Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

PokerStars 0.50/1.00 Hold'em (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is BB with J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP calls, CO calls, Button calls, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (5 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font>
SB checks, Hero...

Re: Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

I would bet, trying to protect my hand.

Re: Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

Bet. You should rarely call a bet with a weak hand in such a situation, but betting with it here is probably correct. In addition, being shorthanded it may devalue your opponent's holdings somewhat.

Re: Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

Bleh.

I would check and see what's going on while not being anywhere near excited about my hand or my prospects.

Re: Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

*grunch*
check call and reeval.

Nothing is folding here with 3 players behind you. All you are doing is building up the pot. I don't like a C/R here as we have no idea if we are good or not and will have a difficult decision on the river if the turn is blank.

Re: Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

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I would bet, trying to protect my hand.

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What hands are folding here that we would like to fold??

Then after that question.....

What hands are calling this bet that we want to stay in?

Re: Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

not a big pot, vulnerable to a flush draw and a small possibility of a straight draw. Wouldn't like to see your Jd or 3d outs hit on the turn. I c/c.

Re: Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

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Bleh.

I would check and see what's going on while not being anywhere near excited about my hand or my prospects.

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Re: Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

Check, always fold for 2, for 1 bet depends on the precise action. Raise, fold, or call are all plausible for one bet.

Re: Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

I would probably check this and see what the limpers do. If the button bets when checked to I'll probably go for the raise then. I don't like getting trapped by these BB hands. Someone gave me the advice to generally check these multiway to see what happens behind. With 2 less people I would play it more aggressively.

Re: Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

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Check, always fold for 2, for 1 bet depends on the precise action. Raise, fold, or call are all plausible for one bet.

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4 handed I would tend to bet, and certainly with just 2 opponents. With 5 to the flop, though, this is my plan

Re: Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

[ QUOTE ]
PokerStars 0.50/1.00 Hold'em (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is BB with J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP calls, CO calls, Button calls, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (5 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font>
SB checks, Hero...

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Hero checks. So let's see what can happen...

Situation 1:
Flop: (5 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font>
SB checks, Hero checks, MP checks, CO checks, <font color="#CC3333">Button bets</font>, SB folds, Hero...

Situation 2:
Flop: (5 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font>
SB checks, Hero checks, MP checks, CO checks, <font color="#CC3333">Button bets</font>, SB calls, Hero...

Situation 3:
Flop: (5 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font>
SB checks, Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP bets</font>, CO folds, Button folds, SB folds, Hero...

Situation 4:
Flop: (5 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font>
SB checks, Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP bets</font>, CO calls, Button folds, SB calls, Hero...

Re: Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

1. Raise

2. Call

3. Call

4. Close between call and fold. I lean fold.

Re: Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

[ QUOTE ]
1. Raise

2. Call

3. Call

4. Close between call and fold. I lean fold.

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I agree on 1 &amp; 2, but for 3 why aren't we raising here? It is very similar to situation 1. Unless we have reads I am raising here. 4 seems like more call than fold. We are getting nice odds to peel here. Why shouldn't we see a card and re-evaluate?

Edit: OK, 3 is not that similar to one, but with only me and villain left I am thinking I have a shot at this pot and my raise is an attempt to take control of the hand and better define his holding. If he re-raises me I think I can let it go right there.

Re: Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

This flop is right in the happy zone for the limpers. I'd check and see what develops.

Re: Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

Situation 1 you raise because button will probably stab with a lot of hands, and people are less likely to slowplay on this particular board, and with all the draws you wouldn't mind getting it HU considering how many cards can beat you if everyone stays in.

2 you're still likely to have the best hand but less likely to fold people with a raise (SB almost always has a draw, so raising won't protect you from that draw coming in), so you call and reevaluate on the turn.

3 there's still a good chance you're best and most of the field has folded already, so again you're calling/reevaluating

4 you almost certainly don't have the best hand, and you're only barely getting odds on a 5-outer, and pretty much all of your outs except the non-diamond 3s are seriously tainted, and there are a million redraws to dodge on the river, so I'd fold but it seems close.

Re: Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

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Edit: OK, 3 is not that similar to one, but with only me and villain left I am thinking I have a shot at this pot and my raise is an attempt to take control of the hand and better define his holding.

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This is exactly the type of hand that doesn't want the betting lead, and exactly the type of board where bets and raises aren't necessarily going to mean that much.

Re: Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

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[ QUOTE ]
Edit: OK, 3 is not that similar to one, but with only me and villain left I am thinking I have a shot at this pot and my raise is an attempt to take control of the hand and better define his holding.

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This is exactly the type of hand that doesn't want the betting lead, and exactly the type of board where bets and raises aren't necessarily going to mean that much.

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You answered my question before I could ask it. Basically the big difference between 1 and 3 is position? Good response Xhad, answered quite a few questions for me.

Re: Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

The position of the bettor, and also the fact that the main reason to raise the flop is to get it HU and in situation 3 it that will usually happen anyway.

Re: Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

Here's the real hand:

PokerStars 0.50/1.00 Hold'em (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is BB with J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP calls, CO calls, Button calls, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (5 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font>
SB checks, Hero checks, MP checks, CO checks, <font color="#CC3333">Button bets</font>, SB folds, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, MP folds, CO folds, Button calls.

What will happen on the turn? What cards will make you bet-call? Bet-fold? Check-call? Check-fold? Bet-3Bet?

Re: Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

I'm having a hard time thinking of a card that comes that makes me fold this. I'm committed to a showdown at this point unless I had a read that he was passive. My read here would matter more than the card.

I could see checking and calling down any A though.

Re: Check-up hand - TPWK from BB in 5-handed pot
 

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I'm having a hard time thinking of a card that comes that makes me fold this.

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What about a diamond, particularly one that also completes a straight?