I think I know the answer, do you?
 

Villian is IRunPS. A regulars at 2/4 on Stars. He runs 27/8 preflop for me. Not innovative postflop, I generally find him predictable. I doubt he's a winner, if he is, it's because he can beat up on huge fish. I think this is a solid excersize in hand reading.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $4 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

CO ($394)
Button ($620.85)
SB ($347.95)
Hero ($840.70)
UTG ($356.05)
MP ($483)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls $4, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $20</font>, UTG calls $16.

Flop: ($42) J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $30</font>, UTG calls $30.

Turn: ($102) 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets $30</font>, Hero calls $30.

River: ($162) K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets $100</font>,


I think I know the answer, do you? And why?

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

Raise? I think he has KJ here a lot of the time. But I am a fish.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

river looks like a fold. he sounds predictable and not like a bluffer.

on the flop, he either called you with some piece of it or a T. he would take the free showdown on the river if he didnt have a straight since he'd have a hand with showdown value.

thus fold, and run better.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

yea fold

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

I think this is a call. At the time, I was 6 tabling and with the fast tables on Stars I wasn't able to think through it enough. But it seemed a little fishy. I tanked and folded. I asked him in the chat "why weren't you afraid of spades?"

Here's my thing. I beat all made hands &lt; straights, obviously we can get that out of the way immediatley. Now, he limped and called a raise. His mostlikely holdings are small pocket pairs, AXs, and two face cards. He can call my flop bet with any T, including QT. On the turn, his bet size is pretty weak. I would expect him to put more money in the pot with QT for sure, and even protect any ten. There is no doubt imo that my most likely holding on the turn was two spades. I can have AQ-AT suited in spades here after check calling. So why isn't he afraid of the river spade? I think his bet sizing leads me to believe that he's got air here- I can't see a naked ten trying to get value this way, and I don't think he flopped the nuts because I think he'd raise me on this flop.

I think I can call here profitably.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

so what do you think he calls flop with, that will not take a free showdown here?

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

Call, getting 2.62-1 he shows up with 2 pair or worse often enough here. Folding is the 2nd best option, and raising the worst.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

[ QUOTE ]
so what do you think he calls flop with, that will not take a free showdown here?

[/ QUOTE ]

QJ, AJ, A9, random small pairs 22-66, 76 suited.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

instacall

Great bluff card for him, and he's not imaginative so he'd probably at least be a little scared to value bet a straight here.

I don't see how you can do anything else.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

My guess is his weakish hand turned into a bluff. A9 for the win.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

ez fold

str8 or flush ez

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

People actually fold here? Wow.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

[ QUOTE ]
People actually fold here? Wow.

[/ QUOTE ]

Against 90% of opponents I wouldn't. This guy sounds like someone I could fold this too. That said, I would probably call at the table.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think you can call here profitably.

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

I have no idea why you don't think he will valuebet a T like this. People never fear backdoor flushes, ever.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

The average overthinking TAG calls here pretty often, and this is exactly why I get huge value in these spots with a rivered flush or a straight.

Totally player dependent. Alotta people call here because against a very uncreative player it's worth it (barely), but better players pick these spots for mainly for value imo.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

call.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

I would've tanked and called. for reasons aejones already stated.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Not innovative postflop, I generally find him predictable.

[/ QUOTE ]


If that is our read we should fold.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Not innovative postflop, I generally find him predictable.

[/ QUOTE ]


If that is our read we should fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

predicable bluffer maybe?

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

I call, the last time I folded a set was...wait I don't fold sets.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

river c/r shove is good, if he's tight enough to fold a straight.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

[ QUOTE ]
river c/r shove is good, if he's tight enough to fold a straight.

[/ QUOTE ]

Almost no one is tight enough to fold a straight there. There's no evidence in the OP that this guy is one of the few.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

[ QUOTE ]
There is no doubt imo that my most likely holding on the turn was two spades. I can have AQ-AT suited in spades here after check calling. So why isn't he afraid of the river spade?

[/ QUOTE ]
Cuz he has a flush?

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

I don't see why he isn't afraid of you having spades. Assuming he is a regular and he knows you are, wouldn't you mix check raising river with a flush into your possible hands, in which case I like a check raise bluff.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I don't see why he isn't afraid of you having spades. Assuming he is a regular and he knows you are, wouldn't you mix check raising river with a flush into your possible hands, in which case I like a check raise bluff.

[/ QUOTE ]

before tryin check/raise bluff on river I think two conditions need to be met.
1. as another poster pointed out he has to be capable of folding a straight made if he has 10.

2. both of you have to be deep enough where your river check/raise if full pot size (if not it will be much easier for him to call 10).

