seif rips gold
 

Re: seif rips gold
 

Well he's a little self-interested here, but I believe he summarizes the situation well. While Jaime sure seems dis-honest in this one situation, it could be argued it's an exceptional situation revolving around $6M and a hastily proposed deal that Jaime never thought would cost him that much.

Perhaps Jaime is normally honest in his other dealings, maybe he's even a good guy who just got overwhelmed by a huge payday and event? If Seif wants to call him dishonest and claim he's not even a poker player, offer up some more evidence (beyond him being an "agent"). Otherwise just stick to the facts of this case, which already portray Jaime in a very poor light, there is no need to pile on the invective.

Re: seif rips gold
 

Wow.

Very refreshing to read something from a pro that gets to the point. THanks Seif.

Cliff notes: Judge says he believes Gold tried to pull a "Franklin" on Leyser.

Dogmeat [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

Re: seif rips gold
 

it's nice to see a pro rip gold, i don't mind at all that gold is catching a lot of [censored]...

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]
it's nice to see a pro rip gold

[/ QUOTE ]

They're all jealous. All of them.

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
it's nice to see a pro rip gold

[/ QUOTE ]

They're all jealous. All of them.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree. How much does Seif get if his buddy collects the 6 million? 33%? I hope Gold keeps the 12 million.

Re: seif rips gold
 

broken link?

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
it's nice to see a pro rip gold

[/ QUOTE ]

They're all jealous. All of them.

[/ QUOTE ]not hachem

edit: or antonious

Re: seif rips gold
 

"a hastily proposed deal that Jaime never thought would cost him that much. "

that is NO excuse.

If there was an agreement, then the price at the payoff doesn't matter .... remember, but for Leyser getting 2 celebs,there would be no seat for Jamie and $0.

Re: seif rips gold
 

Claiming Gold isn't really a poker player is somewhat ridiculous. My take on the case seems to be the opposite of everyone else's. I don't see how you can possibly award $6 million dollars on the basis of a deal for which there's no paperwork/contract.

If Gold reneged on a deal then I hold him in as much contempt as anyone else but courts have to decide according to the law. You can't enforce these privately agreed deals, or as Sam Goldwyn memorably put it: "A verbal contract isn't worth the paper it's written on."

Re: seif rips gold
 

Now I have two reasons to [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Mark Seif.

The other was him doubling me up as a desperate short stack in a $1500 WSOP event. [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]
Claiming Gold isn't really a poker player is somewhat ridiculous. My take on the case seems to be the opposite of everyone else's. I don't see how you can possibly award $6 million dollars on the basis of a deal for which there's no paperwork/contract.

If Gold reneged on a deal then I hold him in as much contempt as anyone else but courts have to decide according to the law. You can't enforce these privately agreed deals, or as Sam Goldwyn memorably put it: "A verbal contract isn't worth the paper it's written on."

[/ QUOTE ]

wtf are you talking about? oral contracts ARE binding in many states...if it's over $500 and the job or performance can reasonably be completed in under a year

so yes...6 million is > $500...and the tourny last under a year...hence Gold should HAVE TO pay the 6 million if they did make the contract (at least in Washington state)

Re: seif rips gold
 

I like it how Seif spends a whole paragraph explaining the importance of writing a clear and concise piece and then proceeds to publish something that is rambling, disjointed and emotionally charged.

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]
I like it how Seif spends a whole paragraph explaining the importance of writing a clear and concise piece and then proceeds to publish something that is rambling, disjointed and emotionally charged.

[/ QUOTE ]

But a blog is...well...casual.

Re: seif rips gold
 

"(despite the headline which appeared in some articles today stating the opposite - it was just a typo)."

Any links to these articles? Is he saying that several articles had the same typo, that just happened to disagree with his opinion?

Re: seif rips gold
 

i think that about 75% of these pro players are total scumbags. but it seems that these agreements are upheldchr(2c) almost as an unwritten scumbag code of ethics. jg seems to be a different kind of scumbag one that does not understand the poker player scumbag code of ethics. this doesn't make him better or worse he's just different.

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]
wtf are you talking about? oral contracts ARE binding in many states...if it's over $500 and the job or performance can reasonably be completed in under a year

[/ QUOTE ]

I didn't say verbal contracts weren't valid, I said they weren't *enforcable*. How can you enforce a verbal contract between just two people who now dispute the details?

Re: seif rips gold
 

Very poorly written and meaningless article.

Yeah, Gold is obviously a sleaze. There are hints of collusion in the ME. This disagreement over the staking deal and the alleged staker being a body building cyclist also do nothing for his reputation. His occupation as a Hollywood agent also builds a certain image.

However, there have been poker players like that for ever. There are no character qualifications for ME winners.

