent visitor of the site. I have a very big problem. Someone stole my bank account info and started depositing money onto PokerStars.com. The total got up to about $1800 before my bank contacted me about this. After that, there was a collection agency asking me for $2600 (after fees and all I suppose). They want me to pay this money, even though it wasn't me playing. Is it even legal for PokerStars to let someone deposit money from a checking account? It was a direct deposit from my bank account into this person's account, which I thought was no longer legal in the US. They were depositing this money back in December. I have talked to my bank. They gave me the money back on the transactions, but then went to PokerStars and asked them for the money back. They then went to e-checks who went to a collection agency. The collection agency now wants the money from me. I do not need info about what to do with my bank, but rather if it is legal or not for this person to be depositing money from a bank account into an online site (I believe through e-checks). Please give me all the info you can!!!! Thanks!!!!

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

In December echecks were still being done. The legality is a whole other question, but so is gambling from the US in general. Not sure if you are looking for a discussion of the legality of US gambling/transfers, etc. There are other threads discussing this. For a simple answer regarding echecks, yes, there were sites that were allowing echecks from the US in December.

I don't think the legality/illegality of echecks to gambling sites should be your argument to the bill collector. the fact that someone stole your money and it was illegal because you didn't do it should be your argument.

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

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Hello. This is the first time I have posted on this site, but I am a frequent visitor of the site.

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Why do a lot of new posters add this type of line, as if it makes a difference?

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I have a very big problem. Someone stole my bank account info and started depositing money onto PokerStars.com. The total got up to about $1800 before my bank contacted me about this. After that, there was a collection agency asking me for $2600 (after fees and all I suppose).

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I think I call [censored] here.... especially the last part.

And we didn't contact the police... why, exactly?

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

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[
And we didn't contact the police... why, exactly?

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My wife got a call Friday night from some kind of credit tracking agency about suspicious charges on her debit card. she hasn't used the account in about a year, and had 12 bucks (but instant cach reserve) in the account. We went to the bank saturday, filled out the appropriate affidavits. The Banker didn't mention going to the police, and we did not go to the police. SOP, I believe.

--Zetack

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

Its illegal for someone to deposit money into their online account from your bank account without your permission, so yes it is illegal. Its also very difficult to do this if the perp does not have access to your bank account. Of course, they might be able to do it with inside access at the poker site side (to confirm initial security deposit amounts, etc).

Not that it matters to your question of legality, but did you have a PokerStars account that you had previously funded through this bank account?

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

Thanks a lot for the help. I did contact the police, but I would have to hire a lawyer to even have a chance at getting some of the money back. I could end up losing even MORE money doing this. It would be hard figuring out who did this, very hard. I figured it'd be a lot easier if it wasn't even legal in the first place, before you even mention the theft involved. Thanks for the help everyone!

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

And wongboy, I did previously have a PokerStars account, but not with this account. I have two accounts, a personal account and a business account. The money being deposited into PokerStars illegally was from the business account. I haven't played online in a few years. I thought it was illegal to play online, and then I read it was just illegal to deposit from a bank, or something along those lines. From the looks of it, it seems it was deposited to the PokerStars account from the bank account through e-checks, which may or may not make it legal.

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

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Thanks a lot for the help. I did contact the police, but I would have to hire a lawyer to even have a chance at getting some of the money back. I could end up losing even MORE money doing this. It would be hard figuring out who did this, very hard. I figured it'd be a lot easier if it wasn't even legal in the first place, before you even mention the theft involved. Thanks for the help everyone!

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I thought the bank refunded the money into your account. If so, how has this actually cost you money at this point? Isn't it just in collections? I definitely wouldn't pay it if it was money that was stolen from you.

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

[ QUOTE ]
Thanks a lot for the help. I did contact the police, but I would have to hire a lawyer to even have a chance at getting some of the money back. I could end up losing even MORE money doing this. It would be hard figuring out who did this, very hard. I figured it'd be a lot easier if it wasn't even legal in the first place, before you even mention the theft involved. Thanks for the help everyone!

