hate aces
 

no read other than him being like 23/18/3

i am running like dogshit and making sure this is standard, which i assume it is

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $3/$6
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $1364
UTG+1: $1101
CO: $923
Hero: $597
SB: $608.25
BB: $1423.75

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is Button with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
3 folds, <font color="#cc0000">Hero raises to $21</font>, <font color="#cc0000">SB raises to $75</font>, BB folds, Hero calls.

Flop: K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($156, 2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">SB bets $150</font>, Hero calls.

Turn: 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($456, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks.

River: 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($456, 2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">SB INSTASHOVES $383.25</font>, Hero folds.
Uncalled bets: $383.25 returned to SB.

Results:
Final pot: $456

Re: hate aces
 

AK doesn't shove here?
bad fold imo

Re: hate aces
 

[ QUOTE ]
AK doesn't shove here?

bad fold imo

[/ QUOTE ]


i dont think AK instashoves

Re: hate aces
 

i think this fold is fine

Re: hate aces
 

I call he could easily have qk or ak

Re: hate aces
 

So terrible. Better then 2;1 and behind only kings and queens. Guys aggro pre, id assume he could have a wide range.

Re: hate aces
 

next time switch your jacks and aces and you'll have much easier decisions

tough one, but you also beat KQ which is instashoveworthy and AK MIGHT be

Re: hate aces
 

I think you gotta call because of AA, KQ, AK(how confident are you in that timing tell?), etc.

Re: hate aces *DELETED* *DELETED*
 

is villain really leading for pot with QQQ/KKK ?

what hands would give him action...

Re: hate aces
 

good fold

Re: hate aces
 

since josh said he had no reads, we can assume he hasnt been threebetting light, this kind of kicks KQ out of his range IMO?

Re: hate aces
 

[ QUOTE ]
since josh said he had no reads, we can assume he hasnt been threebetting light, this kind of kicks KQ out of his range IMO?

[/ QUOTE ]

I think 23/18s 3-bet kq all day.

Re: hate aces
 

Tough spot with your read but you beat KQ! I probally dont lay this down.

Re: hate aces
 

WTFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFffffffffffffffffff

Re: hate aces
 

This hand was against me and I was being coached by RBK

I had AK

RBK said that since OP was a solid player that we could easily bluff him off AA by shoving the river. Hes an awesome coach. Normally I would just check fold. But bluffing out aces is way better

Re: hate aces *DELETED*
 

[ QUOTE ]
This hand was against me and I was being coached by RBK

I had AK

[/ QUOTE ]

lol

Re: hate aces
 

awful

Re: hate aces
 

folding would be bad

Re: hate aces
 

[ QUOTE ]
folding would be bad

[/ QUOTE ]

really bad.

Re: hate aces
 

ez call

Re: hate aces
 

[ QUOTE ]
This hand was against me and I was being coached by RBK

I had AK

[/ QUOTE ]


i wish you hadn't posted that since i was hoping to hear more opinions. but the KQ argument is compelling enough

but since you did, i don't like how you played your hand. i don't like your river shove and i think you bet too much on the flop. interested in hearing rbk or your comments on these

Re: hate aces
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
This hand was against me and I was being coached by RBK

I had AK

[/ QUOTE ]


i wish you hadn't posted that since i was hoping to hear more opinions. but the KQ argument is compelling enough

but since you did, i don't like how you played your hand. i don't like your river shove and i think you bet too much on the flop. interested in hearing rbk or your comments on these

[/ QUOTE ]

i like the river shove.

Re: hate aces
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
This hand was against me and I was being coached by RBK

I had AK

[/ QUOTE ]


i wish you hadn't posted that since i was hoping to hear more opinions. but the KQ argument is compelling enough

but since you did, i don't like how you played your hand. i don't like your river shove and i think you bet too much on the flop. interested in hearing rbk or your comments on these

[/ QUOTE ]

i like the river shove.

[/ QUOTE ]


for value or to push me off a chop?

Re: hate aces
 

umm.. villain played AK well and how it's "supposed" to be played

as for your fold... wow.

Re: hate aces
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
This hand was against me and I was being coached by RBK

I had AK

[/ QUOTE ]


i wish you hadn't posted that since i was hoping to hear more opinions. but the KQ argument is compelling enough

but since you did, i don't like how you played your hand. i don't like your river shove and i think you bet too much on the flop. interested in hearing rbk or your comments on these

[/ QUOTE ]

i like the river shove.

[/ QUOTE ]


for value or to push me off a chop?

[/ QUOTE ]

value

Re: hate aces
 

[ QUOTE ]
umm.. villain played AK well and how it's "supposed" to be played

as for your fold... wow.

[/ QUOTE ]


potting the flop is what you're supposed to do?

and what worse hands is a typical player calling with on the river? does AQ ever pay off?

why so condescending when i'm asking honest questions?

Re: hate aces
 

Shoving AK for value makes no sense. Josh isn't calling worse(as evidenced in this hand). Could be a profitable bluff, I guess, especially if you think his range is more AK heavy than AA-QQ heavy.

Re: hate aces
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
umm.. villain played AK well and how it's "supposed" to be played

as for your fold... wow.

[/ QUOTE ]


potting the flop is what you're supposed to do?

and what worse hands is a typical player calling with on the river? does AQ ever pay off?

why so condescending when i'm asking honest questions?

