6 max and shorter win rates
 

I know most people are fairly cagey about this but if anyone could post or pm with what they think are good/great/world class win rates i'd very much like to know

Also I looked for similar threads but didn't find anything on it if there is a thread on this can someone link me to it [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

I'm more than willing to post my own winrate but I didn't want it to degenerate into a brag thread or people making fun of me [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] (whichever was more appropriate)

Re: 6 max and shorter win rates
 

What limits are you talking about? I'm guessing primarily 25/50 - 150/300? From what I remember of you, you wouldn't need to worry about people making fun of you for a bad winrate.

I don't know that you'll get a lot of great responses in this thread, though.

Rob

Re: 6 max and shorter win rates
 

Any Really [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] I have small sample sizes from limits as small as 3/6 but predominantly I was looking at good winrates for limits of 10/20 and up. The win rate thing was just because I didn't want people to think this was a thinly veiled brag where I revealed my winrate and said "haha i'm soo good" I just wanted to know what very good mid limit players were making ./100

Re: 6 max and shorter win rates
 

Well I am not 'very good' or world class by any stretch of the imagination.......my w/r over my last 230K hands (some 5/10, lots of 10/20, some higher) is 1.2BB - like I said far from world class (and this is all 6-max, mainly 4-6 players - I do not play heads up) - AF

Re: 6 max and shorter win rates
 

IMHO
pretty good to good = 1bb/100 to 1.5 bb/100 in 20/40 to 50/100

good to great = 1.5bb/100 to 2bb/100 in 20/40 to 50/100

Worldclass superstar = 2bb+/100.

This is as far as twoplustwoers are concerned. Obviously if you are beating 20/40-50/100 for 1bb/100 you are a great player, just not amongst other twoplustwo high limit players.

BTW, if you run at 2bb+/100 over 100k hands at those limits in the last twelve months... I want lessons lol.

Re: 6 max and shorter win rates
 

1 is good, 2 is very good, 3 is exceptional.

Edit: that applies to the 10-20 to 20-40 type limits.

Re: 6 max and shorter win rates
 

Thanks Dean and Skilled I had a feeling that was about right. Obviously changes a bit for limits and amount of players in the game and how many tables you run but thats the sort of guideline figures I was thinking.

Big difference over 50/100 tho now as im a loser at those limits but have a near exceptional win rate at 25/50 and 30/60 *shrug*

Re: 6 max and shorter win rates
 

if you really have a near exceptional win rate at 25/50, you shouldn't be losing at 50/100 if you played at your same mental level. If anything, its all mental/bankroll/game selection. Half the ppl that used to play 50/100 play anything between 30/60 100/200+ from what I saw.
That being said tho, don't make the jump to 50/100 if you don't really believe you can win there, and unless you have like 40k bankroll (and a strong mental game). even thats pushing it, because swings of 30k can easily put most people on life tilt.

Re: 6 max and shorter win rates
 

Skilled, I think I could be a reasonable winning player at higher limits but the jump on absolute from 25/50 to 75/150 is massive in terms of the skill of the players. My best winrates are at 3 and 4 handed and often at 25/50 I can isolate the weaker players in this sort of game without much repercussion from the other pretty good players. At higher (on absolute at least) this simply doesnt happen. Also I think my style is slightly weaker than a lot of the other 25/50 players but this yields a very high win rate at mid limits where I get played back at a lot less. Some of the players that im certain I have a much higher win rate than at 25/50 seem better suited to be able to deal with this higher degree of aggression that the upper limits possess. That said with proper game selection I am fairly sure I could turn a 1bb/100 at 50/100.

Re: 6 max and shorter win rates
 

Buffsta, you are a very good player IMO but I'll recommend not jumping to any conclusions unless you have a really massive sample size. Especially at AP. I always seem to upper the limit to what a good sample size is. Right now, I think even 50k hands are simply not enough since your true winrate can easily fluctuate -+1.5/100 when you reach 100k.

I haven't been playing poker for long but it seems that every 6 months the consensus of what is a relatively decent win rate drops .5/100 Which sadly does reflect that actual changing nature of the games.

Re: 6 max and shorter win rates
 

The variance of a 1bb/100 WR is just hell on earth. I suggest staying where you can win at least 1.5bb/100. However, that is simply a personal opinion [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: 6 max and shorter win rates
 

How many hands do you consider enough before a near true winrate can be seen?

Re: 6 max and shorter win rates
 

[ QUOTE ]
How many hands do you consider enough before a near true winrate can be seen?

[/ QUOTE ]

You will never know your true winrate until you die so stop worrying about it for goodness' sake.

With a standard deviation of 18BB/100, if you want to know your winrate to within half a BB/100 i.e. plus or minus 0.25BB, working with two standard deviations, you'd need 1.6 million hands. Even then there's a 5% chance you're out.

Have your opponents changed over that time? Has your own play changed over that time?

If the answers to both these questions are no, you are a liar or misguided.
If the answer to either question is yes, your winrate is meaningless.


I maintain that it is much easier to know if you're playing a winning style, by looking at your play and your opponents play, than it is to calculate a winrate based on results. Get on with winning, or learning to win, and stop fretting over your winrate.


Guy.

Re: 6 max and shorter win rates
 

[ QUOTE ]
With a standard deviation of 18BB/100,

[/ QUOTE ]

Yea, shorthanded your std. dev. will be much higher than 18, as such, your winrate will not converge for 4million+ hands [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: 6 max and shorter win rates
 

[ QUOTE ]
1 is good, 2 is very good, 3 is exceptional.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd be surprised if there were more than 15-20 players total whose true winrate at 100/200+ is 1.5/100 or higher.