As far as callin, its close here. he could of somehow back doored a flush himself, or value-bettin straight and not givin you credit for back-door flush as most dont, especially in heads up pots where you are initial pre-flop aggressor.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
There is no doubt imo that my most likely holding on the turn was two spades. I can have AQ-AT suited in spades here after check calling. So why isn't he afraid of the river spade?

[/ QUOTE ]
Cuz he has a flush?

[/ QUOTE ]


He can have TX of spades, but I have the 8 of spades, so a certain number of pair and combo draws are out of the question.

That said, he can't have like KQ of spades or anything with like a gutshot becuase I think he checks the turn here always.

I think he is a predictable bluffer, I think thats why calling here is good, I think this line looks like "wtf my turn bet didn't work?"

I also think he checks behind even sometimes with a ten, or bets smaller.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

[ QUOTE ]

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $4 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

CO ($394)
Button ($620.85)
SB ($347.95)
Hero ($840.70)
UTG ($356.05)
MP ($483)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls $4, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, arrrrrrright baby pocket pair raise it up booya <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $20</font>, UTG calls $16.

Flop: ($42) J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
sick I am sick! set baby cant lose diss one time 2 bet it <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $30</font>, UTG calls $30.

Turn: ($102) 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
oh god did that fkker hit a straight? gawdamn... GWADAMAN Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets $30</font>, i got set i kaawl Hero calls $30.

River: ($162) K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
shttt i didnt boat up gawdamn u riverstars Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets $100</font>, 1 hundo dolla, shtt thats a lot of monie, oh well i got a set i can call here pot odds set is a good hand kawl KAWL


I think I know the answer, do you? And why? i have a set i kawl

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

QJss?

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

[ QUOTE ]
call.

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

[ QUOTE ]
QJss?

[/ QUOTE ]

QTs / JTs

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

results please

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

He had A9 suuuuuited, but not a flush, it was suited in clubs.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
There is no doubt imo that my most likely holding on the turn was two spades. I can have AQ-AT suited in spades here after check calling. So why isn't he afraid of the river spade?

[/ QUOTE ]
Cuz he has a flush?

[/ QUOTE ]


He can have TX of spades, but I have the 8 of spades, so a certain number of pair and combo draws are out of the question.

That said, he can't have like KQ of spades or anything with like a gutshot becuase I think he checks the turn here always.

I think he is a predictable bluffer, I think thats why calling here is good, I think this line looks like "wtf my turn bet didn't work?"

I also think he checks behind even sometimes with a ten, or bets smaller.

[/ QUOTE ]
Mostly, I just don't understand your logic, in the quoted statement, at all.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

Big Jim, I feel like he's peeling the flop with something marginal, and I believe largely that he thinks I'm folding to his turn bet a lot, even if the sizing is terrible on his part. If he's floating or calling the flop fairly light, I think he thinks he can take it away on the turn pretty often.

I think he bets when he has no showdown value on the end more than when he's got a ten.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Big Jim, I feel like he's peeling the flop with something marginal, and I believe largely that he thinks I'm folding to his turn bet a lot, even if the sizing is terrible on his part. If he's floating or calling the flop fairly light, I think he thinks he can take it away on the turn pretty often.

I think he bets when he has no showdown value on the end more than when he's got a ten.

[/ QUOTE ]
Oops. I misread it. I thought you were saying that HIS most likely holding was two spades, for some baffling reason.

FWIW, I think you very very rarely have spades, on the river, given your line, and I wouldn't be worried at all, with a T.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $4 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

CO ($394)
Button ($620.85)
SB ($347.95)
Hero ($840.70)
UTG ($356.05)
MP ($483)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls $4, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, arrrrrrright baby pocket pair raise it up booya <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $20</font>, UTG calls $16.

Flop: ($42) J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
sick I am sick! set baby cant lose diss one time 2 bet it <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $30</font>, UTG calls $30.

Turn: ($102) 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
oh god did that fkker hit a straight? gawdamn... GWADAMAN Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets $30</font>, i got set i kaawl Hero calls $30.

River: ($162) K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
shttt i didnt boat up gawdamn u riverstars Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets $100</font>, 1 hundo dolla, shtt thats a lot of monie, oh well i got a set i can call here pot odds set is a good hand kawl KAWL


I think I know the answer, do you? And why? i have a set i kawl

[/ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]

lol, so good.

I'd snap call the river.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

I fold...

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

sry, you guys are calling in the wrong places and folding in the wrong places. switch the two around and you guys (as a generality) will be bigger winners.

villain will have a straight here most of the time. AE, why isnt he afraid of a bdoor flush? because its a fricken bdoor flush and he has a straight. your line does not look like a straight, also.

if you c/pushed the river (suicide imo) then you're representing AQs or so.

Re: I think I know the answer, do you?
 

if i lose this i light $100 bill on fire cause i have so many of them

holla