3-6 Stud/8 - Who Wins Which Half?
 

I thought this stud/8 hand I played last night was interesting. I was about 75% sure my hand was good for half the pot, but I wasn't sure which half.

7 Card Stud High-Low ($3/$6), Ante $0.25, Bring-In $1 (converter)

3rd Street - (0.58 SB)

Seat 1: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___raises
Hero: 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___calls
Seat 3: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___calls
Seat 4: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 5: xx xx 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___brings-in___folds
Seat 7: xx xx 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 8: xx xx 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___folds

4th Street - (3.92 SB)

Seat 1: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___bets
Hero: 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___calls
Seat 3: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___calls

5th Street - (3.46 BB)

Seat 1: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___bets___raises___calls
Hero: 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___raises___raises
Seat 3: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___calls___calls

6th Street - (15.46 BB)

Seat 1: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___calls___calls___calls
Hero: 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___raises___raises
Seat 3: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___bets___raises___calls

River - (27.46 BB)

Seat 1: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] xx___calls___disconnected and is all-in
Hero: 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___raises
Seat 3: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] xx___bets___calls

Total pot: (32.46 BB)


My third-street call was somewhat loose, especially given that a six was out, but I thought it played itself on later streets.

What's your read on who won what?

(And do you think Seat 1's disconnect on the river was a leetle bit suspicious?)

Re: 3-6 Stud/8 - Who Wins Which Half?
 

re: seat 1's disconnect: SInce he knows it is only one more bet, then it is stupid, not suspicious, since he is already into the pot for 10 big bets.

If he disconnected during the raising war on 6th, then that would make more 'sense'.

T

Re: 3-6 Stud/8 - Who Wins Which Half?
 

I think 3rd street is fine. If this was on PP then an Ace raising means exactly nothing to me. Obviously everything else is also good.

I would put the 1 Seat on two pair, three or a kind or something like that.

I have no idea what Seat 3 is betting 6th with. Suited clubs with a nine doesnt doesnt work, Aces up is a possiblity but I would bet he has something huge...gotta have one or two nines in the hole or otherwise he is just batshit insane.

I would say you at least won the low...right? My guess would be that since you posted this the guy had a wheel draw with a flush draw or something...and then made a low or flush? and then maybe you won the high? or got scooped?

It really doesnt matter though because your play was perfectly fine and obviously that is what is important.

Re: 3-6 Stud/8 - Who Wins Which Half?
 

Re Disconnect:

On Pokerstars high speed tables I have timed out while trying to make hard decisions. When that happens, the screen msg says "Disconnect" even tho I'm still there. (But my hand is folded.)

In other situations, if I'm not mistaken, "Disconnected" players in a hand are treated as "All-In."

If it's possible to "Disconnect" deliberately to put yourself in an "All-In" status, then that seems to me a bad rule. It obviously enables a player to avoid further risk while maintaining a stake in the hand. I wld think the site cld tell the difference btwn a time-out and a true disconnect. Even a true disconnect cld be suspicious depending on the size of the pot, the cards held, and whether the player had any history in this regard.

Re: 3-6 Stud/8 - Who Wins Which Half?
 

I'm not going to post the result yet, but I will coyly say that it was what I thought the least likely of all the possibilities. I was seriously wondering how the heck I could have misread the other players' hands so badly.

Re: 3-6 Stud/8 - Who Wins Which Half?
 

In order to disconnect on Stars, and keep equity in the pot, you must actually be disconnected from the server, not be timed out.

This has happened to me once during a thunder storm. I caught my flush, and incurred the wrath of the losing players who thought I shot an angle.

Pstars appears to take this seriously, and if you have any doubts, email support the game number, and they will check it out.

this link has an example of a PStars response.
http://groups.google.com/groups?thre...ing.google.com

T

Re: 3-6 Stud/8 - Who Wins Which Half?
 

how do these guys usually play?

i'm gonna take a stab anyway, but it's as much guesswork as anythg else!

seat 1... has QT in the hole for a str8 on 5th, or KK in the hole for trips K's that didn't improve.
seat 3... has A9 in the hole for 9's full of aces on 6th.

and u got the low?

Re: 3-6 Stud/8 - Who Wins Which Half?
 

alan does seat 3 have to be full to make a bet into two opponents like this?

if so then i dont really like jamming it this hard, because it looks like seat 1 is calling for low pot equity, and has a significant chance to improve and leave you getting none of this. the river probably made him miss, but in theory, if he has a wheel draw, he's going to make his hand enough on the river to make your play kind of loose unless villains play particularly laggy.

Re: 3-6 Stud/8 - Who Wins Which Half?
 