I don't know what Seif means that Gold is not a poker player. He was not a professional player. He apparently played 10/25 NL or something fairly regularly in LA. I don't know if he was a losing player who could afford to play at that level or a winning player who had a good job and didn't need to play poker for a living, but based on ME results I am inclined to believe the latter. Anyway, it probably takes a lot of talent and a lot of luck to win an 8000 player tournament.

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]
Claiming Gold isn't really a poker player is somewhat ridiculous. My take on the case seems to be the opposite of everyone else's. I don't see how you can possibly award $6 million dollars on the basis of a deal for which there's no paperwork/contract.

If Gold reneged on a deal then I hold him in as much contempt as anyone else but courts have to decide according to the law. You can't enforce these privately agreed deals, or as Sam Goldwyn memorably put it: "A verbal contract isn't worth the paper it's written on."

[/ QUOTE ]

Unless Sam Goldwyn is the judge then it doesn't matter what his toughts are....

I realize I only see what the other public sees but IIRC Gold called the other guy and said everything on doods voice mail.

I'm not really trying to make this a insult towards you but IMHO your comment doesn't say much for you does it?

Unless I misunderstood you then you're basically saying it's ok to lie to someone as long as it's not in writing.

Maybe you should find out how popular some person is around here for not following through with a coin flip.

The willingness to take someone at their word can be priceless.

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
wtf are you talking about? oral contracts ARE binding in many states...if it's over $500 and the job or performance can reasonably be completed in under a year

[/ QUOTE ]

I didn't say verbal contracts weren't valid, I said they weren't *enforcable*. How can you enforce a verbal contract between just two people who now dispute the details?

[/ QUOTE ]

Pretty easy when you've got an injuction on the money and a judge deciding who gets it.

PairTheBoard

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]
I didn't say verbal contracts weren't valid, I said they weren't *enforcable*. How can you enforce a verbal contract between just two people who now dispute the details?

[/ QUOTE ]

It happens all the time. You file a complaint, you try your case, and the judge or the jury happen to believe you. As with most factual disputes, this one involves a considerable amount of additional evidence: a voicemail from gold, a contract emailed from Bodog, and a transcript of an interview that Gold gave after the fact. Plus testimony from eyewitnesses.

Oral contracts are both valid and enforceable. As a matter of fact, I tried a jury case and won a $65 million verdict based primarily on an oral contract claim. That was under California law, not Nevada law, but there's absolutely no reason to think that this won't be enforced just because it's an oral contract.

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I didn't say verbal contracts weren't valid, I said they weren't *enforcable*. How can you enforce a verbal contract between just two people who now dispute the details?

[/ QUOTE ]

It happens all the time. You file a complaint, you try your case, and the judge or the jury happen to believe you. As with most factual disputes, this one involves a considerable amount of additional evidence: a voicemail from gold, a contract emailed from Bodog, and a transcript of an interview that Gold gave after the fact. Plus testimony from eyewitnesses.

[/ QUOTE ]

So you like Leyser's chances of collecting?


[ QUOTE ]

Oral contracts are both valid and enforceable. As a matter of fact, I tried a jury case and won a $65 million verdict based primarily on an oral contract claim. That was under California law, not Nevada law, but there's absolutely no reason to think that this won't be enforced just because it's an oral contract.

[/ QUOTE ]

BBV

Re: seif rips gold
 

Yes, I like Leyser's chances of collecting. WTF is BBV?

Re: seif rips gold
 

BBV = Brags, Beats & Variance forum

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]
In refusing to dissolve the Preliminary Injunction, Judge Hunt stated and it became obvious that he spent a great deal of time carefully reading Gold's affidavit, deposition testimony, pleadings, and transcripts of Gold's own radio interview and voice mail message.

[/ QUOTE ]

We're big time now baby!

Tuco.

Re: seif rips gold
 

Touche.

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
In refusing to dissolve the Preliminary Injunction, Judge Hunt stated and it became obvious that he spent a great deal of time carefully reading Gold's affidavit, deposition testimony, pleadings, and transcripts of Gold's own radio interview and voice mail message.

[/ QUOTE ]

We're big time now baby!

Tuco.

[/ QUOTE ]

They had a court reporter transcribe your podcast and they filed the full text of the whole show as an exhibit. Gold's attorneys weren't expecting it and resulted in some fireworks when they brought it up. I posted links to the transcript of Gold's testimony where they haggle over your podcast in the other post on this subject. If you have an interest in seeing your words in official court-reporterese, I could send you a copy of the PDF with your podcast typed up.

Re: seif rips gold
 

The article was vaguely not unintersting, and then this happened:

[ QUOTE ]
We have an amazing legal system in America that properly serves as an example to the rest of the world that in the vast majority of the cases both civil and criminal here, justice will prevail.

[/ QUOTE ]


I mean, Jesus [censored] Christ. What a sickeningly fatuous, stupid, uninformed, ridiculous thing to say.

The American justice system is the most inequitous, unfair and corrupt of it's kind wnywhere in the developed world. In fact, amongst 1st world countries, it without a shadow of a doubt the WORST justice system. And it's not even close.