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First of all calm down and start thinking clearly. Your bank refunded your money so at this point you aren't out any cash at all. First thing you need to do is to have your old account closed and have your bank open a new account with a fraud notice so that they will watch it closer this time. Do not switch banks (yet).

Next step is to file a police report. Even if the police don't do anything about it you need this report for your protection.

After you file the report contact the collection agency and demand to speak with a supervisor. Don't let yourself get browbeaten by the person you speak with. Explain to the supervisor what happened and get a mailing address and fax number as well as that person's name and title.

Mail and fax a letter to them explaining what happened and who you spoke with at their agency. Attach the police report as well as a letter from your bank manager (get one). Follow this up with another phone call in about 2 weeks.

Don't bother to get Pokerstars involved as they won't be able to help you. echecks and their collection agency may contact them but you won't get any help from them.

Finally: Keep detailed notes on who you spoke to and time and date it.

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

"chatard5"

He has brothers? 1,2,3,& 4 ?

P [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

why wait til now to post if it happened in december?

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

You should have posted this in the Internet forum.

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

First off... know your rights.

Do a google search on "Fair Debt Collections Act." You can very easily get rid of that third party collector.

Then you need to get a copy of your credit bureau from Equifax. If this $2600 shows on your credit report as a negative, you can dispute it through Equifax. If noone can produce something with your signature on it, then Equifax will remove it from your credit bureau.

This is a hassle... but nothing that should hurt you if you educate yourself.

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

This dont make sense to me ... who is trying to collect the money (hired the collection agency)? Seems the only ones out money are Pokerstars, and then only if they actually refunded the money to the bank ... the bank wouldnt sue its customer after giving a refund ...

Maybe the guy deposited the money, got his bank to get it back from Pokerstars, then Pokerstars says, wait a minute, it was this guy after all and demands the money back then sends it too collection ... then the guy says, hmm I need a new reason not to pay pokerstars/collection agency - I know, gambling is illegal.

Not saying this for certain - just that it makes more sense then what was described....

The bottom line is that you are not responsible for what people do with money they have stolen from you - no one should even be trying to get this money from you unless they can PROVE that the money was not stolen from you and that you therefore got a fraudulent refund.

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

This sounds like a typical charge back. Guy is obviously trying to find a reason to keep the money and do not pay collections.

This is BEYOND obvious in a gambling world.

1. Guy deposits 1800 to the site.
2. Loses it.
3. Bank returns due to "fraud".
4. eChecks puts him on collection.
5. Comes here.

I would not help him.

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

This is off-topic but an interesting story. I once saw a consumer tv show where this woman allowed a fitness club to take money (EFT) from her bank account each month (she didn't use credit card). Anyways, she quit the fitness club after 2 months. They didn't bill her anymore for a few months. Then suddenly she noticed the fitness club start taking money from her bank account again.

She called them. They said they would stop. They did for a while. Then they tried it again months later, taking money from her account. This pattern went on for like 4 times, then... I switched the channels. I regret that now, because I would have like to see the ending to that news story. She should have used a credit card and charged those MFs back.

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

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This is off-topic but an interesting story. I once saw a consumer tv show where this woman allowed a fitness club to take money (EFT) from her bank account each month (she didn't use credit card). Anyways, she quit the fitness club after 2 months. They didn't bill her anymore for a few months. Then suddenly she noticed the fitness club start taking money from her bank account again.

She called them. They said they would stop. They did for a while. Then they tried it again months later, taking money from her account. This pattern went on for like 4 times, then... I switched the channels. I regret that now, because I would have like to see the ending to that news story. She should have used a credit card and charged those MFs back.

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Great story.....?

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

It would be very hard for someone to access that info to deposit, but anyways.

Yrs ago when I started playing I opened a 3rd Checking acct just for cash handling. I keep only a few dollars in there. This just adds another obstacle to the real money. I would reccommend this to all.

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

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It would be very hard for someone to access that info to deposit, but anyways.