I think you likely scooped the pot.

The thing that stuck out to me was why no raise on 4th? I like putting the A 5 to a decision with that type of 2way hand. I like raising 4th and seeing if the A 5 would either fold or repop it and get rid of the A K high. Even if the both call, you're building a nice big pot with all kinds of equity.

Re: 3-6 Stud/8 - Who Wins Which Half?
 

I'm not coming up with a scenario that actually makes sense. If you failed to take low, then whoever beat you is probably not a good player. If the guy with open Nines didn't beat you with a full house, he's probably not a good player. If the guy with AKJ beat you with a Broadway straight, he's probably not a good player.

I wouldn't be all that surprised if you got shut out on this hand. Maybe seat 1 had Broadway and the other guy got really optimistic with a wheel draw. Who knows? I gave up on reading hands years ago.

Re: 3-6 Stud/8 - Who Wins Which Half?
 

You think that seat 1 was jamming fifth because he liked his low possibilities?

RESULTS (Re: 3-6 Stud/8 - Who Wins Which Half?)
 

Total pot $195 Main pot $2. Side pot-1 $178. Side pot-2 $12. | Rake $3

Seat 1: [Th Ad As Kd Jc 3c 8s]

Hero: [4h 5c 7h 6d 2c 8h 7s] (HI: a straight, Four to Eight; LO: 7,6,5,4,2)

Seat 3: [4d 2d Ac 5h 9s 9c Qs]

Seat 6: [4s 7c Tc Kc 5s 2h Qd]



(Seat 6 was disconnect-all-in for the bring-in, and his hand went nowhere. The hand converter doesn't seem to deal with all-ins.)

My thinking was this: I put Seat 1 on a pair of aces, given his coming out swinging on fourth and fifth when he caught two bricks. This meant that he had no possible low, and so his hand was of essentially no account as a threat to my low hand. I expected him to show down a hand like aces up.

Seat 3 just called on the early streets. While I didn't like a straight draw against two wheel cards and a high hand on fourth street (too much likelihood of drawing to half a pot), on fifth, when Seat 3 bricked, I liked my hand a lot better, thinking I was ahead for low and a straight card was likely a scoop out.

On sixth street my straight got there ... and Seat 3 went nuts. I changed my read on his hand from "busted low draw" to "full house" or maybe "trip nines". If he was full, my low was good. If he had a lesser high hand, my low was good and so was my straight. Almost any low hand he made on the river, if that was his hand, would beat mine ... but my straight would likely be good.

In short, I thought I was in the relatively happy situation of being a strong favorite to win half of a large pot, although there was a noticeable chance I would be chopped up.

Given the sixth street action, I thought there was no chance I would scoop. I was wrong.

Re: RESULTS (Re: 3-6 Stud/8 - Who Wins Which Half?)
 

Yeah, spot on

Good game selection [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: 3-6 Stud/8 - Who Wins Which Half?
 

[ QUOTE ]
You think that seat 1 was jamming fifth because he liked his low possibilities?

[/ QUOTE ]

sorry Andy.

I meant to say does seat 1 have to be full?

and seat 3 looks like he has the low draw.

Re: 3-6 Stud/8 - Who Wins Which Half?
 

The reason I don't like repopping on fourth is that, given seat 3's board, "putting him to a decision" generally results in a very easy decision to call. The only hand I'm ahead of for low is (8 x)A 5, and supposing I do make my straight I either have the roughest of eights or the roughest of sevens.

It's an entirely different kettle of fish on fifth street, with the only made low plus an OESD, and on sixth with the only made low and a straight.

Re: 3-6 Stud/8 - Who Wins Which Half?
 

I would guess you'd scoop, bad scenario would be you getting low and seat 3 with a boat.

However, since you posted this hand I'm guessing it was some sort of doomsday scenario where seat 1 made a higher straight than you and seat 3 made some dumb 6 or 7 low better than yours somehow. This seems super unlikely since it requires both opponents to have really weird hole cards and to have played the hand completely illogically.

Re: 3-6 Stud/8 - Who Wins Which Half?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I would guess you'd scoop, bad scenario would be you getting low and seat 3 with a boat.

However, since you posted this hand I'm guessing it was some sort of doomsday scenario where seat 1 made a higher straight than you and seat 3 made some dumb 6 or 7 low better than yours somehow. This seems super unlikely since it requires both opponents to have really weird hole cards and to have played the hand completely illogically.

[/ QUOTE ]

If so, then why would I post it here rather than in BBV?

I'm not asking if I played the hand correctly; there was never any doubt in my mind that I did.

I posted it as a problem in hand-reading.