[/ QUOTE ]

its been a long day for me

im sorry if i seem condescending, i like you alot, i like your posts alot, etc.

why is a pot effective on the flop? its just a cbet. i am not sure how i would interpret it, but certainly if i had a marginal hand it would make the pot that much more attractive to steal. so it is a nice and easy pot - call shove.

Re: hate aces
 

IMO when you lead this flop Bibbo.. pretty obvious his range doesn't include any draws, you rarely get value from a worse hand, and give him action when he has you beat. I typically check the flop in these spots.

The river shove as a bluff seems silly. I don't know how you can put him on AA and that he will fold it?

Re: hate aces
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
umm.. villain played AK well and how it's "supposed" to be played

as for your fold... wow.

[/ QUOTE ]


potting the flop is what you're supposed to do?

and what worse hands is a typical player calling with on the river? does AQ ever pay off?

why so condescending when i'm asking honest questions?

[/ QUOTE ]

your questions are fine. potting the flop maybe isn't standard, but i don't think there's anything wrong with it at all. the problem i think your having is that you underrepresented your hand by calling the 3bet pf. villian is most likely elimaneting AA/KK/QQ from your range (incorrectly, but anyway). on the river he figures to have the best hand since you have shown NO aggression whatsoever and pushes hoping you talk yourself into a call. that's my read, maybe their reasoning was different but i'm sure it wasn't a bluff.

Re: hate aces
 

[ QUOTE ]
IMO when you lead this flop Bibbo.. pretty obvious his range doesn't include any draws, you rarely get value from a worse hand, and give him action when he has you beat. I typically check the flop in these spots.

The river shove as a bluff seems silly. I don't know how you can put him on AA and that he will fold it?

[/ QUOTE ]

HAHA

Re: hate aces
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
umm.. villain played AK well and how it's "supposed" to be played

as for your fold... wow.

[/ QUOTE ]


potting the flop is what you're supposed to do?

and what worse hands is a typical player calling with on the river? does AQ ever pay off?

why so condescending when i'm asking honest questions?

[/ QUOTE ]

its been a long day for me

im sorry if i seem condescending, i like you alot, i like your posts alot, etc.

why is a pot effective on the flop? its just a cbet. i am not sure how i would interpret it, but certainly if i had a marginal hand it would make the pot that much more attractive to steal. so it is a nice and easy pot - call shove.

[/ QUOTE ]

unless you've had a long history of 3betting i doubt he's going to shove on your cbet light..

Re: hate aces
 

Josh,

instead of focusing on why you think AK played badly, why not focus on how well you played AA to stack AK/KQ erc...and maybe consider the same line in the future against aggro opponents

Re: hate aces
 

[ QUOTE ]
Josh,

instead of focusing on why you think AK played badly, why not focus on how well you played AA to stack AK...

[/ QUOTE ]


hey buddy

first off, in your first post, you edited out the "this is a bad fold imo" part of your post, then edited it back in after i quoted it. i guess you decided looking like a coward was worse than sticking your neck out and potentially being wrong. and you obviously weren't so confident in your own decision. it took until the results were posted to come out and say anything else. so i have no respect for you

secondly, i am not attacking the way he played the hand. i conceeded that KQ probably makes it a call. i've moved on to wondering how he played his hand. this is how i learn and get better.

so thanks for your wonderful contributions

Re: hate aces
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Josh,

instead of focusing on why you think AK played badly, why not focus on how well you played AA to stack AK...

[/ QUOTE ]


hey buddy

first off, in your first post, you edited out the "this is a bad fold imo" part of your post, then edited it back in after i quoted it. so you obviously weren't so confident in your own decision. it took until the results were posted to come out and say anything else. so i have no respect for you

secondly, i am not attacking the way he played the hand. i conceeded that KQ probably makes it a call. i've moved on to wondering how he played his hand. this is how i learn and get better.

so thanks for your wonderful contributions

[/ QUOTE ]

LOL...you're the (insert douchebag comment here) who folded AA in a terrible spot, not me

no need to get personal, then I try to open a discussion about playing AA like you did, with absolutely no aggression to give away the strength of your hand so AK can stack off to you with a smile, then you talk [censored]

have fun with the rest of your dog$hit running or whatever you call it

and take some midol

Re: hate aces
 

props to rbk

Re: hate aces
 

[ QUOTE ]


RBK said that since OP was a solid player that we could easily bluff him off AA by shoving the river.

[/ QUOTE ]
Seems like Josh was considering calling. Also, from responses in this thread most solid players are not folding so if your intention of pushing is as a bluff to fold out a hand like AA then WTF, your lucky it worked here.

Re: hate aces
 

I think this is a very easy call after checking the turn and I also like four betting here preflop.

Re: hate aces
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]


RBK said that since OP was a solid player that we could easily bluff him off AA by shoving the river.

[/ QUOTE ]
Seems like Josh was considering calling. Also, from responses in this thread most solid players are not folding so if your intention of pushing is as a bluff to fold out a hand like AA then WTF, your lucky it worked here.

[/ QUOTE ]

I hope to God you guys arent serious

Re: hate aces
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think this is a very easy call after checking the turn and I also like four betting here preflop.

[/ QUOTE ]

(yeah i know i said fold was alright)