Yrs ago when I started playing I opened a 3rd Checking acct just for cash handling. I keep only a few dollars in there. This just adds another obstacle to the real money. I would reccommend this to all.

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She used monthly direct debit from her account.

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

[ QUOTE ]
This is off-topic but an interesting story. I once saw a consumer tv show where this woman allowed a fitness club to take money (EFT) from her bank account each month (she didn't use credit card). Anyways, she quit the fitness club after 2 months. They didn't bill her anymore for a few months. Then suddenly she noticed the fitness club start taking money from her bank account again.

She called them. They said they would stop. They did for a while. Then they tried it again months later, taking money from her account. This pattern went on for like 4 times, then... I switched the channels. I regret that now, because I would have like to see the ending to that news story. She should have used a credit card and charged those MFs back.

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24 Hour Fitness is well known for this type of behavior. They'll yes you to death about canceling your membership, and just keep charging you until you die. I know several folks who have been caught in this trap.

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

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It would be very hard for someone to access that info to deposit, but anyways.



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??? It's not that hard at all. Easy actually. She initally signed up and paid the fitness club by monthly direct debits from her bank account. Once that was done, the fitness club had her bank account information necessary for direct debits. Once she quit the fitness club, they would still have the information to do direct debits from her bank account.

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

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This sounds like a typical charge back. Guy is obviously trying to find a reason to keep the money and do not pay collections.

This is BEYOND obvious in a gambling world.

1. Guy deposits 1800 to the site.
2. Loses it.
3. Bank returns due to "fraud".
4. eChecks puts him on collection.
5. Comes here.

I would not help him.

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Maybe so. But neither of us really know. If you don't believe that internet fraud is another possibility, or that a third party bill collector would continue to harass an innocent victim, you are in "la la land."

So, OP: If you owe the money, pay it. If you don't, make yourself familiar with the fair debt collection practices act. You can end the harassment with that.

Finally, many states have a requirement that a third party bill collector be licensed or registered in the state in which he/she is harassing people. Often, they are not (these companies operate nationwide, usually). Check and see if your state requires the harasser to be registered or licensed. in my state, this can be done on line, and you can tell if he/she holds a license on line. if they don't, call your state AG's office, who will then begin harassing them.

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

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I am a frequent visitor of the site.

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I thought it was illegal to play online

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99.9% of the posts on here are about playing online. Therefore, you are a liar. Also, if your bank account gets robbed, why would you go to a poker community for help? Plus, your story doesn't even make sense. People, stop helping the scammer scam please.

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

Listen, I need to chime in here. You need to resolve this with the collection agency. They can and most likely will hit your credit even though you might not have authorized these charges. Under the Fair Credit Reporting Act, and the FDCPA it allows them to place someone in collections on behalf on the original creditor. And remember the original creditor is not PokerStars. It's with their processing company PStarpayments.com which is separate from gambling. They can and will argue that they are just collecting on the transaction from your bank account to their client, which is not gamlbing. However you chose to use those funds at that point is legally up to you. All of this is outlined in Pokerstars, and pstarpayments terms and conditions. Their parent company is called G2pay.com and they are legitimate company.

Now what I can tell you is that you CAN get around this by just filing a police report for idenity theft or fraud and get that to the collection agency and they will most likely close your account.

By chance is this collection agency called JMC? If so, please email me at iansjob283@yahoo.ca .

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

JMC is a collection agency for all gambling merchants, firepay, neteller, e-check processors etc.
But they stopped taking payments on Neteller accounts after the arrests. Also copy of an affadavit filed at the bank should be enough, there is no need to file a police report.

Also the bank probably gave you a provisional credit, meanwhile they do an investigation, if they don't take it back within certain period of time (banks ovb. vary) its yours.

Re: Very important question!!! Had $1800 worth of fraud!!! Help!
 

An affadavit is not enough. Anyone can get one from their bank. Remember, the bank is on YOUR side, and wants to keep YOU as a customer, so of course they will charge it back.

JMC requires a police report in order to close a file. I would get one to them asap as you don't want your credit ruined by stupid B.S.