Sorry, I don't know who this Seif guy is - many of you appear to hold him in some regard - but this paragrpah marks him down as a retarded, unthinking, simple-minded moron.

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]
The American justice system is the most inequitous, unfair and corrupt of it's kind wnywhere in the developed world. In fact, amongst 1st world countries, it without a shadow of a doubt the WORST justice system. And it's not even close.

[/ QUOTE ]

this paragraph is far stupider than anything seif wrote

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The American justice system is the most inequitous, unfair and corrupt of it's kind wnywhere in the developed world. In fact, amongst 1st world countries, it without a shadow of a doubt the WORST justice system. And it's not even close.

[/ QUOTE ]

this paragraph is far stupider than anything seif wrote

[/ QUOTE ]


You name me a 1st world justice system that is worse than America's, and I'll bow to your greater knowledge in a heartbeat.

But I'm not holding my breath.

I'm sure you can work out pot odds real well, but you clearly have fuckk all clue about much else.

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]
The American justice system is the most inequitous, unfair and corrupt of it's kind wnywhere in the developed world. In fact, amongst 1st world countries, it without a shadow of a doubt the WORST justice system. And it's not even close.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is an absurd claim. Italy, for instance, has significant levels of judicial corruption and more importantly perceived corruption. While I agree that Americans tend to just assume they have the best institutions, you weaken your credibility by overstating your case so strongly.

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]
You name me a 1st world justice system that is worse than America's, and I'll bow to your greater knowledge in a heartbeat.

But I'm not holding my breath.

I'm sure you can work out pot odds real well, but you clearly have fuckk all clue about much else.

[/ QUOTE ]

lol at making assumptions

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]

Sorry, I don't know who this Seif guy is - many of you appear to hold him in some regard

[/ QUOTE ]

Not if you saw him commentate on the Professional Poker Tour.

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The American justice system is the most inequitous, unfair and corrupt of it's kind wnywhere in the developed world. In fact, amongst 1st world countries, it without a shadow of a doubt the WORST justice system. And it's not even close.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is an absurd claim. Italy, for instance, has significant levels of judicial corruption and more importantly perceived corruption. While I agree that Americans tend to just assume they have the best institutions, you weaken your credibility by overstating your case so strongly.

[/ QUOTE ]


You are absolutly correct that Italy has a shockingly corrupt political system. Absolutely no doubt. Without doubt amongst the most corrupt and dysfunctional political system in the 1st world.

But the political system is not the same thing as the justice system, which in Italy, is perfectly average in terms of it's "fairness". The insanity of the political syatem does not, for the most part, spill over into the mainsatream justice system.

So I totally refute that I overstated my argument at all: America has by far the most unfair justice system of any 1st world country.

If Italy is the best you can come up with to counter that opinion, then your argument is lost.

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
You name me a 1st world justice system that is worse than America's, and I'll bow to your greater knowledge in a heartbeat.

But I'm not holding my breath.

I'm sure you can work out pot odds real well, but you clearly have fuckk all clue about much else.

[/ QUOTE ]

lol at making assumptions

[/ QUOTE ]


lol at making no sense

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
You name me a 1st world justice system that is worse than America's, and I'll bow to your greater knowledge in a heartbeat.

But I'm not holding my breath.

I'm sure you can work out pot odds real well, but you clearly have fuckk all clue about much else.

[/ QUOTE ]

lol at making assumptions

[/ QUOTE ]


lol at making no sense

[/ QUOTE ]


On edit: Oh, pot odds lol. Sorry. Good joke. Apologies for my lack of sense of humour.

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]
You name me a 1st world justice system that is worse than America's, and I'll bow to your greater knowledge in a heartbeat.

But I'm not holding my breath.

I'm sure you can work out pot odds real well, but you clearly have fuckk all clue about much else.

[/ QUOTE ]

lol at making assumptions

[/ QUOTE ]


lol at making no sense


On edit: Oh, pot odds lol. Sorry. Good joke. Apologies for my lack of sense of humour.

Re: seif rips gold
 

Drunken double post. Bed time.

Re: seif rips gold
 

good thread guys

Re: seif rips gold
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The American justice system is the most inequitous, unfair and corrupt of it's kind wnywhere in the developed world. In fact, amongst 1st world countries, it without a shadow of a doubt the WORST justice system. And it's not even close.

[/ QUOTE ]

this paragraph is far stupider than anything seif wrote

[/ QUOTE ]


You name me a 1st world justice system that is worse than America's, and I'll bow to your greater knowledge in a heartbeat.

But I'm not holding my breath.

I'm sure you can work out pot odds real well, but you clearly have fuckk all clue about much else.

[/ QUOTE ]
This is kind of ridiculous. There are plenty of countries where there basically exists no right to a fair trial and countries where the courts are blantantly corrupt. If you think US ourts are the worst in the world, you don't know much aobut the rest of the world.